Brighton And Hove - Temptation/madness

[dredwerker]

Brighton and Hove Anecdotals

My Mum is selling to live in my flat which I currently rent from her. Currently a similar house (three bed semi) went for :

25/05/2006 38, Hove, Brighton And Hove, BN3 7 £265,000

She bought the one bed flat I live in for 35k as a “doer upper” with water damage seven years ago. These are two others in my block which are similar :

19/12/2003 128 Hove, Brighton And Hove, BN3 8.. £118,000

20/09/2002 128 Hove, Brighton And Hove, BN3 8.. £91,000

08/11/2001 132 Hove, Brighton And Hove, BN3 8.. £97,000

There are some dates missing from ourproperty.co.uk as I know two in my block have sold recently I think we are in the realms of £130k now.

As she wants her 1 bed flat I thought about doing an IO for a moment there. The old emotions took over. These are in the same road.

12/07/2005 22 Hangleton Lane, Hove, Brighton And Hove, BN3 8AH £305,000

26/11/2004 6 Hangleton Lane, Hove, Brighton And Hove, BN3 8AH £282,000

It was a £250k detached “doer upper” and at £1050 per month IO I thought why not, a two bed flat in brighton is circa £750 per month. IO is what is keeping the market inflated I believe. Repayment would be £1400.

Then I thought of the doing up costs, the downside risk and the obvious imminent HPC and I didn’t even view.

So my two points are:

1) It is hard not to buy, due to the emotionals. I want a home for my daughter and girlfriend and when the “what the heck stop being so gloomy gene kicks in”. HPC is a great boon to stop one buying yay for HPC.

2) My mum is going to take out £250k (a quarter of a million pounds and downsize) . I guess there are a lot of widows that will think along this line even though they don’t own.

Two more anecdotals

1) Regarding moving abroad. A guy came to work as a temp in my dept. before he retired with his pension cashed and house sold (250k) to live a more simple life in the warmth of Portugal. He believed he could live on £6k a year that’s a lot of years from £250k.

2) A friend’s folks are giving him the 10% deposit from their house I assume for a £280k newbuild flat. This money comes from selling downwards in London. I suppose this sort of input will inflate Brighton and Hove.

[Hopeful FTB]

Brighton and Hove Anecdotals

My Mum is selling to live in my flat which I currently rent from her. Currently a similar house (three bed semi) went for :

25/05/2006 38, Hove, Brighton And Hove, BN3 7 £265,000

She bought the one bed flat I live in for 35k as a “doer upper” with water damage seven years ago. These are two others in my block which are similar :

19/12/2003 128 Hove, Brighton And Hove, BN3 8.. £118,000

20/09/2002 128 Hove, Brighton And Hove, BN3 8.. £91,000

08/11/2001 132 Hove, Brighton And Hove, BN3 8.. £97,000

There are some dates missing from ourproperty.co.uk as I know two in my block have sold recently I think we are in the realms of £130k now.

As she wants her 1 bed flat I thought about doing an IO for a moment there. The old emotions took over. These are in the same road.

12/07/2005 22 Hangleton Lane, Hove, Brighton And Hove, BN3 8AH £305,000

26/11/2004 6 Hangleton Lane, Hove, Brighton And Hove, BN3 8AH £282,000

It was a £250k detached “doer upper” and at £1050 per month IO I thought why not, a two bed flat in brighton is circa £750 per month. IO is what is keeping the market inflated I believe. Repayment would be £1400.

Then I thought of the doing up costs, the downside risk and the obvious imminent HPC and I didn’t even view.

So my two points are:

1) It is hard not to buy, due to the emotionals. I want a home for my daughter and girlfriend and when the “what the heck stop being so gloomy gene kicks in”. HPC is a great boon to stop one buying yay for HPC.

2) My mum is going to take out £250k (a quarter of a million pounds and downsize) . I guess there are a lot of widows that will think along this line even though they don’t own.

Two more anecdotals

1) Regarding moving abroad. A guy came to work as a temp in my dept. before he retired with his pension cashed and house sold (250k) to live a more simple life in the warmth of Portugal. He believed he could live on £6k a year that’s a lot of years from £250k.

2) A friend’s folks are giving him the 10% deposit from their house I assume for a £280k newbuild flat. This money comes from selling downwards in London. I suppose this sort of input will inflate Brighton and Hove.

I know someone in brighton who is trying to sell their flat on the seafront- the EA said that 80% of their business now comes from london buyers- says it all really!

[BufferBear Bitcoin Bull]

Yeah, my ex-obss has just bought down there.

[dessie123]

Yeah, my ex-obss has just bought down there.

My parents live in Brighton and father worked as a carpet fitter in homes in the area for 40 years. They bought 35 years ago for 9K and now valued at 280K (A repeat of HPI over next 35 years will mean 9 million quid for a semi....hmmm!) He told me many of the flats he now works in are owned by wealthy arabs who only occupy the home a few weeks a year! He did touch on the London factor as well but said you rarely see the 'owner' in these cases! Theres certainly very few companies in the area who can sustain wages to pay these crazy prices..............

Edited August 17, 2006 by dessie123

[adibrown]

My parents live in Brighton and father worked as a carpet fitter in homes in the area for 40 years. They bought 35 years ago for 9K and now valued at 280K (A repeat of HPI over next 35 years will mean 9 million quid for a semi....hmmm!) He told me many of the flats he now works in are owned by wealthy arabs who only occupy the home a few weeks a year! He did touch on the London factor as well but said you rarely see the 'owner' in these cases! Theres certainly very few companies in the area who can sustain wages to pay these crazy prices..............

I moved to Brighton in 2004 but before that had visited on an almost monthly basis to visit friends since 1990. The place has changed a lot in those 15 years. The North Lanes used to be a derelict run down area but is now full of shops, restaurants, cafes etc. Everywhere seems to have been upgraded in Brighton and Hove. The big scummy blocks on the seafront are now £400k art deco apartments and plans are a foot for the new King Alfred development in Hove and the new West Marina development. Both projects are £100,000,000+ . I think Brighton did quite well out of the lottery, it seems quite a few schemes originate or are headquartered here and they seem very good at receiving lots of public money.

Anyway from what I have seen it seems like Brighton has done very well also out of the Games and New Media industries. OK so these places aren't big employers like American Express or Standard Life (Both HQ Brighton) but they dont have to be as visible because most people work from home.

I'm in the Games Industry and the UK Trade Expo was recently moved to Brighton, there are now 5 studios in the city generating well over £100million. Lots and lots of marketing and interactive industries are based in Brighton including Endemol (Formerly Victoria Real). Also take into account the large amount of people here in Brighton who work at Gatwick Airport.

What I am trying to say is that even though there are a few people who undoubtedly commute to London from Brighton I think there are lots more people who work in the Brighton area or work from home. Only 45minutes from London but by the sea it attracts a lot of home businesses who need to visit clients in London once or twice a week.

House prices here are high and the percentage increase has probably been bigger than anywhere else in the UK. I thought things would calm down here but the market is flying at the moment with all the parents of students coming down and buying their precious ones a house/flat for University and in turn investing some of the family silver. I expect BTL's are fuelling a large amount of the market but I have a lot of friends buying now as well who just feel that every day Brighton is getting busier and busier and a bigger city. As such they feel it is a sound investment for the future.

Also those people who talk about the great crash in Brighton 89-94, I was here and believe me when I tell you it was a completely different place then than it is now, completely different.

[dredwerker]

I lived in Brighton most of my life and I am 35 now.

I had a house around 1999. I bought a 4 bedroom house in westdene(Borders an expensive part of Brighton called Withdean) for 95k and that was sold a year later for £146k due to divorce and lost job etc..

I think its now selling for around £280k.

IMHO opinion I got it very cheap - Though I nearly bought a 3 bed down repo down the road for £60k six months before that. So there were repos just before 2000 - people have short memories.

Now I agree somewhat with adibrown that Brighton has changed. It has become a city and so forth but I still reckon my old house is only worth about £150k. I think it would cost £100k to rebuild it and a parcel of land sold up the road for about 50k several years ago.

I will not pay £280k for my old house(or one like it) I dont think the people would like me stalking them I do have to get out of the mindset that a 4 bed should be £95k unless we go up north. We are all my taxes go anyway.

Anyway I pondered some more and invented a fictitious first time buyer couple for brighton:

£18353.40 5 days a week bus driver

£36706 two fictitious bus drivers

3058

2400 after Tax

1200 If they have a child

Monthly repayment of £1270.85 @ 6% interest and IO of £974.75 on 194950

With a generous benefactor giving them a 10% deposity monthly repayment is 1205.56 or 924.75 IO

This an example of a what this money would get you:

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/viewdetails-501...=1&tr_t=buy

This a 10.62 multiplier for the one salary and obviously 5.31 for the two of them.

No kids for Mr and Mrs Brighton Bus driver even if they can afford the pokey two bed house.

I lived in Brighton most of my life and I am 35 now.

I had a house around 1999. I bought a 4 bedroom house in westdene(Borders an expensive part of Brighton called Withdean) for 95k and that was sold a year later for £146k due to divorce and lost job etc..

I think its now selling for around £280k.

IMHO opinion I got it very cheap - Though I nearly bought a 3 bed down repo down the road for £60k six months before that. So there were repos just before 2000 - people have short memories.

Now I agree somewhat with adibrown that Brighton has changed. It has become a city and so forth but I still reckon my old house is only worth about £150k. I think it would cost £100k to rebuild it and a parcel of land sold up the road for about 50k several years ago.

I will not pay £280k for my old house(or one like it) I dont think the people would like me stalking them I do have to get out of the mindset that a 4 bed should be £95k unless we go up north. We are all my taxes go anyway.

Anyway I pondered some more and invented a fictitious first time buyer couple for brighton:

£18353.40 5 per annum days a week bus driver

£36706 two fictitious bus drivers per annum

£3058 per month before tax

£2400 per month after Tax Roughly

£1200 per month If they have a child

Monthly repayment of £1270.85 @ 6% interest and IO of £974.75 on 194950

With a generous benefactor giving them a 10% deposity monthly repayment is 1205.56 or 924.75 IO

This an example of a what this money would get you:

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/viewdetails-501...=1&tr_t=buy

This a 10.62 multiplier for the one salary and obviously 5.31 for the two of them.

No kids for Mr and Mrs Brighton Bus driver, even if they can afford the pokey two bed house. This example house is near or in Moulsecoomb. My great uncle's house wouldnt actually sell for £30k(in Moulsecoomb) in the last crash. It just stayed vacant.

I know a guy who earns 12k I believe as a lifeguard and another girl who is a Teacher's assistant and they share a house with another guy. Two of them couldnt really afford to rent here let alone a mortgage. The rub here is that the rent is £950 per month and the house is £250k 3 bed semi. Even on IO @ 1050 per month the landlord would be subsidising them.

rant over

o and BTW the house I originally looked at round the corner from me the "250k 3 bed doer upper sold within a week" for anecdotals. The one opposite hasnt sold for a couple of years - go figure.

[tinecu]

I lived in Brighton most of my life and I am 35 now.

I had a house around 1999. I bought a 4 bedroom house in westdene(Borders an expensive part of Brighton called Withdean) for 95k and that was sold a year later for £146k due to divorce and lost job etc..

I think its now selling for around £280k.

IMHO opinion I got it very cheap - Though I nearly bought a 3 bed down repo down the road for £60k six months before that. So there were repos just before 2000 - people have short memories.

Now I agree somewhat with adibrown that Brighton has changed. It has become a city and so forth but I still reckon my old house is only worth about £150k. I think it would cost £100k to rebuild it and a parcel of land sold up the road for about 50k several years ago.

I will not pay £280k for my old house(or one like it) I dont think the people would like me stalking them I do have to get out of the mindset that a 4 bed should be £95k unless we go up north. We are all my taxes go anyway.

Anyway I pondered some more and invented a fictitious first time buyer couple for brighton:

£18353.40 5 days a week bus driver

£36706 two fictitious bus drivers

3058

2400 after Tax

1200 If they have a child

Monthly repayment of £1270.85 @ 6% interest and IO of £974.75 on 194950

With a generous benefactor giving them a 10% deposity monthly repayment is 1205.56 or 924.75 IO

This an example of a what this money would get you:

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/viewdetails-501...=1&tr_t=buy

This a 10.62 multiplier for the one salary and obviously 5.31 for the two of them.

No kids for Mr and Mrs Brighton Bus driver even if they can afford the pokey two bed house.

I lived in Brighton most of my life and I am 35 now.

I had a house around 1999. I bought a 4 bedroom house in westdene(Borders an expensive part of Brighton called Withdean) for 95k and that was sold a year later for £146k due to divorce and lost job etc..

I think its now selling for around £280k.

IMHO opinion I got it very cheap - Though I nearly bought a 3 bed down repo down the road for £60k six months before that. So there were repos just before 2000 - people have short memories.

Now I agree somewhat with adibrown that Brighton has changed. It has become a city and so forth but I still reckon my old house is only worth about £150k. I think it would cost £100k to rebuild it and a parcel of land sold up the road for about 50k several years ago.

I will not pay £280k for my old house(or one like it) I dont think the people would like me stalking them I do have to get out of the mindset that a 4 bed should be £95k unless we go up north. We are all my taxes go anyway.

Anyway I pondered some more and invented a fictitious first time buyer couple for brighton:

£18353.40 5 per annum days a week bus driver

£36706 two fictitious bus drivers per annum

£3058 per month before tax

£2400 per month after Tax Roughly

£1200 per month If they have a child

Monthly repayment of £1270.85 @ 6% interest and IO of £974.75 on 194950

With a generous benefactor giving them a 10% deposity monthly repayment is 1205.56 or 924.75 IO

This an example of a what this money would get you:

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/viewdetails-501...=1&tr_t=buy

This a 10.62 multiplier for the one salary and obviously 5.31 for the two of them.

No kids for Mr and Mrs Brighton Bus driver, even if they can afford the pokey two bed house. This example house is near or in Moulsecoomb. My great uncle's house wouldnt actually sell for £30k(in Moulsecoomb) in the last crash. It just stayed vacant.

I know a guy who earns 12k I believe as a lifeguard and another girl who is a Teacher's assistant and they share a house with another guy. Two of them couldnt really afford to rent here let alone a mortgage. The rub here is that the rent is £950 per month and the house is £250k 3 bed semi. Even on IO @ 1050 per month the landlord would be subsidising them.

rant over

o and BTW the house I originally looked at round the corner from me the "250k 3 bed doer upper sold within a week" for anecdotals. The one opposite hasnt sold for a couple of years - go figure.

Great post Dredwerker,

Truly highlights the madness we are in.

House prices seems to have slowed up alot though:

http://www.home.co.uk/guides/house_prices_...mp;endyear=2006

Look at the Median trends.

Transaction volumes have a distinct downward trend.

[adibrown]

Am I the only one that looks at that house and thinks "Not bad for a couple of bus drivers"

You could get the following house for the same price:

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/viewdetails-123...=2&tr_t=buy

Or you could move slightly out of Brighton and get something much bigger. Are you suggesting a couple of bus drivers should be able to afford a 4 bedroom detached house in Central Brighton. Come on.

And to suggest a child costs £1,200 a month is ridiculous.

I might also add that Westdean and Moulescoomb are quite a distance from the centre of Brighton & Hove as is Hangleton. I would suggest that may be these areas are a little overpriced as they do not attract the new generation of Brightonians but attract similar prices as property in the centre within walking distance of the station. In that sense these districts may be slightly overpriced in the same way areas in London like Thamesmead and Woolwich are priced according to Central London madness. In some cases you can end up paying £350k for a flat in Woolwich

These guys will be first to feel the pinch if a downward shift ever happens.

[dredwerker]

It wouldnt be bad for a couple of bus drivers. No disrespect to bus drivers. The trouble is they couldn't afford it on one wage or one and a bit(part time or minus childcare). That was my point.

That house on the rightmove link is in quite a scary part of town. As my anecdote says - you couldn't actually sell in those areas a decade ago.

Maybe I am being deliberately trolled - hey I dont know

Hove park is a long way from Brighton town centre if Moulsecoomb (Hove park is dear for those not in the know). I am not sure what that had to do with anything.

[adibrown]

It wouldnt be bad for a couple of bus drivers. No disrespect to bus drivers. The trouble is they couldn't afford it on one wage or one and a bit(part time or minus childcare). That was my point.

That house on the rightmove link is in quite a scary part of town. As my anecdote says - you couldn't actually sell in those areas a decade ago.

Maybe I am being deliberately trolled - hey I dont know

Hove park is a long way from Brighton town centre if Moulsecoomb (Hove park is dear for those not in the know). I am not sure what that had to do with anything.

Hove Park is within walking distance of Hove Station and Hove Station has direct services to London and Gatwick every 20 minutes. Thats the difference.

[dredwerker]

Hove Park is within walking distance of Hove Station and Hove Station has direct services to London and Gatwick every 20 minutes. Thats the difference.

Thats not what I meant. Some of Hove Park is in the millions and Moulsecoomb isn't Nothing to do with Hove Station.

Anyway I dont want to fight. IMHO Brighton and Hove is overpriced.

I also hate the doom and gloom side of the crash prediction. I know a couple that were being told to get a 125% mortgage surely this is bad as a whole. This sort of thing must be an indicator that there is froth if not an outright crash again IMHO

I think Keynes or someone like that said you have to bet against everyone to win or something like that anwyay.(What a great quote)

[adibrown]

Thats not what I meant. Some of Hove Park is in the millions and Moulsecoomb isn't Nothing to do with Hove Station.

Anyway I dont want to fight. IMHO Brighton and Hove is overpriced.

I also hate the doom and gloom side of the crash prediction. I know a couple that were being told to get a 125% mortgage surely this is bad as a whole. This sort of thing must be an indicator that there is froth if not an outright crash again IMHO

I think Keynes or someone like that said you have to bet against everyone to win or something like that anwyay.(What a great quote)

I'm sorry but it has everything to do with the station. If you work in London or Gatwick or Portsmouth or Reading etc then you are going to want to live in a location where you can walk home from the station. I lived in London for 8 years and it is all very much about how close you are to the station. Every 10 minutes away the prices dropped by about £100k.

Im not up for a fight I am just debating the various issues raised as every good forum should.

[dredwerker]

I'm sorry but it has everything to do with the station. If you work in London or Gatwick or Portsmouth or Reading etc then you are going to want to live in a location where you can walk home from the station. I lived in London for 8 years and it is all very much about how close you are to the station. Every 10 minutes away the prices dropped by about £100k.

Im not up for a fight I am just debating the various issues raised as every good forum should.

In that case Moulsecoomb is next to a station and should have a great load of commuters

[adibrown]

In that case Moulsecoomb is next to a station and should have a great load of commuters

If its a direct line to London and Gatwick with regular trains then itis probably a good investment

[dredwerker]

Whatever happened to homes ?

[adibrown]

Whatever happened to homes ?

Well, people like to work and play. perfect scenario is to live soemwhere you can play and be within walking distance of transport taking you to work. People love to play in Hove and Brighton and many of them work in London. They just want a home that allows them to enjoy both work and play.

[dredwerker]

I meant whatever happened to homes instead of an investment, as you called it.

[adibrown]

I meant whatever happened to homes instead of an investment, as you called it.

http://www.mishonmackay.com/property-searc...p;checkboxCheck[newDevelopment]=&lowestPrice=350000&highestPrice=400000&bedrooms=1&regions[0]=11&submit=Search&m_property_propertiesID=01768

Check this matchbox out!!!

[dredwerker]

Which one the garages or the Hurstpierpoint one?

BTW developers have moved into the house I was nearly tempted to in Hangleton Lane. I think it is developers. The builders have diggers and they seem to be moving quickly.

It sold within a week or so. I guess it will get flipped. Although the place opposite didnt sell for years;possibly hasn't sold.

I looked at some rentals in Southwick and a 3 bed bungalow was £795 to rent and others in overhill lane(?) have sold for 220k.

Still doesnt seem to make sense to buy - financially.