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Englebert

Is This What Bliars Britain Has Turned Into?

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http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2-2006240558,00.html

Not a Sun reader at all...but I have just signed the petition to make sure the scum who did this get life. From the CCTV footage, which is as clear as daylight, the evidence is so vivid I would basically hang them - would happily pull the rope myself. Just a warning - the video here is sickening.

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I wish they wouldn't use the word "life"... it doesn't seem to mean what everyone always assumed it meant, and can be as little as 8 years IIRC.

"The rest of their lives behind bars" is what is wanted.

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I wish they wouldn't use the word "life"... it doesn't seem to mean what everyone always assumed it meant, and can be as little as 8 years IIRC.

"The rest of their lives behind bars" is what is wanted.

Agreed on that one. I have never been an advocate of the death penalty but if I was a member of the family of this murdered boy, I'd quite happily like to see them dead.

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Yep caught on camera no question of guilt - waste of oxygen and all other resources. Kill 'em.

But first, strip 'em naked and hang them from lampposts for three days and pay teenage girls to laugh at the size of their genitals.

Then parade them though the streets with a large crowd of people following them making clucking sounds so they know what chickens they are.

Then cut their throats and look into their eyes and as they die, tell them they were adopted and unloved.

Any advances? :P

Go on fill your boots - it's a Friday!

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Maybe scrapping the CCTV nonsense and putting cops back on the street would be a better idea than returning to medieval punishments? It's all very well to catch murderers from CCTV footage after the fact and then hang them, but catching them before they murder would seem preferable.

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Guest Bart of Darkness
Then cut their throats and look into their eyes and as they die, tell them they were adopted and unloved.

Sounds very Klingon does that.

Seems like our Tony is on a crime fighting spree (in words if not deeds)

Victims vs. Criminals

Pledge to lock up more offenders

I'd like to believe him but years of words not actions and ineffectual guff like ASBOS would seem to indicate a lack of will to fight crime.

I'm with Sean Connery in The Untouchables:

Malone: You said you wanted to get Capone. Do you really wanna get him? You see what I'm saying is, what are you prepared to do?

Ness: Anything and everything in my power.

Malone: And *then* what are you prepared to do? If you open the can on these worms you must be prepared to go all the way because they're not gonna give up the fight until one of you is dead.

Ness: How do you do it then?

Malone: You wanna know how you do it? Here's how, they pull a knife, you pull a gun. He sends one of yours to the hospital, you send one of his to the morgue. That's the Chicago way, and that's how you get Capone! Now do you want to do that? Are you ready to do that?

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http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2-2006240558,00.html

Not a Sun reader at all...but I have just signed the petition to make sure the scum who did this get life. From the CCTV footage, which is as clear as daylight, the evidence is so vivid I would basically hang them - would happily pull the rope myself. Just a warning - the video here is sickening.

If anyone else is having trouble with the video in mindows media player (as I did) you can go to File -> Open URL -> and paste:

mms://lonwle.interoutemediaservices.com/{7c23fc2c-ad3a-4385-93eb-6ea9b6ff4bce}/{7c6915fe-b92e-460d-89f8-8a7ec88d7fef}/stabbing-250506.wmv

into the dialogue box there to view it.

It's horrific.

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I can't comment on this case, because:

a ) I don't have access to the evidence

b ) I don't have access to the evidence

Maybe if I could get the video to run and could ID the attackers accurately I would have a different opinion.

However, I would like to ask why anyone in their right mind would want to read, even less take seriously, trash like that printed in that rag "The Sun".

I draw your attention to the following: Holness Wrongly Convicted

Remember that guy? Had his leg blown off in 7/7 and was promptly made a cause celebre by, who else, The Sun. He was hailed by the paper as some kind of hero, fighting against injustice when he appeared on the steps of 10 Downing street demanding higher compensation for the victims of crime (ie, he wanted more money for his leg).

When other papers recognised who he was, a gang aggravated-rapist of teenage girls, they suggested he was not an appropriate spokesmen for victims. The Sun howver merely asked Holness whether the stories of his past were true. That's when they ran the ******** story above. I had to phone them up and appeal to their sense of justice, enquiring whether the victims of Holness' crimes would see their white-washing of his past as justice. Even then, it took them a good few hours to take the story off the site.

Stop reading that rag!

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I can't comment on this case, because:

a ) I don't have access to the evidence

b ) I don't have access to the evidence

Maybe if I could get the video to run and could ID the attackers accurately I would have a different opinion.

However, I would like to ask why anyone in their right mind would want to read, even less take seriously, trash like that printed in that rag "The Sun".

I draw your attention to the following: Holness Wrongly Convicted

Remember that guy? Had his leg blown off in 7/7 and was promptly made a cause celebre by, who else, The Sun. He was hailed by the paper as some kind of hero, fighting against injustice when he appeared on the steps of 10 Downing street demanding higher compensation for the victims of crime (ie, he wanted more money for his leg).

When other papers recognised who he was, a gang aggravated-rapist of teenage girls, they suggested he was not an appropriate spokesmen for victims. The Sun howver merely asked Holness whether the stories of his past were true. That's when they ran the ******** story above. I had to phone them up and appeal to their sense of justice, enquiring whether the victims of Holness' crimes would see their white-washing of his past as justice. Even then, it took them a good few hours to take the story off the site.

Stop reading that rag!

Sledgehead....don't matter what paper shows it (this video can only be viewed online - it just so happens that the Sun is airing it with permission of the victims family) I would be interested in your comments after you have actually seen the footage. It could've been a member of your family - it could have been you just sat there waiting for a lift home.

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Absolutely horrific & so totally pointless. What on earth is this Country coming too :(

Death penalty is really not enough for these thugs. They should be jailed & told that they will NEVER be released after being flogged of course.

Of course this won't happen & they will be free after just a few years.

I really fear for the future of the UK :(

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Yep caught on camera no question of guilt - waste of oxygen and all other resources. Kill 'em.

But first, strip 'em naked and hang them from lampposts for three days and pay teenage girls to laugh at the size of their genitals.

Then parade them though the streets with a large crowd of people following them making clucking sounds so they know what chickens they are.

Then cut their throats and look into their eyes and as they die, tell them they were adopted and unloved.

Any advances? :P

Go on fill your boots - it's a Friday!

Anthony Hopkins, Hannibal

Guts in, guts out.....?

I'm with Sean Connery in The Untouchables:

Malone: You said you wanted to get Capone. Do you really wanna get him? You see what I'm saying is, what are you prepared to do?

Ness: Anything and everything in my power.

Malone: And *then* what are you prepared to do? If you open the can on these worms you must be prepared to go all the way because they're not gonna give up the fight until one of you is dead.

Ness: How do you do it then?

Malone: You wanna know how you do it? Here's how, they pull a knife, you pull a gun. He sends one of yours to the hospital, you send one of his to the morgue. That's the Chicago way, and that's how you get Capone! Now do you want to do that? Are you ready to do that?

I'm just a regular guy meandering through life and wouldn't hurt a sole. However come at me, you get it back X 10. The above philosophy has served me well since being a teenager.

Horrific this may be, but WTF has it got to do with Blair?

Well for a start, he's all for this CCTV and monitoring of everyone 24/7. I can't help feeling that we would have far fewer incidents such as this if we had more police on the streets and less CCTV (and when I say police officer, I say precisely that - a fully trained police officer - not a sodding community support officer). All things being equal I would rather have that and have less chance of this happening to me for instance, than just being able to catch them after the event.

Initiative after intiative to improve things. Anything, absolutely anything that he can do to show statistically that he is improving things and he will go that route. Everyone knows that this could be solved quite simply. Put more police on the streets, tougher sentencing, or even just the sentence handed down being served. No easy paroles.

The whole thing with this program of social control (and that is what the country is going through at the moment, be under no illusions) is his (Bliars) doing. Everything from ASBO's to ID cards in some pathetic attemp to social engineer all the ills out of our society.

Someone on the forum here said quite a while back that they thought the house situation had been rigged - ie all these city new builds are intended to be the social housing of tomorrow. Sounds far-fetched? To be honest it wouldn't suprise me.

The Future

Edited by Mrliberty

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More CCTV, but with intelligent recognition of attacks, which alerts police.

I refer you to my post above. Relying on unproven and unreliable technology to try and prevent this sort of thing is a fallacy, and anyone who believes otherwise has watched to many IBM adverts/Star Treck episodes. I work in the technology industry, and would not want to be reliant on this to protect me. To be honest, most of the benefits of it when it works have been ramped up by the people supplying the software and equipment. The whole thing is just a racket, and an attemp to monitor everyone. There is certainly nothing available so far that could recognise an attack taking place or bad behaviour. The basic facial recognition hardly ever works.

I recomend you read this excellent guide (the ICAMS report)

International Campaign Against Mass Surveillance

Some of what has already happened is quite chilling.

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Mr. Liberty, I read the article, it's a good one.

I think that CCTV may not prevent crime (especially if the cameras are hidden), but can be used to prove guilt, in the case of these three scum murdering an innocent man.

I guess it's about trade-off - if you are a regular, law abiding citizen, why should you worry about cameras?

On the other hand, how do we know our homes aren't being spied on by a camera outside our house?

I feel safer knowing there are cameras watching. Of course, it did nothing to prevent this person's death.

I also see the rise of a police state, particularly in the USA - read Alexjones.net.

The powers that be use terrorism as a pretext to engage in global spying.

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I saw that on the news the other week.

But there's always something in the back of my mind that says 'what if'.

e.g. What if the guys they attacked had gang raped one of their 14 year old sisters. What if they were reknown joyriders who had unprovably run over a young mother and her twin babies, leaving a rather angry young man and his mates.

I am not saying this is the case, but going by the insane ramblings of many folk here, and almost every other online community I have seen suggest society has a very significantly violent retributive nature, and the above circumstances might lead people into actions that would be difficult to explain.... I expect I would too.

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I saw that on the news the other week.

But there's always something in the back of my mind that says 'what if'.

e.g. What if the guys they attacked had gang raped one of their 14 year old sisters. What if they were reknown joyriders who had unprovably run over a young mother and her twin babies, leaving a rather angry young man and his mates.

I am not saying this is the case, but going by the insane ramblings of many folk here, and almost every other online community I have seen suggest society has a very significantly violent retributive nature, and the above circumstances might lead people into actions that would be difficult to explain.... I expect I would too.

"What if the guys they attacked had gang raped one of their 14 year old sisters. What if they were reknown joyriders who had unprovably run over a young mother and her twin babies, leaving a rather angry young man and his mates"

What if it had been your little brother just waiting with his mate for a lift home from you...only you were 10 minutes late?....

What are you saying? That this kind of thug behaviour can be condoned?

Edited by The Dude

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Thats shaken me to the core, to know how randomly and without reason some 'people' will attack others. I feel like shit now. Prison's way too good for them.

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Horrific this may be, but WTF has it got to do with Blair?

It could most likely be argued that these blokes did it "for a laugh". This is the mentality of some kids on the streets. gangs of people just going about feeding off each other- spontaneous actions rather that thought out actions. This is what needs to be stopped but how to do it no-one knows. [police on the beat, extended drinking hours. Perhaps a better structured learning career path for 14-16 would be more suitable, but that would be far too much effort]. It is up for tony blair to decide. thats what he is paid for.

I am very much in favour of making petty "criminals" join the forces for a fixed period rather than offenders institutions/asbos. the disipline would do them good.

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I am very much in favour of making petty "criminals" join the forces for a fixed period rather than offenders institutions/asbos. the disipline would do them good.

Yes, when someone beats me up I want them trained properly... :huh:

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What if it had been your little brother just waiting with his mate for a lift home from you...only you were 10 minutes late?....

What are you saying? That this kind of thug behaviour can be condoned?

I don't think anyone here thinks this sort of thing can be condoned. Personally I find it sickening, and really do think the culprits should never be free on the streets again. However we have to be very careful when we try to deal with this sort of problem. Governments over recent years have proved time and time again that they are capable of repeated and ineffective knee-jerk reactions. The criminal justice system in this country has been refined over centuries, and at the moment a lot of laws are being destroyed that have allowed most of mine (30's) and my parents generation to have it pretty good (I don't own a house though :().

I have in the past lived in some pretty god-awful places. One of the things that was apparent to me back then was that the problem is caused by a minority, and wasn't being prevented because the existing methods that we already have available to us are not being applied.

Unfortunately, Bliar has taken us down a road now that it is going to be very difficult to turn away from. I know with absolute certainty that another initiative or draconian measures isn't going to fix this. Add in a possible HPC and associated recession thats likely to accompany it, and I think you will see things get worse (maybe considerably) in the future, not better. What about all the Chavs? What happens when the MEW spending and benefits party comes to an end? How much of one do you think they are going to go off on? Many of our towns and cities already have many parts that are just no-go areas after dark. General behaviour and attitudes is getting worse generation by generation. Class is no longer a factor. Some of the worst teenagers I know for instance have wealthy and middle class parents.

Add to this that they are intending to practically centralise police forces, the police and the police themselves are doing less and less actual policing, have more paperwork, initiatives (and this includes other public sector workers like nurses) and god-knows what else to do instead of their job, and I think we will be in for a rough couple of decades

Edited by Mrliberty

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It could most likely be argued that these blokes did it "for a laugh". This is the mentality of some kids on the streets. gangs of people just going about feeding off each other- spontaneous actions rather that thought out actions. This is what needs to be stopped but how to do it no-one knows. [police on the beat, extended drinking hours. Perhaps a better structured learning career path for 14-16 would be more suitable, but that would be far too much effort]. It is up for tony blair to decide. thats what he is paid for.

I am very much in favour of making petty "criminals" join the forces for a fixed period rather than offenders institutions/asbos. the disipline would do them good.

F*ck that lilly-livered liberal bullsh*t.

Do you really think young yobs would show such arrogance and inhumanity if they we had corporal punishment?

This country has gone to the dogs.

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That was so sad.

I wish the UK had the death sentence as America has it.

Such an ignorant comment! Like the death penalty makes ANY difference in the few US states that still use it? Crap! It's like all the tits that are rambling on about 'life' meaning life etc.. 'Life' is just a word, and lets be honest if it really mean't 'for life' then how often would we hear it? Hardly EVER! These same people would then be complaining about that - and our Tax will be increasing exponentially to pay for the extra prison beds! Would such a change make sod all difference to the system? NO! I am sick to my teeth of all these Blairite induced chav headlines we are hearing these days :ph34r: The sheeple of this country are helping Mr. Blairs Nulabour further undermine the UK justice system more than any other government have done so far, maybe so more draconian legislation can be introduced and further the final goal of a dictator state with the NIR or whatever and lovely crime busting ID cards which will be the answer to everything!

As sickening as this incident is, I would almost bet this isn't the first time somthing like this has happened :rolleyes: just that it has been caught on tape - that is why we should carefully consider this situation before blindly signing any Nulabour ass licking tabloid poll.

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  • 301 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
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      • Even
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      • up 5%



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