Jump to content
House Price Crash Forum

Morocco - My Next Target


dogbox
 Share

Recommended Posts

IMO this whole Morocco investment is a fraud. A scam which helps a few flippers with them buying off plan and then hyping to stupid brits before selling to them and making a quick dollar.

The initial fraud was on the Spanish market where lots of stupid brits bought overpriced houses. Many of them paid huge prices and then their houses are now almost demolished.

What real estate agencies did was just to export the fraud to Morocco and used some propaganda for inviting people to invest.

If they could, they would export the fraud from Spain to Tunisia, Algeria or wherever they can make some quick buck.

Edited by catara
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 764
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

The initial fraud was on the Spanish market where lots of stupid brits bought overpriced houses. Many of them paid huge prices and then their houses are now almost demolished.

What real estate agencies did was just to export the fraud to Morocco and used some propaganda for inviting people to invest.

If they could, they would export the fraud from Spain to Tunisia, Algeria or wherever they can make some quick buck.

Why all the bitterness/anger/conspiracy theories. We discuss Saidia and Morocco as an exciting investment because that is exactly what it is. Noone truly knows what the outcome of the development will be but there is the chance it will be very very special indeed.

If people have genuine reasons to post, both +ve and -ve then im all for it. However starting unfounded conspiracy theories is of no benefit to anyone. Adidibrown - alot of the people who 'have posted less than 20 posts' are genuine buyers, and this is backed by the fact that they are on an owners mailing list set up for investors in Le Jardin De Fleur...to use the fact that they have less than 20 posts under their belt as reason to suspect that they are 'posing as investors' is very strange.

Dogbox - Continue sharing your research, its appreciated.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The initial fraud was on the Spanish market where lots of stupid brits bought overpriced houses. Many of them paid huge prices and then their houses are now almost demolished.

What real estate agencies did was just to export the fraud to Morocco and used some propaganda for inviting people to invest.

If they could, they would export the fraud from Spain to Tunisia, Algeria or wherever they can make some quick buck.

I must say this bit of teh forum does crack me up.

Catara is this the same "corrupt market" you tell us you are looking to buy into? Mate you are as transparent as a fishtank.

As for Dogbox. I enjoy your posts on Germany and Morocco as a market. What I object to is a group of people using HPC forums to discuss a specific development in order to ramp it up. I cannot see any reason why you cannot just set up a litle website called www.saidiabuyers.com and direct everyone there to talk about the development.....but of course you wont because you are after the publicity of discussing Saidia in public. After all I imagine a few people will have taken a closer look after reading one of your hundreds of posts on the subject.

If lots of people come on to this website who have invested in Morocco and talk about Morocco as a market, in my eyes that is justified. If they are even talking about specific areas then that is even justified. But specific projects I think is highly suspicious and out of place.

It would be like me starting a thread about my business (say it was a plumbers called Greggs). I may encourage my clients and friends to visit HPC and post things like "Greggs do a really great job at knock down prices, it may be worth considering if you are struggling to afford a renovation project". Now I could argue that it just happened that a lot of my clients visited HPC. I could argue that the thread was relevant. It would simply be shameless plugging though.

On the other hand I could set up a thread saying "Plumbers are overpriced in my opinion" or "I woud say you could look around and get it much cheaper elsewhere".

The difference with Saidia is you are shamelessly promoting it as a project rather than coming here to simply discuss the merits of investing in Morocco.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Why all the bitterness/anger/conspiracy theories. We discuss Saidia and Morocco as an exciting investment because that is exactly what it is. Noone truly knows what the outcome of the development will be but there is the chance it will be very very special indeed.

If people have genuine reasons to post, both +ve and -ve then im all for it. However starting unfounded conspiracy theories is of no benefit to anyone. Adidibrown - alot of the people who 'have posted less than 20 posts' are genuine buyers, and this is backed by the fact that they are on an owners mailing list set up for investors in Le Jardin De Fleur...to use the fact that they have less than 20 posts under their belt as reason to suspect that they are 'posing as investors' is very strange.

Dogbox - Continue sharing your research, its appreciated.

I have no doubt you are a genuine investor. I have no qualms about you making a comment on here saying "I have invested in Saidia as well, in my opinion Morocco is a Blah BlahBlah...."

What I object about is posts like "I visited last week and they had done blah blah.....have you heard they are expanding the marina blah blah blah....what plot did you buy.....latest news is that such and such hotel are coming....just in: Prada have decided to put a shop on site.....BLAH BLAH BLAH all shameless marketing crap. Why dont you share this information elsewhere rather than a forum set up for investment/house prices.

There are a lot of people from Brighton on this forum but I am hardly going to start posting "Oh have you seen they have built a new starbucks on the corner of George Street in Hove.....Oh Pizza Express have moved into Seven Dials.....Have you seen the new boats in the marina etc etc. There is a place for sharing this information.

When I say less than 20 posts and posts only on this subject I am pointing out that the only contribution you make on this site is just to come on here to discuss Saidia with Dogbox. This forum hasnt been set up as a Saidia community newsletter or gossip column. It is a serious forum for discussing genuine investment ideas.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I must say this bit of teh forum does crack me up.

Catara is this the same "corrupt market" you tell us you are looking to buy into? Mate you are as transparent as a fishtank.

As for Dogbox. I enjoy your posts on Germany and Morocco as a market. What I object to is a group of people using HPC forums to discuss a specific development in order to ramp it up.

Your problem with Morocco is that it apparently comptetes with Spanish market where you have financial interests (probably you are a flipper on the Spanish market same as other people are flippers in Morocco).

When the flippers are out of Spanish market (as they will at the 4% Euribor interest rate

of next year), I shall restart my search of buying a property in a much cleaner Spanish market. Now the Spanish market is a big fraud and I do not want to pay for speculations made by others.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Anyone new to this forum and reading this thread must think we are head bangers. Seriously, give the offensive remarks a miss and keep to informative posts / views. Those that have invested in Saidia know that the success of our investments is down to the success of the resort. It is only natural that we share information on the progress of Saidia. This is the thread we do it on. If you don't like that then don't read the thread.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Your problem with Morocco is that it apparently comptetes with Spanish market where you have financial interests (probably you are a flipper on the Spanish market same as other people are flippers in Morocco).

When the flippers are out of Spanish market (as they will at the 4% Euribor interest rate

of next year), I shall restart my search of buying a property in a much cleaner Spanish market. Now the Spanish market is a big fraud and I do not want to pay for speculations made by others.

You obviously have no idea about flipping. A flipper buys a property off plan and then sells before completion. At no stage would they be taking a Euro mortgage out. In fact I think less than 5% of house purchases on the costas comes from borrowed Euros so Euribor has very little if no effect.

I dont flip and have never flipped property in Spain or anywhere.

Well, you can always ignore it...

Why would I ignore it when it offers me so much amusement.

Almost as funny as people ploughing money into countries such as Romania B)

Anyone new to this forum and reading this thread must think we are head bangers. Seriously, give the offensive remarks a miss and keep to informative posts / views. Those that have invested in Saidia know that the success of our investments is down to the success of the resort. It is only natural that we share information on the progress of Saidia. This is the thread we do it on. If you don't like that then don't read the thread.

My apologies I'll try and keep my views to myself. I hadnt realised I'd joined a Saidia Information Website.

Please continue as normal with your collective back slapping :rolleyes:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This website is called housepricecrash

Probably like adibrown I find this thread assuming as this thread is biggest fish out of water i've ever seen and its compounded by some of the most ridiculous hype and 'sales talk' (the tunnel by 2008) I have have read.

OK this is the overseas property investment section, but all the same, its like everyone else left the back door open to pop down the shop and in snook dogbox et al and set up home in the spare bedroom.

Edited by BrickingIt
Link to comment
Share on other sites

You obviously have no idea about flipping. A flipper buys a property off plan and then sells before completion. At no stage would they be taking a Euro mortgage out. In fact I think less than 5% of house purchases on the costas comes from borrowed Euros so Euribor has very little if no effect.

I dont flip and have never flipped property in Spain or anywhere.

I did not have time to go in all detail.

thye scenario is:

- flippers flip properties in Spain

- stupid people buy from them at inflated prices or stupid flippers cannot sell the properties before completion

- stupid flippers have to pay the property or they lose the deposit

- if they opay the property they need a mortgage

- the rate is going to skyrocket in Spain so they cannot take the mortgage.

Result: house price crash in Spain, same as in USA now.

I hope now it is clearer...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I did not have time to go in all detail.

thye scenario is:

- flippers flip properties in Spain

- stupid people buy from them at inflated prices or stupid flippers cannot sell the properties before completion

- stupid flippers have to pay the property or they lose the deposit

- if they opay the property they need a mortgage

- the rate is going to skyrocket in Spain so they cannot take the mortgage.

Result: house price crash in Spain, same as in USA now.

I hope now it is clearer...

Yes your right of course. The whole market is run by flippers with Spanish mortgages....no retirees at all or UK investors taking UK mortgages/remortgages. If euribor rises to the heady heights of 4% people are really going to suffer.

Just lets hope that German HPI doesnt happen and the Spanish Gvt cancels the non resident Capital Gains cut in January 07'.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This website is called housepricecrash

Probably like adibrown I find this thread assuming as this thread is biggest fish out of water i've ever seen and its compounded by some of the most ridiculous hype and 'sales talk' (the tunnel by 2008) I have have read.

OK this is the overseas property investment section, but all the same, its like everyone else left the back door open to pop down the shop and in snook dogbox et al and set up home in the spare bedroom.

Sorry, can you say that again in English ?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Almost as funny as people ploughing money into countries such as Romania B)

My apologies I'll try and keep my views to myself. I hadnt realised I'd joined a Saidia Information Website.

Please continue as normal with your collective back slapping :rolleyes:

I dont really understand your point. You are on a thread dedicated to Morocco, and the discussion has concentrated on Saidia - no surprise there seeing as it is the first of the King's Resort releases. Yes this is Housepricecrash but who cares, I intend to research my purchase on any website which makes mention of it. Once other resorts are released then no doubt attention will turn to them (and you may get your wish that debate calms down for a while).

Can we please stop the rubbishing and just discuss, and if you have no interest (and not just directing this at you adidibrown) then just dont read the threads - You clearly feel strongly that people are 'throwing their money away' so why keep coming back. I dont think that Bulgaria is a good investment anymore... I therefore dont regularly read threads on Bulgaria. I guess what I could do is post regularly on how I think everyone is making a mistake and how 'stupid' they all are and roll my eyes at them, but I have better things to do with my time. I read threads on Saidia because I am interested, I find it bizarre that you are too?.....

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I dont really understand your point. You are on a thread dedicated to Morocco, and the discussion has concentrated on Saidia - no surprise there seeing as it is the first of the King's Resort releases. Yes this is Housepricecrash but who cares, I intend to research my purchase on any website which makes mention of it. Once other resorts are released then no doubt attention will turn to them (and you may get your wish that debate calms down for a while).

Can we please stop the rubbishing and just discuss, and if you have no interest (and not just directing this at you adidibrown) then just dont read the threads - You clearly feel strongly that people are 'throwing their money away' so why keep coming back. I dont think that Bulgaria is a good investment anymore... I therefore dont regularly read threads on Bulgaria. I guess what I could do is post regularly on how I think everyone is making a mistake and how 'stupid' they all are and roll my eyes at them, but I have better things to do with my time. I read threads on Saidia because I am interested, I find it bizarre that you are too?.....

You are probably the worst offender Phatpaws (18 posts in this one thread). I've just looked through your 18 posts and see you have added nothing of merit to this forum in terms of opinion other than attacking those that question this threads validity or promote "Andy" the agent and discuss your "plot".

Swapping photos of the development, discussing various plots and clauses in your contract etc all of these things do not add to a discussion on whether Morocco is a good investment or not. It is just tittle tattle between buyers of a project.

I dont know how many times I have to go over this before you understand what I am saying.

You say "Once other resorts are released then no doubt attention will turn to them". This is my point. It hasn't happened with any other resort in any other country and never will....this only happens with Saidia and will only happen with Saidia because Dogbox has bought there and he takes pride in shamelessly promoting it day in day out.

if you have no interest (and not just directing this at you adidibrown) then just dont read the threads - You clearly feel strongly that people are 'throwing their money away' so why keep coming back.

I do have an interest in discussing overseas property and Morocco in general and that is why I come back on here daily but feel that the whole topic has been taken over by the Saidia project.

This is my suggestion....why dont we discuss investment in Morocco on this thread. Dogbox should go and setup another thread calling it "Saidia Information". This would be a thread were you could discuss agents, contracts, pictures of your plot etc. Of course it would look completely and out of place on this housepricecrash website and you guys should go and set up your own site to discuss that kind of information but hey what the heck there is just no getting that part of the argument through to you.

I dont think that Bulgaria is a good investment anymore... I therefore dont regularly read threads on Bulgaria. I guess what I could do is post regularly on how I think everyone is making a mistake and how 'stupid' they all are and roll my eyes at them, but I have better things to do with my time.

You clearly miss the whole point of these forums. If you dont think Bulgaria is a good investment then you should share and debate those opinions with those that do think Bulgaria is a good investment. If people didnt do that then what would be the point of having a forum, you might as well just have a noticeboard where people could post where they were going to invest.

Jeez this sentance is a real insight. You only visit this website and these forums to hear the latest on Saidia and have no other interest in anything else. What a valuable member you are :rolleyes:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes your right of course. The whole market is run by flippers with Spanish mortgages....no retirees at all or UK investors taking UK mortgages/remortgages. If euribor rises to the heady heights of 4% people are really going to suffer.

Just lets hope that German HPI doesnt happen and the Spanish Gvt cancels the non resident Capital Gains cut in January 07'.

The ECB rate goes to 3.5% in December (that is 100% sure), then 3.75 in March and 4% in June.

The interest rate in UK goes to 6% next SUmmer so the remortgages will be at 7%-8% which will make it unprofitable. This will lead to bad crashes in Spain, Cyprus, Morocco, etc.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Adi

I thought it interesting that 30% of the top 30 threads on Channel 4s 'buying overseas' forum, concern Morocco.

I do sympathise with your irritation, but the simple fact is there is significant interest in Moroccan property and seemingly more so than for any other new destination.

Please note there are several Moroccan threads on HPC, it just so happens that the Saidia one is more popular.

I note you are very interested in the Spannish market. Perhaps this explains your irritation with Morocco? This is understandable, folk are very attatched to Spain and anything that could undermine Spannish dominance can unsettle them.

The fact the Moroccans are striving to build a largely middle class up - market tourist proposition also seems to scratch at the bandage.

Dubai investors are similarly sensitive as displayed on the Ch 4 forum. I think they feel threatened that a luxurious property proposition (ie Morocco's Plan Azure sites), much of it built with Dubai money is being constructed with a flight time 60% less than Dubai's.

Lastly some folk investing in Bulgarian property have also taken swipes at the Moroccan lot. Could it be they now recognise that a short season and unplanned down - market touristic sprawl are'nt a good combination?

Edited by dogbox
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Adi

I thought it interesting that 30% of the top 30 threads on Channel 4s 'buying overseas' forum, concern Morocco.

I do sympathise with your irritation, but the simple fact is there is significant interest in Moroccan property and seemingly more so than for any other new destination.

Please note there are several Moroccan threads on HPC, it just so happens that the Saidia one is more popular.

I note you are very interested in the Spannish market. Perhaps this explains your irritation with Morocco? This is understandable, folk are very attatched to Spain and anything that could undermine Spannish dominance can unsettle them.

The fact the Moroccans are striving to build a largely middle class up - market tourist proposition also seems to scratch at the bandage.

Dubai investors are similarly sensitive as displayed on the Ch 4 forum. I think they feel threatened that a luxurious property proposition (ie Morocco's Plan Azure sites), much of it built with Dubai money is being constructed with a flight time 60% less than Dubai's.

Lastly some folk investing in Bulgarian property have also taken swipes at the Moroccan lot. Could it be they now recognise that a short season and unplanned down - market touristic sprawl are'nt a good combination?

Thats more like it. A debate about Morocco and not about the ins and outs of one development.

Interesting you mention Channel 4 Overseas property forum as thats another one where you (AKA Thorr) and Soup Dragon harp on about this Saidia development, keeping it quite cleverly as you state in the top 30 posts.

I must say I admire your marketing skills and have to take my hat off to the time you dedicate to plugging your investment online. My concern is for those left holding property in Morocco once you have flipped and moved on to your next venture.

Spain is a different prospect completely. I have a house I bought quite a few years ago and have no current intention of selling it and have no interest in its value now or whenever. It doesn't irritate me that people are throwing their money into African Developments, I think it is all very charitable and will I am sure turn the country from Third world into Developing State.

It does surprise me though that Saidia investors compare prices in their unbuilt African project with those already built in developed EEC countries.

"you guys should go and set up your own site to discuss that kind of information"

Or alternatively, we (plural) continue as we were and you (singular) go elsewhere....

OK lets put it another way...by all means continue to discuss general investment in Moron-con property on this thread but when discussing the ins and outs of the Saidia Community at least have the decency to set up a seperate thread on this site. I dont want to click on the Moroccon Property thread to see a post between you and Dogbox talking about your kitchen door selection in your new villas.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Adi

I thought it interesting that 30% of the top 30 threads on Channel 4s 'buying overseas' forum, concern Morocco.

Yes, of which your posts on them, as Thorr, make up approximately 80% there of...............

I said all along, and now others at long last are joining me - I detest ramping/flipping. You wouldn't like it done in your back yard, but are smug and selfish enough to play the part of exporting this great British pastime into a 3rd world country.

One of my many customers (Moroccan) very recently told me she detests Speculation. I felt ashamed on behalf of the brit brigade that I know on here to be aware of their plans for Saidia.

What a sad bunch of 'investors' you are.

P.S. BTW, Andy Welland is a Salesman that was his own words on his *very* first post on Morocco - in my experience NEVER trust a Salesman......

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, of which your posts on them, as Thorr, make up approximately 80% there of...............

I said all along, and now others at long last are joining me - I detest ramping/flipping.

P.S. BTW, Andy Welland is a Salesman that was in his own words on his *very* first post on Morocco - in my experience NEVER trust a Salesman......

This is a classic example of Thorrs/Dogbox ramping:

Yes I know Im buying in Saidia Morocco but the exit route is superb and many British agents are available for re - sales and letting.

Get there before the crowd

So he is making out that this is a good investment on the basis that you can exit quickly (preferably before completion)....not really encouraging for anybody looking for long term investment in Saidia or god forbid looking for a holiday home.

"you guys should go and set up your own site to discuss that kind of information"

Or alternatively, we (plural) continue as we were and you (singular) go elsewhere....

Here we go http://saidia.forumup.co.uk/forum-1-saidia.html

Look a whole forum on Saidia....fill your boots.

Of course this doesnt allow you to ramp up your project so is pretty pointless posting on.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

One of my many customers (Moroccan) very recently told me she detests Speculation. I felt ashamed on behalf of the brit brigade that I know on here to be aware of their plans for Saidia.

There are many other brits brigades who screwed up prices everywhere in Europe and beyond.

Ther are blamed everywhere same as everybody hates Californians in USA for over-speculating. Locals cannot afford buying apartments because people like

dogbox wanted a quick money out of anything.

Edited by catara
Link to comment
Share on other sites

One of my many customers (Moroccan) very recently told me she detests Speculation. I felt ashamed on behalf of the brit brigade that I know on here to be aware of their plans for Saidia.

1) 'We' learned about property investment from the Asians, Greeks and Italians. I recall vividly in my first job in North London in the mid eighties speaking to these people and to a Man they all invested in multiple property, Pensions for them were a joke designed to con the unsuspecting Brit who largely only knew Pensions and Endowments. This will be documented by Historians in the future.

After these encounters I always made a point of talking to the staff / owners in Indian restaurants about property and sure enough just about all of them were into B2L before 'we' even knew what B2L was.

2) Biglog can you not see that the investment into infrastructure is pouring money into Moroccan pockets? Why do you think the King is doing this, for his own vanity?

Its been shown time and time again that a good way to kick - start an economy is with mass tourism as the Greek islands and Portugal discovered.

The way forward is not Cuban or N Korean style national 'works'.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi, this message is for Dogbox. I for one consider you to be an invaluable source on information on this site and others - I think you are registered on other forums under a different user name?

I would greatly value your opinion on a dilema which I have at the moment in connection with LJDF on Saidia - I dont feel able to post it on an open forum, I have tried to send you a pm but because Im a new member I don't think I have the right to.

Please could you advise me how best to contact you, are you registered on the Saidia forum? I am the site admin on that one and could send you a pm via that one.

I hope to hear from you.

Kind regards

rorypops

Edited by rorypops
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi, this message is for Dogbox. I for one consider you to be an invaluable source on information on this site and others - I think you are registered on other forums under a different user name?

I would greatly value your opinion on a dilema which I have at the moment in connection with LJDF on Saidia - I dont feel able to post it on an open forum, I have tried to send you a pm but because Im a new member I don't think I have the right to.

Please could you advise me how best to contact you, are you registered on the Saidia forum? I am the site admin on that one and could send you a pm via that one.

I hope to hear from you.

Kind regards

rorypops

Ive tried to PM you, but as many other say on here, IT DOESNT WORK for some reason

Will try and contact you on the other forum but must warn I find that forum very difficult to use

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.





×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.