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Evening Standard-city Lives


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Nirpal Dhaliwal writes a decent article summing up the 20-35 generation as resigned to 'never being able to afford a house and the maturity that goes with it and hence live in 'permanent, profligate semi-adolescence'. He says lots of people have adopted the live now, bankrupt later philosophy as the 'thought of old-aged penury isn't as scary as the feeling that your youth is passing you by' and that 'mortgages, pensions and the dreary, lifelong slog that goes with them can wait until the last of your hopes and joie de vivre have died'.

Cheerful stuff, but he has a point. Lastly, he states that most of the IPOD generation are in a 'catch 22 situation of being too poor to make responsibility worthwhile, and hence too irresponsible to ever get a stab at getting rich'. I'm not convinced over this last statement but some valid points being made here. High house prices are drastically affecting the attitudes of upcoming generations and giving some a damn good excuse to extend the slack into later and later life.

Edited by Badger
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Nirpal Dhaliwal writes a decent article summing up the 20-35 generation as resigned to 'never being able to afford a house and the maturity that goes with it and hence live in 'permanent, profligate semi-adolescence'. He says lots of people have adopted the live now, bankrupt later philosophy as the 'thought of old-aged penury isn't as scary as the feeling that your youth is passing you by' and that 'mortgages, pensions and the dreary, lifelong slog that goes with them can wait until the last of your hopes and joie de vivre have died'.

Cheerful stuff, but he has a point. Lastly, he states that most of the IPOD generation are in a 'catch 22 situation of being too poor to make responsibility worthwhile, and hence too irresponsible to ever get a stab at getting rich'. I'm not convinced over this last statement but some valid points being made here. High house prices are drastically affecting the attitudes of upcoming generations and giving some a damn good excuse to extend the slack into later and later life.

A very fine appraisal of the mentality of this IPOD generation. Welcome to the new reality of this debt laden society of ours. I have given up ever owning my own house. There are far too many hoops to go through. Home ownership, to me is an unaffordable proposition. So let's party.

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Nirpal Dhaliwal writes a decent article summing up the 20-35 generation as resigned to 'never being able to afford a house and the maturity that goes with it and hence live in 'permanent, profligate semi-adolescence'. He says lots of people have adopted the live now, bankrupt later philosophy as the 'thought of old-aged penury isn't as scary as the feeling that your youth is passing you by' and that 'mortgages, pensions and the dreary, lifelong slog that goes with them can wait until the last of your hopes and joie de vivre have died'.

Cheerful stuff, but he has a point. Lastly, he states that most of the IPOD generation are in a 'catch 22 situation of being too poor to make responsibility worthwhile, and hence too irresponsible to ever get a stab at getting rich'. I'm not convinced over this last statement but some valid points being made here. High house prices are drastically affecting the attitudes of upcoming generations and giving some a damn good excuse to extend the slack into later and later life.

This seems to identify very clearly the sweeping sociodemographic change that's occuring . Though 'too irresponsible' is the wrong phrase. 'Realistic' or 'resigned' seems more appropriate to me. And I think many IPODs do not aspire to getting rich, just to being comfortably off, able to afford a home and one or two children, because they've seen the psychological harm that capitalism has done to their parents' generation, with the high divorce rate and so forth.

I'd say that the IPODs are being infantilised by much of the older generation and the press. Sounds like Dhaliwal's article is quite a bit more understanding and sympathetic than most.

Edited by bugged bunny
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Why is mortgage enslavement considered a benefifical rite of passage? Rather than give people a desire to better themselves, I find mortgage enslavement breed cowering wrecks clinging to pointless jobs they hate by their fingernails out of fear of reposession and their debt-infested life collapsing.

The young would be a far more creative, enterprising and dynamic bunch if basic, quality accomodation was cheap, unstressful and and easy to come by.

It's wierd how in advanced capitalism the basics of life are ever harder to obtain, evermore expesnive. It's not just shelter - the decent wholesome food we evolved over millions of years to eat is now a premium-rate organic luxury. And transport - cheap comprehensive public transport hardly exists anywhere, people now have longer commutes from places cheap to live no where near employment, so they shell out more for reliable cars. And clothes - you can't turn up for work in an ill-fitting suit looking like a 70s detective but have to look the part. And so on and so forth.

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It's wierd how in advanced capitalism the basics of life are ever harder to obtain, evermore expesnive. It's not just shelter - the decent wholesome food we evolved over millions of years to eat is now a premium-rate organic luxury. And transport - cheap comprehensive public transport hardly exists anywhere, people now have longer commutes from places cheap to live no where near employment, so they shell out more for reliable cars. And clothes - you can't turn up for work in an ill-fitting suit looking like a 70s detective but have to look the part. And so on and so forth.

Yes, quality of life has plummetted. It's a shame that so many people seem so oblivious, until the stress of life on the treadmill finally pushes them over the edge and makes them physically or mentally ill, or both. Then they are forced to step back, reassess and see things for what they really are.

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I have to agree with Nirpal with regards to the attitudes of upcoming generations changing.

With me being in this so-called Ipod generation I guess I have a changing attitude to the same 24 year olds in decades gone by.

After leaving school at 18 with A-levels and not a penny to my name, I was successful in my application for an engineering apprenticeship and after a years training and 5 years "on the tools" I've recently been promoted to Team Manager, 32k a year.

I've worked by backside off to get where I am and after wise investments in the stock market etc my savings stand at £50k.

I think where my attitude has changed from others is that I'm sitting the housing market out, I refuse to hand over my hard earned savings to some Muppet who thinks buying a house and living in it for 3 or 4 years constitutes a "wise investment"

What I say to the 30 - 50 year olds is B*llocks to the lot of you, I'm more than happy to sit this out with sizeable savings and watch your "investments" devalue drastically over the next few years.

We shall see how wise your investments really are.

You have priced me out of this housing market, if you were in my shoes you would think that the salary I’m on and the savings I have would have been enough for a decent home.

Back in "your day" it was, but your greed and "investment decisions" have priced out the Ipod generation so much so that attitudes are changing.

I hope you get everything you deserve, I cannot believe that these people have the bare faced cheek to expect the younger generation to take on astronomical amounts of debt for vastly overpriced homes, yes that’s right homes, not "investments" or "properties" but homes; homes that others could be enjoying without a millstone round their neck that’s 3 times as big as the one you had round your neck when you were younger.

I do not expect to have an easy life, I know that hard work does pay off, but when your in my position and see your generation screwing me I will not shed a tear for you when it all goes wrong.

Good luck

Favre.

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I have to agree with Nirpal with regards to the attitudes of upcoming generations changing.

With me being in this so-called Ipod generation I guess I have a changing attitude to the same 24 year olds in decades gone by.

After leaving school at 18 with A-levels and not a penny to my name, I was successful in my application for an engineering apprenticeship and after a years training and 5 years "on the tools" I've recently been promoted to Team Manager, 32k a year.

I've worked by backside off to get where I am and after wise investments in the stock market etc my savings stand at £50k.

I think where my attitude has changed from others is that I'm sitting the housing market out, I refuse to hand over my hard earned savings to some Muppet who thinks buying a house and living in it for 3 or 4 years constitutes a "wise investment"

What I say to the 30 - 50 year olds is B*llocks to the lot of you, I'm more than happy to sit this out with sizeable savings and watch your "investments" devalue drastically over the next few years.

We shall see how wise your investments really are.

You have priced me out of this housing market, if you were in my shoes you would think that the salary I’m on and the savings I have would have been enough for a decent home.

Back in "your day" it was, but your greed and "investment decisions" have priced out the Ipod generation so much so that attitudes are changing.

I hope you get everything you deserve, I cannot believe that these people have the bare faced cheek to expect the younger generation to take on astronomical amounts of debt for vastly overpriced homes, yes that’s right homes, not "investments" or "properties" but homes; homes that others could be enjoying without a millstone round their neck that’s 3 times as big as the one you had round your neck when you were younger.

I do not expect to have an easy life, I know that hard work does pay off, but when your in my position and see your generation screwing me I will not shed a tear for you when it all goes wrong.

Good luck

Favre.

An excellent post...good luck with your endeavours...

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You should blame your parents for voting for the Labour Party.

And if you vote for the Labour Party, or the Liberals then you too will deserve little sympathy also.

Todays housing problem has the blame resting fairly and squarely on the shoulders of the so called prudent chancellor, and the Labour Party who have in a single decade reduced this nation to that of a third world melting pot.

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No, Laurejon , your usual political astuteness has deserted you on this one.....

The housing boom would've occurred whichever party was in power.....so would the war in Iraq

Only difference is that under the Tories there'd have been less tax and spend.....No stealth taxes....

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And clothes - you can't turn up for work in an ill-fitting suit looking like a 70s detective but have to look the part. And so on and so forth.

I think my office would be a much better place to work if everyone dressed like the cast of Life on Mars.

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I have to agree with the original post. I'm still saving extremely hard waiting for house prices to normalise. Not that I can do any more than that given that I was priced out of buying a caravan two years ago!

A lot of my friend who had savings have blown the lot on foreign holidays, nights out, fast cars and gadgets. They all gave up saving because they honestly think house prices will continue to soar in price so they've adopted a "You only live once" attitude to life and are mostly 10-15k in debt.

I think the most annoying thing is that home owners I work with all think I'm bone idle and want too much for my first house (they seem oblivious that I need another 30k of savings to be able to buy a rathole in a bad area) and my spendaholic friends think I'm a mug staying inside not spending any money.

Oh well eh?

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I have to agree with Nirpal with regards to the attitudes of upcoming generations changing.

With me being in this so-called Ipod generation I guess I have a changing attitude to the same 24 year olds in decades gone by.

After leaving school at 18 with A-levels and not a penny to my name, I was successful in my application for an engineering apprenticeship and after a years training and 5 years "on the tools" I've recently been promoted to Team Manager, 32k a year.

I've worked by backside off to get where I am and after wise investments in the stock market etc my savings stand at £50k.

I think where my attitude has changed from others is that I'm sitting the housing market out, I refuse to hand over my hard earned savings to some Muppet who thinks buying a house and living in it for 3 or 4 years constitutes a "wise investment"

What I say to the 30 - 50 year olds is B*llocks to the lot of you, I'm more than happy to sit this out with sizeable savings and watch your "investments" devalue drastically over the next few years.

We shall see how wise your investments really are.

You have priced me out of this housing market, if you were in my sho

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I also hail from the iPod generation and find that it is obscenely difficult for the young these days. University fees, pension (or lack thereof), house prices, job outsourcing, illegal immigration, terrorism, etc, are just some of the things that affect our daily lives. However, despite having such uncertainties, the iPod generation has lots of new opportunities. Internet, outward migration, easy travel, HSE, technology in general, better knowledge of environmental risks, etc.

Gone are the days when your mortgage payment was in pennies. But similarly gone are the days when women and ethnic minorities had no rights. I do not know which generation had it sweet, and I think constantly blaming the baby boomers is a bit short sighted. Don't forget our kids shall be blaming us too for having polluted their earth beyond recognition.

Just my 2p.

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Our generation is being infantilised by the housing boom...and the boomers love to moan at us for being lazy and feckless, not at all like them. Boomers think they invented hard work...HAH...B0LL0cks!!

Boomers, listen to the truth: you were born after the war, you have NEVER had it tough, you are a generation of spoilt consumers who have ruined the planet, destroyed morality with your self-indulgent 60's revolution, created a messed-up society (yes...it's your fault! Do you get it now!?! The fact that you are responsible?), and are no busy cocooning yourselves in your wealth, denying youngsters a fair chance with one hand whilst berating them for being lazy slackers with the other.

Our generation is being infantilised by the housing boom...and the boomers love to moan at us for being lazy and feckless, not at all like them. Boomers think they invented hard work...HAH...B0LL0cks!!

Boomers, listen to the truth: you were born after the war, you have NEVER had it tough, you are a generation of spoilt consumers who have ruined the planet, destroyed morality with your self-indulgent 60's revolution, created a messed-up society (yes...it's your fault! Do you get it now!?! The fact that you are responsible?), and are no busy cocooning yourselves in your wealth, denying youngsters a fair chance with one hand whilst berating them for being lazy slackers with the other.

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Have to agree with this. Since being unable/unwilling to buy, I've descended into a melee of late nights, E, clubbing, going to lots of gigs and generally acting like a teenager, and I'm 31.

Dunno if this is a serious post, but I can imagine it typifies many IPODs out there. But how much money does the late nights cost? If it was totalled up over a month, I bet many IPODs would be spending a fortune. Not that it would make property more affordable but I would personally use the money for other purposes and cut the binging down.

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but if average property is six times the average salary, most wouldn't stand a chance of getting a house anyway - binge or no binge. that is surely the point here.

True. But spending at least £100-200 a month binging isn't going to help them. Even if they don't save for a deposit, witha little moderation, that money could go to better things.

Travel/investment/self-employment/migration...

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You should blame your parents for voting for the Labour Party.

And if you vote for the Labour Party, or the Liberals then you too will deserve little sympathy also.

Todays housing problem has the blame resting fairly and squarely on the shoulders of the so called prudent chancellor, and the Labour Party who have in a single decade reduced this nation to that of a third world melting pot.

It's true that nine years of the Labour Party has been a disaster for the economy. They have pandered to the wants and greed of many. They have helped to create probably the largest boom in history. To a large extent, this has been based on borrowed money and people getting into catastophic debt.

The end result is probably a fourway split:

A.The Greed Category. The ones driven by greed who don't give a stuff about the rest of the population, or the environment for that matter.
B. The fear Category. The ones driven by fear who are getting themselves into dire debt situations just to buy the basics (modest house, car etc.)
C. The 'Care Free' Category. The ones who have given up worrying about houses and pensions and are living for today.
D. The sensible category. The ones who don't fit into the above three catagories. Some people have paid for their homes years ago and are just living normal lives, not getting into serious debt ant not seeking to build their own personal btl empire. Others, who have not yet bought an house, are saving and waiting patiently until they become more affordable. Probably many people who post on this forum fit into the last catagory.

In the short term, groups A and C will continue to live it up. However, I give it five years at the most before the miricle economy collapses into the fifteen year slump.

In the medium term, group B will be the group that suffers most. However, many in group A will not get away scott free.

In the long term, group C will suffer the most, assuming that groups A and B have time to recover from the impending medium term.

This is the result of nearly ten years of Labour. An economy based on greed, fear, debt and fecklessness. What a wasted opportunity!

However, I'm not sure that the Conservatives would have done any better

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Guest wrongmove

You should blame your parents for voting for the Labour Party.

And if you vote for the Labour Party, or the Liberals then you too will deserve little sympathy also.

Todays housing problem has the blame resting fairly and squarely on the shoulders of the so called prudent chancellor, and the Labour Party who have in a single decade reduced this nation to that of a third world melting pot.

:P

There has only ever been one housing boom so big that nominal prices actually dropped in the ensuing bust.

Who was in power then ? Let me think.......

Nominal house price graph (not adjusted for inflation)

nomlin.png

post-210-1159002688_thumb.jpg

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  • 441 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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