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sam

I Look At The Drunks In The Local Park

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I was walking in Cambridge yesterday and like many of the big citys these days i saw your usual bunch of drunks sat in the park. Some had that look in their face of having had a bad time of life, some were quite happy looking, some had that beaten look, a few looked ill, but a fair few of them looked "Normal".

I quite often look at these people(and there are many of them these days), and want to know their life story, how did they end up like this, i don't hold with this view that they are all useless drunken scum, we all have a breaking point.

For the sake of this post i will keep it property related, but there are so many more social issues i could cover on the same issue, why are people getting into such desperate postions, kids(14 year old girls) having babys, crime, knife carrying etc etc etc.

This is just crazy, we are told everyday by Gordon Browns spin machine that we are living in a miracle economy, we should not be getting desperate people on the streets getting tanked up, we should not be seeing violent scenes of frustated youths kicking and stabbing the crap out of each other on a Friday night.

I have a strong belief that if you give anyone a purpose they will flourish, give anyone a average job that will pay for an average house and that person will Grow, he will love his Country and he will not want to go on a self destruct binge.

I would be put in the class of one of societys good boys, now in my early 40's, i have always worked, no criminal record, have a penision, and a good head on me, and i have a strong set of moral values(vast majority of the time). So i look at some of these Guys in the Park and think how can anyone turn their lives around after so much abuse or put downs, i am not saying it is impossible, but the odds are not on their side.

After so much clean living and doing the right thing in my life, i find life a bitch, even the most basic home ownership is a huge risk and responsbility, some of these people with a can of cheap larger are where they are because we put them there.

Move onto the afternoon now, and i have to go and see a BTL husband and wife team i have, they have all your usual faults as BTletters, but saying that they are very nice poeple as well, just blind.

Thet are based just North of Cambridge(i have to be so carefull now)in one of the nicer Villages, they have about 40/50 propertys in the City itself.

Their views on just about everything are just beyond belief, everything about their lives and insight into other peoples lives is a contradiction, it is like a Lord of the rings epic..GOOD v's EVIL.

For of those that have no idea of what is happening in Cambridge(99% i guess), they are building a huge township near where they live, of course they are up in arms about this, yet another day they will stress that The Btl business is so good because of the shortage of homes. They hate the drunks and scum that now roam our streets, but cannot see that taking their homes away from them might be a cause of their do not give a toss attitude.

I am sorry this post has gone on a bit, but i looked at this drunk yesterday and just thought what chance does he have, he might behave like scum, maybe that is what is expected of him.

It is all very well my posh doing very well for themselves BTL customers judging him, yet they are taking everything away from him that makes him a man. These people want it all, they feed on the weak like parasites, and then hate the fact that they are parasites.

I suppose another reason for this post was the story of the pretty pregnant lady who claims the Banks are stuffing her, she in some ways is no differnet from the drunk i saw, only difference being was that she looked like she was a high flyer, for a while.

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The terrible social cost of a "Miracle Economy" where those who can borrow most prosper and those who cannot starve. :angry:

Judgment day is around the corner as all that borrowed money will have to be repaid in one form or another. There is never something for nothing and wealth built on borrowing never lasts.

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Agree with everything you wrote there sam!

CRAP!

This is not third world, there are benefit agencies to claim from, there are hostels, social workers to help, college courses, voluntary work even.

There are a multitude of activities these invertibrates can employ, but they choose to opt out, blame others & become a part of a problem rather than a cure.

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Yes, thing is there will always be a portion of society who would go the tanked-up stabbing route even if you plonked them in utopia. They cannot be trusted to look after themselves. The problem is just this - they have NO PRESSURE to do anything! We used to put these types in the infantry but what to do with them now?

Some people are just scumbags. It's hard to deal with but there we are. They cannot (mostly) be saved, only contained and constrained. Talk to any policeman/woman and they'll tell you the same. I think it's in their genes. Have you noticed how they all look like drunken chavs even when they're sober? Does Prince William look like a drunken chav? No. Even if you gave him football clothes, a track suit and a can on 'Kronie' he'd not fit in with the chavs.

Best thing to do is keep away from them until they are chipped and/or curfewed.

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Sometimes "it" happens.

I think that in the "good" times it's every man for himself. In downtirns people care about society more, I think that this is because people relise that "it" may happen to them :unsure:

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The terrible social cost of a "Miracle Economy" where those who can borrow most prosper and those who cannot starve. :angry:

Judgment day is around the corner as all that borrowed money will have to be repaid in one form or another. There is never something for nothing and wealth built on borrowing never lasts.

Unfortunately, realist bear, If there is one thing I have learnt in life it is that those who cause the problme will survive while the innocent victims will go under.

When/if the sh1t hits the fan those in huge amounts of debt will declare themselves bankrupt and carry on in life probably with a better standard of living than those on low incomes who save and a careful. Many will do IVA (?) and keep their homes/4x4 and plasma TV's.

The low paid shop workers will lose their job. The low paid family will find the council house waiting list go up as the homeless situation gets worse. Money that could have been spent on housing the homeless will be spent on 'debt helplines'. Those who waited and saved to buy a house will find interest rates go higher etc etc.

Makes you think 'sod it' if you can't beat them - join them.

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Does Prince William look like a drunken chav?

No, but Prince Harry does. I agree with a lot of what you say, but I'd take issue with the suggestion that the Royal Family and upper classes are in some way genetically superior. A lot of them are as inbred and stupid as any sink estate riff raff.

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Sometimes "it" happens.

I think that in the "good" times it's every man for himself. In downtirns people care about society more, I think that this is because people relise that "it" may happen to them :unsure:

The problem is a social security system thats lets people go on the sick for being alcoholics, then give them money to drink chemical cider all day.

Put an easy option there, and people will take it, hence britain having the highest teenage pregnancy rate in western europe.

Give people the option of being free-loading scum, and generally they will.

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CRAP!

This is not third world, there are benefit agencies to claim from, there are hostels, social workers to help, college courses, voluntary work even.

There are a multitude of activities these invertibrates can employ, but they choose to opt out, blame others & become a part of a problem rather than a cure.

It isn't that simple.

You can't claim benefits or get a job or even proper health care (register with a GP) unless you have an address.

You can't get an address without a job or benefits. Catch 22

There are not strings of hostels helping the homeless - spaces in hostels are limited and priority is given to the most vulnerable groups.

Unfortunately the 'help' out there rarely kicks in until the homeless person comes to the 'attention' of services either because they committ a crime (and are imprisoned) or if they are sectioned under the mental health act.

Out there it is the same for the homeless as everyone eles - if you keep your nose clean and don't do anything wrong you get sod all.

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you have to remember that a large percentage of street people and homeless drunks are ex-serviceman who fought for their country only to return and be left with nothing.

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No, but Prince Harry does. I agree with a lot of what you say, but I'd take issue with the suggestion that the Royal Family and upper classes are in some way genetically superior. A lot of them are as inbred and stupid as any sink estate riff raff.

Yes, I was being a little tongue-in-cheek.

To be honest, I reckon the availability of booze is the cause. Drunks are by definition intoxicated by alcohol. Will they get drugs instead? Probably. But I reckon booze should only be sold to people with a 'booze-port' card. Like a passport but for booze.

Also, if you are wearing a tracksuit or have an 'open-mouthed' 'I've just had a burger' look you should be steered towards the fruit section.

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CRAP!

This is not third world, there are benefit agencies to claim from, there are hostels, social workers to help, college courses, voluntary work even.

There are a multitude of activities these invertibrates can employ, but they choose to opt out, blame others & become a part of a problem rather than a cure.

Wake up and smell the coffee!

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you have to remember that a large percentage of street people and homeless drunks are ex-serviceman who fought for their country only to return and be left with nothing.

That's b0ll0cks.

Edited by Euphorion

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That's b0ll0cks.

In 1998 it was between one quarter and one fifth. It has now decreased markedly; however, there is still no doubt that ex-forces are over-represented in the homeless population compared to the population of the UK.

Whilst I'm here, I'd like to take issue with people who think that a good solution with feckless youngsters would be putting them in the forces. The forces are a professional volunteer body who have enough trouble training recruits without having to act as prison wardens for the dregs of society. We dropped conscription for good reasons.

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It isn't that simple.

You can't claim benefits or get a job or even proper health care (register with a GP) unless you have an address.

You can't get an address without a job or benefits. Catch 22

There are not strings of hostels helping the homeless - spaces in hostels are limited and priority is given to the most vulnerable groups.

Unfortunately the 'help' out there rarely kicks in until the homeless person comes to the 'attention' of services either because they committ a crime (and are imprisoned) or if they are sectioned under the mental health act.

Out there it is the same for the homeless as everyone eles - if you keep your nose clean and don't do anything wrong you get sod all.

I do understand this..really.

But the people in this position have slid there over a period of time, they have had opportunities to amend it but have perhaps buried their heads in the sand & chosen not to. I realise that is a sweeping generalisation, but believe it to apply in most cases.

Maybe it is a mental health problem that they are behaving in such a manner, also the factor that some people are just like that.

All said & done, whatever the reasons they are there, if they are posing any sort of threat to law abiding society then they should be removed from that environment.

This is just crazy, we are told everyday by Gordon Browns spin machine that we are living in a miracle economy, we should not be getting desperate people on the streets getting tanked up, we should not be seeing violent scenes of frustated youths kicking and stabbing the crap out of each other on a Friday night.

I often hear comments such as this, does everybody have short memories or am I just old?

I remember the teddy boy fights, mod/rockers, greabo/skinheads, saturday afternoon football,

there has always been an alcohol fuelled generic violence in our society, just that now a lot of views are that it shouldn't be happening.

As for the knife culture it has always been there, but in the 'old days' there was the deterrrent of being banged up for using a knife, now you get a new identity, rehoused & given benefits to live on & some poxy social worker cooing about how you are the one who is the victim!!

I've just heard on the radio that a knife offence is proposed to carry a 5 year sentence, is this another reversal of NU labour policy of going back to common sense.

30 years ago you would have expected a lot longer for stabbing somebody.

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I do understand this..really.

But the people in this position have slid there over a period of time, they have had opportunities to amend it but have perhaps buried their heads in the sand & chosen not to. I realise that is a sweeping generalisation, but believe it to apply in most cases.

Maybe it is a mental health problem that they are behaving in such a manner, also the factor that some people are just like that.

All said & done, whatever the reasons they are there, if they are posing any sort of threat to law abiding society then they should be removed from that environment.

I think there is a lot of homeless people with very severe mental health problems that do prevent them from seeking help/holding down a job etc.

There are also many homless adults who began living on the streets as kids/teenagers after fleeing abusive homes or even being kicked out of there own home. Many of these kids will never have been taught the life skills and coping strategies that kids from a more functional background learn. And they will have probably had a very disrupted education.

I think these problems can be so bad that it is not a case of burrying their head in the sand- they just don;t have the skills to get out of the situation. Yes..these situations creep up on people (just one night on the street turns into a week..then a month) and before you know it they are in a situation with no way out.

We live in an incresingly fast moving and insecure world. Jobs for life/homes for life/relationships for life don't seem to mean anything anymore.

In some ways we, as a society, benefit from this with increased global competitiveness and personal freedom - but in this rapidly changing world some are always going to get left behind.

Personally I feel a responsibilty to helping those people

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I think there is a lot of homeless people with very severe mental health problems that do prevent them from seeking help/holding down a job etc.

There are also many homless adults who began living on the streets as kids/teenagers after fleeing abusive homes or even being kicked out of there own home. Many of these kids will never have been taught the life skills and coping strategies that kids from a more functional background learn. And they will have probably had a very disrupted education.

I think these problems can be so bad that it is not a case of burrying their head in the sand- they just don;t have the skills to get out of the situation. Yes..these situations creep up on people (just one night on the street turns into a week..then a month) and before you know it they are in a situation with no way out.

We live in an incresingly fast moving and insecure world. Jobs for life/homes for life/relationships for life don't seem to mean anything anymore.

In some ways we, as a society, benefit from this with increased global competitiveness and personal freedom - but in this rapidly changing world some are always going to get left behind.

Personally I feel a responsibilty to helping those people

I abosultely agree with everything you say. Anyone who looks upon the homeless without thinking, "there but for the grace of god go I" or similiar is deluding themselves.

You don't choose which family you are born into, nor do you decide what happens to your family after you're born.

A vast majority of young homeless have fled from abusive families or have been brought up in care homes where they have found themselves through no fault of their own.

Just because you weren't born with a silver spoon in your mouth, it doesn't mean you're not one of the lucky ones.

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I quite often look at these people(and there are many of them these days), and want to know their life story, how did they end up like this, i don't hold with this view that they are all useless drunken scum, we all have a breaking point.

If you volunteer at something like a crisis centre, you can ask them. From my limited experience, it's usually using drink to escape from something, then the drink takes over. It's surprising how many of the men turned to booze after being dumped by their women.

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Anyone who looks upon the homeless without thinking, "there but for the grace of god go I" or similiar is deluding themselves.

I must wholesomely concede this point. I am sympathetic.

It is a combination of emotional makeup & life experience contributing to their plight.

There have been some very measured & well considered points made here, I have known those who are in this position through no fault of their own & those that have not needed to go there but did anyway.

In a lot of cases rehabilitation has been available but declined. This is the really iritating part, but being an armchair critic is easy.

A way of life is sometimes difficult to break, no matter how disagreeable it may seem to outsiders.

This is the frustrating part for me, that even when aid is offered to return to 'normal life' it is often turned away.

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I must wholesomely concede this point. I am sympathetic.

It is a combination of emotional makeup & life experience contributing to their plight.

There have been some very measured & well considered points made here, I have known those who are in this position through no fault of their own & those that have not needed to go there but did anyway.

In a lot of cases rehabilitation has been available but declined. This is the really iritating part, but being an armchair critic is easy.

A way of life is sometimes difficult to break, no matter how disagreeable it may seem to outsiders.

This is the frustrating part for me, that even when aid is offered to return to 'normal life' it is often turned away.

I do agree with your point about help being refused. This does happen but I think sometimes, when these people have got so little in life and so little to look forward to they hang on to the only think they know. For them life on the streets has (unbelievable as it seems) treated them better than the 'normal life' you and I know.

It is very sad but just as some people are so damaged by poor relationships that they never form truly trusting ones again so to do some homeless people reject that 'nomal' life that to them may have meant sexual/physcial and emotional abuse and rejection.

I would much rather see homelessness taking this into account than just offering a roof over their head.

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While the homeless have my sympathies...

I don't agree that you can blame society’s ills such as homeless & drunks to the rise of the BTL investors - that's just plain boll0cks.

The homeless ex servicemen i understand (from my servicemen friends) suffer from the institutionalization of the armed service - they get used to being told exactly what to do and have everything planned for them so when they are discharged they lose the whole support structure - some clearly don't adjust, I the blame is clearly down to the armed services (if any).

there are the homeless who suffer from mental problems or came from broken homes and just plain bad luck.

and there are homeless people who got into that situation from drugs

there's lots of reasons for becoming homeless - BTL is not one of them

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  • 301 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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