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Cpre: Farm 'will Spoil Countryside'

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Chicken farm 'will spoil countryside'

COUNTRYSIDE campaigners have waded in against a giant chicken farm planned for a site near the Huntingdon home of former Prime Minister John Major.

The proposed farm - the size of six football pitches - was branded a blight on the landscape by the Huntingdonshire group of the Campaign to Protect Rural England (CPRE).

Campaigners have joined other objectors to the massive chicken sheds at Lodge Farm in Little Stukeley which could house half a million chickens.

Gareth Ridewood, CPRE's Huntingdonshire group chairman, said: "The proposed development is massive - we're talking about something the size of half a dozen football pitches.

That's right, we can't have farms spoiling the countryside, can we now! They should be built elsewhere, preferably next to the left wing voting trainer toting masses, build farms in the cities! Preserve the countryside in aspic and slowly let it die through suffocation, hoorar!

Why government takes these people seriously is behond me :rolleyes:

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slightly off topic - but when I worked up north at an RAF base there was a chicken farmer who continually phoned to complain about our jets frightening her chickens.

She was from down south and had moved up north to open a smallholding. Unfortunately although she viewed her rural idyll a couple of times, it was always at the weekend. (the Raf famously refuse to work weekends - ask any squaddy). It was only after she moved in she realised she'd bought a farm at the threshold of the bombing range at RAF Tain and her chickens didn't cope well with being strafed by half a dozen GR1s at 20ft :P:P

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Don't know what your interpretation of a "farm" is BB, but stuffing 1/2 million chickens into an area the size of 6 football pitches sounds like a battery farm to me.

It's about as far from a farm as you can get. Those buildings would be more suited to an industrial estate and they wouldn't look out of place.

To be honest I wish they would stop using the term "farm" for them. Chicken "Jail" or "Internment Camp" would be far more apt.

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Don't know what your interpretation of a "farm" is BB, but stuffing 1/2 million chickens into an area the size of 6 football pitches sounds like a battery farm to me.

It's about as far from a farm as you can get. Those buildings would be more suited to an industrial estate and they wouldn't look out of place.

To be honest I wish they would stop using the term "farm" for them. Chicken "Jail" or "Internment Camp" would be far more apt.

Yep the sooner battery "farms" are banned fullstop the better.

This over-intensive farming is also what lies behind bird flu.

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Unless of course you are being sarcastic cos you've read my previous posts :o

No sarcasm intended - I'll make a point of reading your previous posts. :) I also feel strongly about this.

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Oh relief!

Thing is, although the issue isn't specifically related to house prices, IF the problem does lie with intensively reared poultry, then the economic implications are far beyond that of any house price rises. There are also cultural issues as well.

How do you tell a poplace - that is now so accustomed to getting what it wants, when it wants it, at a price that enables massive consumerism - that it can't have it anymore?

It just won't want to hear.

We rely so much on the intensive farming industry to fulfil the consumers needs that it has become an essential part of life today. It's not just a case of people not being able to buy chicken or eggs, the off-shoot produce such as cakes, biscuits, ice-cream, processed foods etc - an endless list - would all disappear off the shelves.

People have been fooling themselves for too long as far as intensive rearing is concerned. It has been a case of "What the eye doesn't see, the heart doesn't grieve over."

Must go - Gotta let my chickens out!

Edited by dipstick

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For me, this poem by William Haskin sums up the modern western culture of today:-

Panem Et Circenses

feed the belly

dazzle the eye

quell the anger

snuff the cry

make the people

forget they die

hide the truth

and spread the lie

take the land

and sell the sky

tell them how

but never why

feed the belly

dazzle the eye

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Those buildings would be more suited to an industrial estate and they wouldn't look out of place.

I agree, although I think they should put them next to the new build flats so they can live along side the battery people :)

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Yep the sooner battery "farms" are banned fullstop the better.

This over-intensive farming is also what lies behind bird flu.

So long as we ban them at the same time as banning "inferior" imports from abroad - otherwise there is little point.

- there is little point banning a particular method of production in this country then still importing from abroad product that would be illegal here..... look at veal for example.

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So long as we ban them at the same time as banning "inferior" imports from abroad - otherwise there is little point.

- there is little point banning a particular method of production in this country then still importing from abroad product that would be illegal here..... look at veal for example.

Totally agree.

For me, this poem by William Haskin sums up the modern western culture of today:-

Panem Et Circenses

feed the belly

dazzle the eye

quell the anger

snuff the cry

make the people

forget they die

hide the truth

and spread the lie

take the land

and sell the sky

tell them how

but never why

feed the belly

dazzle the eye

Thanks Dipstick, great poem. Sums it up.

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Because they vote and make their voices heard politically, and because we don't!

How about we all join the CPRE and turn up their annual meeting? They have 60,000 members, but I bet only a few hundred turn up at meetings. If 200 of us turn up there, it would give them something to think about.

Destroy them from the inside?

It costs £25 to join, so with 60,000 members they have a war chest of £1.5m per year.

That's what we're up against.

Can't find the place and date for the meeting - it's in the members section of their website i think

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How about we all join the CPRE and turn up their annual meeting? They have 60,000 members, but I bet only a few hundred turn up at meetings. If 200 of us turn up there, it would give them something to think about.

Destroy them from the inside?

It costs £25 to join, so with 60,000 members they have a war chest of £1.5m per year.

That's what we're up against.

Can't find the place and date for the meeting - it's in the members section of their website i think

Wouldn't need 200, how about 10 people with PricedOut placards, a photographer and some banners saying people need homes to live in :)

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Wouldn't need 200, how about 10 people with PricedOut placards, a photographer and some banners saying people need homes to live in :)

I'd be up for going. Hand out some flyers to everyone on the way in. Try and make them release the damage they are doing to so many millions of people. They're proud, but they should feel guilty.

If we can get the CPRE to campaign to release some of the 14% of the UK called green belt land... then I'd be happy. IMO is is the green belt that is strangling our cities, forcing up prices even on the edge of towns. This forces the taxpayer to pay huge rents to landlords to house the homeless etc etc rant rant.

Maybe there is a meeting in their HQ in central london - nice that they can afford the rent...

CPRE HQ

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No offence, but I think you're a bit wide of the mark here Buyingbear.

I'm with you on the anti-CPRE sentiment, but what's being proposed is a major industrial development - pure and simple ! Using the word "farm" in this instance is a play on words and doesn't really strengthen your argument. Developments in rural areas are one thing but industrial developments such as that are entireley different.

Personally, I'm against developments of that nature, on that scale, in any location and I'm afraid I back the CPRE on this one (by proxy, anyway :unsure: ).

Edit: typo

Edited by Libertine

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"So long as we ban them at the same time as banning "inferior" imports from abroad - otherwise there is little point."

I definitely agree on this one Lulu. It's the same problem at the moment. What is defined as Free Range in one country, wouldn't meet our free-range guidelines.

Additionally, the bird flu problem is a global issue - if the intensive stock rearing is the problem then imports are not free from the problem anyway?

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I'm with you on the anti-CPRE sentiment, but what's being proposed is a major industrial development - pure and simple ! Using the word "farm" in this instance is a play on words and doesn't really strengthen your argument. Developments in rural areas are one thing but industrial developments such as that are entireley different.

What do they expect? This is the land economy they have encouraged, it's an outcome of their own policies, the countryside cannot be used for housing, they won't allow that, and the cities cannot be used for services or major sites as the land is now too expensive to be economical. So where do they expect these sorts of developments to be built?

They now want to put housing in the cities at high density (like the failed policies of the 1960's), they want business and industrial sites in urban centers, same for distribution sites and transport links, and seeming now they want the farms in the cities too! What gives? There isn't enough land in our urban centers (6% of land) to do all this even if we wanted to, in fact as more greenbelt is allocated year after year their boundaries shrink.

Maybe if the CPRE wasn't so pig headed and actually allowed a number of low impact small holdings companies like the one mentioned couldn't just waltz in and buy their way through the planning process, they are the only one's that have the means to do so. You or I may want to do something 100 times less damaging, or something that will actually enhance the landscape, yet the nimby planning system will prevent us and the CPRE will support the system.

If 30% of people instead of <10% were actually 'allowed' to live in the country you'd find people would actually care a great deal more, instead we have a chemical sodden, economically disintegrating living museum, all set in aspic. There's nothing historical about that place.

Edited by BuyingBear

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I don't understand this argument?

Are you saying that you want battery chicken units to be housed in towns or that you want housing to be allowed on this land? - housing that the majority can't afford because house prices are too high.

Why not complain that housing isn't being built in space occupied by supermarkets? There are enough of these developments shooting up everywhere you look and they take up a heck of a lot of space. These areas are usually the best to be anyway. Good transport links etc, etc.

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I don't understand this argument?

Are you saying that you want battery chicken units to be housed in towns or that you want housing to be allowed on this land? - housing that the majority can't afford because house prices are too high.

I'm asking where exactly people like the CPRE want 'farms' such as the one above to be built, people have suggested 'urban' areas... exactly the same places where they want everything else built, which now includes >70% of new build homes. Land with planning is x200/300 the cost of agricultural land, purely down to artificial scarcity, therefore such land in 'urban' areas is used for £200k cardboard apartments not bloody chicken pens, though in reality there is very little difference between the two, aside from the fact humans can support bigger mortgages than chickens.

Basically this "everything in the cities" mantra breaks down, they have forced development into the cities therefore inflating land values, which is precisely why something the size of six football pitches is not economically viable in towns or cities, it would require hundreds of millions of pounds worth of land. Hence, they locate in the country and buy their way through the planning system.

The CPRE are asking for 10 gallons of water to be crammed into a 3 gallon can, they can spin as much as they like but at the end of the day it can't be done, and when something finally gives they will be soaked. Such are the limits of three spatial dimensions.

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Right, so what you are saying is that urban development is confined within strict boundaries with limited development, thus inflating house prices because there is now a shortage?

We have a mutal disagreement in this respect purely in the fact that I never have believed that there is a shortage of housing. We haven't increased threefold in population size over the last 5 years and there were plenty of them about before that. My previous house for instance had been on the market for 6 years prior to me buying it in 1998.

Go onto any web site advertising houses. There are zillions of them. Trouble is they are too expensive. Nobody is willingly and happily going to take a loss - until they are forced to.

The issue about the battery farms is two fold:

A) It's the consumer who wants these places built. It's them - you - that demands cheap products. This is the price you pay. It may get higher if bird flu is inherent in the intensive unit flocks. A lot higher than you will ever have expected.

B) Nobody wants to live near a battery "farm". Me included. Although, under normal circumstances they are made just to look like huge metal work agricultural buildings. Trouble is, when they clean them out, they stink.

Maybe they should just put them where the majority of the population consume most of the produce from them? In the middle of the towns and cities?

Or are you just angry that something has got planning permission on green belt and that urbanisation doesn't get it?

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Right, so what you are saying is that urban development is confined within strict boundaries with limited development, thus inflating house prices because there is now a shortage?

We have a mutal disagreement in this respect purely in the fact that I never have believed that there is a shortage of housing. We haven't increased threefold in population size over the last 5 years and there were plenty of them about before that.

For the increasing numbers that own two homes I very much doubt they experience a shortage of housing, however we must consider the concentration of ownership rather than average number of homes per capita, and there is a shortage of affordable housing. We've been over this before, shortage of supply also drives perceived shortage, which drives prices ever higher, just like the oil market,

Or are you just angry that something has got planning permission on green belt and that urbanisation doesn't get it?

I'm not angry at all, I find it hilarious; this is basically what the countryside is now about, chicken farms, intensive farming and copious amounts of chemicals. What else is allowed to exist in such an artificial environment?

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So from that statement I take it that you actually think people are right to campaign against the building of them?

And in answer to this question: - "What else is allowed to exist in such an artificial environment?"

We are.

Edited by dipstick

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Yep the sooner battery "farms" are banned fullstop the better.

This over-intensive farming is also what lies behind bird flu.

Sooner killing people for Oil is banned would be even better

This killing for oil is also what lies behind world terrorism

Edited by Catch22

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So from that statement I take it that you actually think people are right to campaign against the building of them?

And in answer to this question: - "What else is allowed to exist in such an artificial environment?"

We are.

Well, indeed, we're creating a whole new Dickensian artificial environment afresh in the cities.

People have the right to campaign for selfish vested interests if they so wish, it doesn't make them virtuous or right, they are still selfish interests no matter how you slice and dice the matter. However, they shouldn't be surprised if past actions boomerang back at them, this is the law of unintended consequences. Logically and economically that chicken farm cannot exist anywhere else, certainly not in the cities because land with permission is now so precious for housing; basic economics dictate that it cannot be wasted on something that could easily be located elsewhere. Whether it should exist at all and whether there should be a demand for its products is a different matter.

Edited by BuyingBear

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