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Realistbear

More Women Going Bankrupt - Rising Household Bills

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The doom mongers in the press are having a good start to the week:

http://business.guardian.co.uk/story/0,,1855090,00.html

Female bankruptcy levels on the up

Monday August 21, 2006
Guardian Unlimited
A growing number of women are becoming bankrupt as a result of credit card debts and rising household bills, figures showed today.
The proportion of women bankrupts has risen from 42% to 44% over the past year, according to accountants Wilkins Kennedy, which surveyed 1,200 bankrupts across England and Wales. Since 2002, the figure has risen from 32% to 42%...../
"It is difficult to see the situation getting any better because so
many people are already teetering on the brink of the precipice,"
he said. "A modest rise in interest rates or a fall in income could be enough to tip them over the edge."
Mr Stevens said the problem stemmed from the fact that women's salaries have failed to keep up with their need to be financially independent. Research by Halifax shows the proportion of new mortgages taken out by single women has more than doubled in the last 20 years and now accounts for 23% of the total market.
"Women are taking on a much greater debt burden than they used to, but their income still lags behind," Mr Stevens said.

Lagging incomes is the overriding reason why we get HPCs, IMO.

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The proportion of women bankrupts has risen from 42% to 44% over the past year, according to accountants Wilkins Kennedy, which surveyed 1,200 bankrupts across England and Wales. Since 2002, the figure has risen from 32% to 42%.....

Why is the proportion relevant? Presumably the proportion of men bankrupts has fallen from 68% to 58% since 2002... :ph34r:

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Why is the proportion relevant? Presumably the proportion of men bankrupts has fallen from 68% to 58% since 2002... :ph34r:

Generation - X, is going to pay the price for wanting it all. This should not be news, this is merely the product of a new generation of women, who grew up to be independent financially, realising they have spent way more than they can afford.

#scoobydoo#

:ph34r:

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Generation - X, is going to pay the price for wanting it all. This should not be news, this is merely the product of a new generation of women, who grew up to be independent financially, realising they have spent way more than they can afford.

#scoobydoo#

:ph34r:

But the proportion of women bankrupts could be rising even if fewer went bankrupt than last year. Because the survey only asked 1200 bankrupts and no non-bankrupts then it cannot be used to support the claim that more women are going bankrupt. Lazy journalism and shoddy statistics...

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But the proportion of women bankrupts could be rising even if fewer went bankrupt than last year. Because the survey only asked 1200 bankrupts and no non-bankrupts then it cannot be used to support the claim that more women are going bankrupt. Lazy journalism and shoddy statistics...

I agree, the proportion is irrelevant, all I meant was that the female proportion will increase as the new generations of financially independent women become more dominant in society.

#scoobydoo#

:ph34r:

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The main point of the article, IMO, was the fact that the Miracle Economy that is based on borrowing is pushing the sheeple off the ledge in ever growing numbers and even household bills are enough to do it:

QUOTE

"It is difficult to see the situation getting any better because so many people are already teetering on the brink of the precipice," he said. "A modest rise in interest rates or a fall in income could be enough to tip them over the edge."

Merv knows that the tipping point has been reached and the government will have the same decision to make as Ben at the Fed. Do you kill inflation and go for longer term recovery or do you keep inflating the bubble with accomodative rates and buy time and set the economy up for disaster in the longer term.

Edited by Realistbear

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The main point of the article, IMO, was the fact that the Miracle Economy that is based on borrowing is pushing the sheeple off the ledge in ever growing numbers and even household bills are enough to do it:

QUOTE

"It is difficult to see the situation getting any better because so many people are already teetering on the brink of the precipice," he said. "A modest rise in interest rates or a fall in income could be enough to tip them over the edge."

Merv knows that the tipping point has been reached and the government will have the same decision to make as Ben at the Fed. Do you kill inflation and go for longer term recovery or do you keep inflating the bubble with accomodative rates and buy time and set the economy up for disaster in the longer term.

The tipping point has already been passed, many people are depending on cheap credit to maintain their lifestlyes.

#scoobydoo#

:ph34r:

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The main point of the article, IMO, was the fact that the Miracle Economy that is based on borrowing is pushing the sheeple off the ledge in ever growing numbers

The data doesn't allow you to conclude that.

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The data doesn't allow you to conclude that.

Its probably opinion from someone who knows the debt business. Much like a stock analyst suggesting a downturn based on fundamentals or stochastic data. RICS sometimes do this based on traffic flow in and out of EA offices. IN the debt business it is widely known that there is a lot of stress in the market with a recent hiring campaign for CAB. Bankruptrcy levels have been rising recently and this particular debt expert is picking up on what most of us already know. I suppose all experts in the field should really have a warning at the foot of their artcioles to the effect that they are expressing an opinion based on their own research and that each person should undertake their own research and not rely on the data presented? Stock analysts do this by stating that stocks go up and they go down. <_<

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Can't say I'm surprised by this. There was a report last week about how many pairs of shoes women have and how they are more importan than paying the bills. I know that's a generalisation and not all women are like this, but I don't know one women at my work place of a similar age that "can be arsed" with savings or a pension. I just feel sorry for the poor sod that marries them.

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Much like a stock analyst suggesting a downturn based on fundamentals or stochastic data.

No, its like me interviewing 1200 people who've broken their leg last year and finding that a higher proportion were women than when I did the same survey the previous year... then concluding that the total number of women breaking their legs was rising YoY. I'm not saying the bankruptcy figures aren't rising (in fact Government data says they are) but you cannot draw that conclusion from this data, which is what the journo was trying to do.

Edited by IamSpartacus

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LOOKS PROPHETIC now!

Based on what data? Can you show evidence that more repossessions are occuring for female BTL investors? Or are you just taking a story that vaguely supports your opinion and drawing wild conclusions?

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No, its like me interviewing 1200 people who've broken their leg last year and finding that a higher proportion were women than when I did the same survey the previous year... then concluding that the total number of women breaking their legs was rising YoY. I'm not saying the bankruptcy figures aren't rising (in fact Government data says they are) but you cannot draw that conclusion from this data, which is what the journo was trying to do.

Like Mori or Gallup, its a sampling. As you can imagine, its impractical to interview all women but a significant number, 1200, does reveal trends. IMO, its all about the knife edge that people are on and that women are not immune and that even household bills can tip them over the edge. It all adds to the turning sentiment out there as the constant drip drip drip of bad news wears on the minds of the sheeple.

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Can't say I'm surprised by this. There was a report last week about how many pairs of shoes women have and how they are more importan than paying the bills. I know that's a generalisation and not all women are like this, but I don't know one women at my work place of a similar age that "can be arsed" with savings or a pension. I just feel sorry for the poor sod that marries them.

Ignoring your last rude bit, as a woman i have to say the shoe thing is right. As someone who has prepared for my pension and insists on paying off my credit card bill at the end of every month, i am constantly scared when i speak to friends with lovely shoes but maxed out credit cards.

However, in the world of women the ultimate trophy is the latest handbag/the right shoes. This shows how much we know about fashion and that we have the money to put it into action. (otherwise known as consumer brainwashing)

I do it too, but keep a tight watch on my budget....i think it has a lot to do with upbringing. Parents need to teach 'em young to manage their money. Especially the girls.

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Like Mori or Gallup, its a sampling. As you can imagine, its impractical to interview all women but a significant number, 1200, does reveal trends. IMO, its all about the knife edge that people are on and that women are not immune and that even household bills can tip them over the edge. It all adds to the turning sentiment out there as the constant drip drip drip of bad news wears on the minds of the sheeple.

FFS!!! :blink:

Mori or Gallup would interview 1200 people at random and then see what number of them went bankrupt in the last year. This survey was only conducted on bankrupt people so cannot be used to conclude that numbers are rising. Adding comments like 'IMO its all about the knife edge' are just hiding the fact that you don't know the first thing about interpreting basic statistical data...

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Ignoring your last rude bit, as a woman i have to say the shoe thing is right. As someone who has prepared for my pension and insists on paying off my credit card bill at the end of every month, i am constantly scared when i speak to friends with lovely shoes but maxed out credit cards.

However, in the world of women the ultimate trophy is the latest handbag/the right shoes. This shows how much we know about fashion and that we have the money to put it into action. (otherwise known as consumer brainwashing)

I do it too, but keep a tight watch on my budget....i think it has a lot to do with upbringing. Parents need to teach 'em young to manage their money. Especially the girls.

Please accept my apologies Bee Bear. I'm not tarnishing all women with the same brush here, but those that I mix with - 18-30 age range do generally appear to be missing a few brain cells in the old reality department.

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Women remain foolish and irresponsible creatures, mostly needing saving by a "white knight":

Dr Bubb should apologise for this comment. It is the most sexist comment I have read in a long time.

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THE MORE things chnage, the more they remain the same !

Women remain foolish and irresponsible creatures, mostly needing saving by a "white knight":

(("Mr Stevens said the problem stemmed from the fact that women's salaries have failed to keep up with their need to be financially independent. Research by Halifax shows the proportion of new mortgages taken out by single women has more than doubled in the last 20 years and now accounts for 23% of the total market.

"Women are taking on a much greater debt burden than they used to, but their income still lags behind," Mr Stevens said."))

= = =

REMEMBER this:

HOUSING SPECULATION : The Female Factor

What is special about this boom in BTL and housing is...

the Female factor. Women are more in control of money than ever before.

Many work and have high powered jobs with good income and bonuses.

Some are in possession of large sums from divorces and inheritance.

Most did not get burned in the TMT/Dotcom bubble, as their speculative

urges do not turn to stocks as easily as they do for the males of the

species.

The housing boom has a special appeal to the female psyche. What better

feeds the security instinct than owning a large home, preferably with a

garden, or even a chain of BTL properties. And there is the decoration

angle. Many women, perhaps more than men, have a knack for redecoration.

They can spot a "diamond in the rough" and they know how to tart it up

and make it appealing to renters or other buyers. When they make a profit

from this activity, they attribute (at least some of the profit) to their

decorative skills, not to a rampant bull market. And then there is the

social aspect. Property profits beget social bragging which begets more

investment, a cycle of talking up the housing market at social events.

And, of course, a supportive wife may be a great inducement in getting a

man to invest, and is probably a much stronger factor in the property

market than it ever was in dotcoms.

It is all about to end. A female-aided speculative wave, is no different

from one lead by men, albeit it may have pushed just that little bit higher,

since the bullish concensus has spread wider. But these things have an

end. And when they do end there will be pain, and some tears, including

a few from female eyes.

@: http://groups.msn.com/nvest/general.msnw?a...496879327397027

LOOKS PROPHETIC now!

.....and of course many more women than men have the opportunity of staying at home and playing housewife,if the breadwinner has a reasonable income.....which ties in nicely with a bag-load of these programmes being scheduled in the morning too.

I disagree with your synopsis it's driven by women.It's driven by greed plain and simple.This instinct is universal to men and women,and property is certainly what is universally perceived as a measure of security(re:maslows hierarchy of needs..for shelter)

however pester-power and a desire to keep up with the jones' are attributes women can well understand.They get it from their little brats constantly when it's christmas,and subtle marketing techniques make the most of it.Is this really any different?

Edited by oracle

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it goes back to people (men and women) being given more monetry credit than they can deal with.

but not all women are the same, and many certainly don't all need 'knights in shining armour'. In fact, my boyfriend earns £10k more than me but i have more savings and no debt (he has been in the red since the new year)

programmes like Sex and The City certainly didn't help-one the main characters always buying £400 shoes even when she has no money.

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  • 301 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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