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DonnieDarker

The Conversation From Hell...parents Emotional Blackmail

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...I has the misfortune to be 'engaged' in the conversation from Hell that most posters here would dread...my mother-in-law haranguing me about buying somewhere.

I have to confess, I was not prepared for it and was caught offguard.

Succeeded in wrecking my weekend and leaving me very very anxious on Sunday.

Donnie is not in a good place right now. Here's some samples of the debate for your mirth:

Her "House prices are still going up".

Me "Not according to our cousin who had his flat valued at 190 a year ago and revalued at 175 last month"

Her "why do you choose to rent in such an expensive flat"

Me "because there is a need for some balance in the quality of my life"

(My private thoughts: because I wont want live somewhere criminalised or some suburban soulless vacuum.)

Her "youre limiting yourself too much with your area. youre not behaving like normal 1st time buyers...teh ones I know are all buying further out (of London)"

Me "....."

(My private thoughts: with almost £100k savings we are not normal FTBs. There's a reason "location" is thrice repeated when referred to property AND I dont want to live in some suburb that the Pet Shop Boys wrote about in the early 90s.

Her "we just want to see you settled"

Me "this emotional blackmail is not very useful"

:o

Writing this now is quite amusing but I have to confess I was really really hurt by the tacit suggestion that I was living life the wrong way, that my priorities were all wrong etc etc. One of the few extravagances I afford myself is that I do rent a nice flat in a nice area. That's about it. Few of my peers or friends are as careful with money and invstments as I am and I'M THE ONE getting stick for not buying a property?!

Please console me that there are others who have been through this kind of abuse.

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...I has the misfortune to be 'engaged' in the conversation from Hell that most posters here would dread...my mother-in-law haranguing me about buying somewhere.

I have to confess, I was not prepared for it and was caught offguard.

Succeeded in wrecking my weekend and leaving me very very anxious on Sunday.

Donnie is not in a good place right now. Here's some samples of the debate for your mirth:

Her "House prices are still going up".

Me "Not according to our cousin who had his flat valued at 190 a year ago and revalued at 175 last month"

Her "why do you choose to rent in such an expensive flat"

Me "because there is a need for some balance in the quality of my life"

(My private thoughts: because I wont want live somewhere criminalised or some suburban soulless vacuum.)

Her "youre limiting yourself too much with your area. youre not behaving like normal 1st time buyers...teh ones I know are all buying further out (of London)"

Me "....."

(My private thoughts: with almost £100k savings we are not normal FTBs. There's a reason "location" is thrice repeated when referred to property AND I dont want to live in some suburb that the Pet Shop Boys wrote about in the early 90s.

Her "we just want to see you settled"

Me "this emotional blackmail is not very useful"

:o

Writing this now is quite amusing but I have to confess I was really really hurt by the tacit suggestion that I was living life the wrong way, that my priorities were all wrong etc etc. One of the few extravagances I afford myself is that I do rent a nice flat in a nice area. That's about it. Few of my peers or friends are as careful with money and invstments as I am and I'M THE ONE getting stick for not buying a property?!

Please console me that there are others who have been through this kind of abuse.

just tel em to fec off.

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just tel em to fec off.

Saying rather sharply, "This emotional blackmail is not very useful" is the polite version of telling your inlaws/parents to f**k off.

I was quite proud of myself when I said that. :rolleyes:

The whole thing was totally surreal. One minute we're having a post-dinner coffee and then next I am getting Paxman'd.

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You need to grow a thicker skin Donnie...............

The boomers are coming across more and more these days as complete and utter hypocrits...........

You face them with the undeniable facts that are missing nowadays and were present when it came to have their turn as ftbs and they generally dont know where to look..........

House prices are stretched to the absolute limit affordability wise and they know it........

Our interest rates are being manipulated and kept artificially low and they know it..........

Inflation is not being estimated properly and the cost of living is making us poorer each year that goes by and they know it............

Low inflation will never let wages catch up anywhere near as much as it has in the past for house buyers and they know it.............

Regards Miser

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You need to grow a thicker skin Donnie...............

You're not wrong.

It is my achilles heel.

Another excerpt:

Her: "So what makes you think prices will go down?"

Me: "Prices are just not sustatinable at the moment. FTB's are at their lowest for 25 years and the average age of a FTb is 36...does that sound healthy or normal?"

The problem I have found with discussing propoerty with your parents is that when I start talking about VIs, sponsored research and that the like of the BBC are really really politicised in their reporting you end up sounding like a crackpot conspiracy theorist. Maybe I am.

Edited by DonnieDarker

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I know how you feel.

For most of my working life I've been priced out of buying anywhere in London so it never really bothered me. In the meantime I've been renting in some so-so flats but great areas.

Now after years of saving I finally have some money behind me and an OK wage, so the family pressure's on to buy somewhere despite my anxiety about the state of the market. I'm priced out of where I currently live but I've found myself wavering and looking at cheaper places where in truth I don't want to live, but I'm just getting so sick of the pitying looks from friends and family.

When will this market stop going up?

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Please console me that there are others who have been through this kind of abuse.

They stopped giving me the abuse when they realised I knew the statistics and the economic theory instead of just what they've read in the papers.

Make sure you are aware of all the latest statistics, and understand what drives the housing market (fundamentals, that kind of thing) and you'll blow all but the most stubbornly stupid out of the water.

MattLG

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Dont know.

I cant hold on any longer than another year. Cant and wont.

It sounds like I'm being a total p*ssy but I cannot deal with the emotional wrangling of waiting much longer.

The fact that family have started giving me grief does not help matters. I spent a lot of Sunday thinking this whole house-buying/no-buying malarkey was some kind of hell or limbo I've been consigned to.

Having decided that the best research is that done by oneself I am going to dip my toes into the market again this summer and get a feel for prices.

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Been there mate,

whatever you say, the response is always "prices always go up over time" and when you try explaining:-

FTBs at an all time low,

BTLs holding it all up with dinishing returns on inflated prices

affordability ratios

VI's

etc

is all you get are knowing smiles and a repeat of "its an investment", its psycotic, people who actually love you and would look out for you no matter what and do anything for you just want you to borrow another £150,000 because proprty always goes up. aaaarrg.

easiest thing i've found is to smile, nod and agree and say, "yes we are looking very hard for the ideal property". then they are satisfied. You could even throw in that you are also looking for a really big mortgage so you can buy a little flat as well to rent out as your pension pot. That will really satisfy them then.

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It sounds like I'm being a total p*ssy but I cannot deal with the emotional wrangling of waiting much longer.

The fact that family have started giving me grief does not help matters. I spent a lot of Sunday thinking this whole house-buying/no-buying malarkey was some kind of hell or limbo I've been consigned to.

It's your money. If your mother in law is so "concerned" can't she put her money where her mouth is?

You buy the flat, but if it is revalued downwards at any point over the next 10 years, she must pay you the shortfall.

If she is so convinced of a rising market she has nothing to lose.

frugalista

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I could go 1 of 2 ways!!!

If my job goes - its looking rocky then I wil just get a 1 way ticket to ANYWHERE with a big wad of cash!!! All my deposit will get spent going on a year holiday somewhere. B)

I despise the fact that I pay this country taxes, :angry:

I despise the fact that what I earn they will tax WITH STEALTH!!! :angry:

I despise the fact that you even get taxed on your savings when you have already payed tax. :angry:

I will then come back home and go on the dole for the rest of my days!!

F*ck em all - I will be BETTER OFF!! :(

TB

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Are they moaning because they think you're spending a lot of money on rent?

Show people facts and figures about the cost of buying vs. the cost of renting.

Factor in repairs, buildings insurance, and anything else extra a homeowner will have to pay), additional contents and car insurance cover for a rougher (cheaper area)

Forget about future falls and rises - sheeple won't get this bit - concentrate on the here and now that it is cheaper to rent.

If you can't prove to them its cheaper then you'll see where they're coming from.

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If this is what you are getting one can only imagine what your wife is getting from her Mum - drip. drip, drip... These kind of 'helpful' conversations can have devstating affects on happily married couples over time.

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Dont know.

I cant hold on any longer than another year. Cant and wont.

It sounds like I'm being a total p*ssy but I cannot deal with the emotional wrangling of waiting much longer.

The fact that family have started giving me grief does not help matters. I spent a lot of Sunday thinking this whole house-buying/no-buying malarkey was some kind of hell or limbo I've been consigned to.

Having decided that the best research is that done by oneself I am going to dip my toes into the market again this summer and get a feel for prices.

Parents are like that Donnie. My mother tried running my life for 36 years. Nothing was good enough unless I got the degree she so craved, and I was expected to settle for a half-baked unhappy life that was "settled". It just went on and on... until she did something so completely beyond the pale that I refused to talk to her for 5 years! I made up and she has finally learned that she MUST listen, so we get on OK now, but that was what it took. Its not that I don't love her, just that ... she mentally totally inflexible, (with the infuriating tendency to declare that she can see both sides of everything so therefore must be right about everything!) I am not saying that I am any happier now but I am a lot less stressed, and I am miserable IN MY OWN WAY. Its a bit trickier with in-laws because the woman you love depends on them, but I do like your "this emotional blackmail isn't helping" line.

Elizabeth's tips for dealing with impossibly interfering no-it-all parents:

This business of your fussiness, I don't know whether you have or are intending towards sprogs... but no doubt she is :o ask her would she like her grandkids to grow up on an estate attending a school where the kids carried knives and having their own latchkey because their parents don't get home till after dark because of the commute. There is a reality that underlies your decision to buy in a nice suburb closer to your source of income. Ask her how she would feel about you guys paying so much for the morgage that you found it hard to put shoes on any grandkids feet - which at current prices is a reality, even in the rubbish areas. I always find that their is joy to be had in a little straightforward honesty... or you could always try start the conversation by setting the boundaries "the one thing I don't want to talk about is property". If the topic comes up, get up and walk out the door (smoking is an advantage in this situation!). If she comes after you (as she may well), "Its not your business" etc etc etc. In other words make the whole conversation a principle of "this emotional blackmail isn't helping" and "your really upsetting me rather than "why doesn't Donny buy a house".

Those are my tips, but you do what you want :)

I always find that dignified crying helps (totally calm and rational point making while tears are pouring down your cheeks)... but I guess your not premenstral!

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It's your money. If your mother in law is so "concerned" can't she put her money where her mouth is?

You buy the flat, but if it is revalued downwards at any point over the next 10 years, she must pay you the shortfall.

If she is so convinced of a rising market she has nothing to lose.

frugalista

:lol: excellent advice.

Just remember you don't have to justify yourself to anyone.I have diddly squat in my pot but if I had nearly 100k I wouldn't feel pressurised into anything and I really don't see the rush.

Does your wife feel the same way as her parents?

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It's your money. If your mother in law is so "concerned" can't she put her money where her mouth is?

You buy the flat, but if it is revalued downwards at any point over the next 10 years, she must pay you the shortfall.

If she is so convinced of a rising market she has nothing to lose.

frugalista

took the words right out of my mouth.

ask them to stump up the deposit while they're at it... they must have a load of equity locked up in their home - wouldn't it be better to invest it in setting up their dear daughter.

Make sure you're the first to bring up the subject everytime you see them.

Next topic is grandchildren btw. :D

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Guest Winners and Losers

I could go 1 of 2 ways!!!

If my job goes - its looking rocky then I wil just get a 1 way ticket to ANYWHERE with a big wad of cash!!! All my deposit will get spent going on a year holiday somewhere. B)

I despise the fact that I pay this country taxes, :angry:

I despise the fact that what I earn they will tax WITH STEALTH!!! :angry:

I despise the fact that you even get taxed on your savings when you have already payed tax. :angry:

I will then come back home and go on the dole for the rest of my days!!

F*ck em all - I will be BETTER OFF!! :(

TB

Make sure you claim rent assistance too!

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You could always tell them that you are waiting for them to peg out, so you can have their house. That might stop the conversation.

Seriously though, I wonder if it's because you are asset poor, but cash rich, maybe a little jelously in there ?

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Those are my tips, but you do what you want :)

I always find that dignified crying helps (totally calm and rational point making while tears are pouring down your cheeks)... but I guess your not premenstral!

Awesome post :lol:

You could always tell them that you are waiting for them to peg out, so you can have their house. That might stop the conversation.

Seriously though, I wonder if it's because you are asset poor, but cash rich, maybe a little jelously in there ?

I have not discussed with them how much in savnigs I and my fioncee have (Ive made it sound like Im already married for simplicities sake).

It's none of their business IMO and will only make them say "BuyBuyBuy".

I thought I had much thicker skin but as I say I was caught completely unawares. As someone else commented the whole situation is quite psychotic because these are people who'd do anything they could to help me if I was in trouble. It is emotionally draining though....however, some very good tips in this post from other contributors. ;)

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Property can be a terrible millstone - especially if you overpaid for it. If you were to buy now it sounds like you know you'd be regretting it for a decade or two. Remind yourself of that if you need some self assurance.

At the end of the day you hold the cards ;)

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Like MattLG and SarahBell, I too would be inclined to persist with the facts-and-figures approach.

I'd bet that your in-laws have received plenty of bad news on the household bills front over the past few weeks. Gas, electricity, Council Tax, etc.

I'd also bet that they're old enough to remember the high inflation of the 70s. So they probably remember prices rising by teens of percent once before.

They got through it. It didn't matter that much back then. Wages and salaries rose to match.

Well, this time they won't. It really is different this time.

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Donnie, you're in an incredible position with a huge deposit - but surely the main thing is how does your fiance feel about this?

It amazes me that just two short years ago no one was advising me to buy property, but now they are signs of prices falling/peaking everyone tells you to buy buy buy...

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If this is what you are getting one can only imagine what your wife is getting from her Mum - drip. drip, drip... These kind of 'helpful' conversations can have devstating affects on happily married couples over time.

Maybe just maybe the wife is going to her parents and asking them to put pressure on Mr Darko to buy.

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  • 301 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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