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Taxing The Btl'er In The Forthcoming Budget

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If some (new) form of Tax was levied on BTL's Gordon could then say he was helping FTB's and also collect additional revenue as well? Although it wouldn't be good for Houseprices

But young people don't vote so why the hell would he do that?

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ah but the FTBer is becoming older as this mess continues.

Indeed, but they are still the same generation.

Realistically, the baby boomers hold the biggest proportion of the vote and will continue to do so for the next 20 years or so, when they start dying off in significant numbers.

Today's under 35s can look forward to being politically marginalised for most of their lives. This is IMO one of the main reasons why they don't bother to vote in the first place. Catch 22.

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Gordon is like a cornered cat.

Being cornered by the entire voting masses.

He's going to jump at one demographic or another for tax hikes.... which way will he jump??

BTLs might be a good bet. The proportion of the voting population with a BTL is still low, but the potential revenues are fairly substantial... especially if he taxes them on current valuations.

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But young people don't vote so why the hell would he do that?

Because their parents do!

How it could be spun:

"This will hit the people who've made housing so expensive that parents are forced to remortage or downsize in order for their children to buy a home"

"This will help prevent parents from having to raid the money for their pensions that they have locked away in property because they have to help their children get a foot on the ladder"

"These people are the reason your children can't afford to buy a house"

By doing this he will shift blame for HPI from himself to the Fat Cat BTL'ers (who possibly aren't Labour voters anyway), there by washing his hands of the whole affair a la Pontius Pilate...

Oh and most BTL'ers are under 50, where as most parents helping their kids out are likely to be 50+, and it tends to be the older people that go out and vote.

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simple

abolish the ability of the BTL'er to write off the interest against the rental income

after all, owner occupiers don't get any interest relief since MIRAS was scrapped.

i'm sure gordy could spin it accordingly :P

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If some (new) form of Tax was levied on BTL's Gordon could then say he was helping FTB's and also collect additional revenue as well? Although it wouldn't be good for Houseprices

Labour would never introduce such a measure. Consumer spending is holding up the economy, and massive house prices are fuelling this..... Labour want this to continue for as long as possible.

Look at their current measures - artificially low inflation meaning rates are kept low. Floods of immigrants coming into the country, who all need to be housed - causing housing shortages. Theyre doing whatever they can to keep house prices high. A tax on BTL?!! Yes thats what we need, but it wont happen in the current climate.

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Labour would never introduce such a measure. Consumer spending is holding up the economy, and massive house prices are fuelling this..... Labour want this to continue for as long as possible.

Or not as the case maybe, Stag, MFI, B&Q, etc.

Seems like the BTL crowd aren't holding anything up apart from prices (at the moment).

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He did do the SIPPS u-turn.

SIPP's shouldn't have even been conceived never mind almost making it into policy. In anycase we still got REIT's instead which sounds even worse to me.

Edited by simon99

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simple

abolish the ability of the BTL'er to write off the interest against the rental income

after all, owner occupiers don't get any interest relief since MIRAS was scrapped.

i'm sure gordy could spin it accordingly :P

I don't think he could legislate against a specific type of investment. You could only do it on a general basis and that would impact any business which offset loans against income.

Not a great idea.

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I think this years budget will be about protecting the economy. Not about doing a smash and grab on investments.

If there is something GB introduces to collect an increased revenue expect a war with Iran in two years.

I would like to see him reward savers, he's always banging on about prudence but then seems to discourage it!

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Because their parents do!

How it could be spun:

"This will hit the people who've made housing so expensive that parents are forced to remortage or downsize in order for their children to buy a home"

"This will help prevent parents from having to raid the money for their pensions that they have locked away in property because they have to help their children get a foot on the ladder"

"These people are the reason your children can't afford to buy a house"

By doing this he will shift blame for HPI from himself to the Fat Cat BTL'ers (who possibly aren't Labour voters anyway), there by washing his hands of the whole affair a la Pontius Pilate...

Oh and most BTL'ers are under 50, where as most parents helping their kids out are likely to be 50+, and it tends to be the older people that go out and vote.

What you mean suddenly change the mantra from: "Cheap housing bad, expensive housing good" to: "Cheap housing good, expensive housing bad"?

I'd like to see it, But I think they'll be doing that shortly after hell freezes over, pigs take up aviation and the cows return to their place of residence.

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simple

abolish the ability of the BTL'er to write off the interest against the rental income

after all, owner occupiers don't get any interest relief since MIRAS was scrapped.

i'm sure gordy could spin it accordingly :P

This would never happen. First, it means treating BTL differently to other businesses (who can write off their interest payments as expenses). And secondly, it would literally bankrupt thousands within weeks. It would destroy their cash flow.

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This would never happen. First, it means treating BTL differently to other businesses (who can write off their interest payments as expenses). And secondly, it would literally bankrupt thousands within weeks. It would destroy their cash flow.

...well because all those landlords would try not to be bankrupted, I suspect they would all raise their rents as soon as they could.

Basically the poor old tenant would pay the tax bill. Not good for the labour party.

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I don't think he could legislate against a specific type of investment. You could only do it on a general basis and that would impact any business which offset loans against income.

Not a great idea.

nonsense

BTL is not classed as a "business"

losses cannot be offset against other income.

there are specific rules such as the 10% wear and tear allowance that apply to residential furnished rented property, so therefore why not disallow interest to be w/o vs the income, or phase it out over time?

Edited by gasket37

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But young people don't vote so why the hell would he do that?

Front cover of one or two papers today (can't remember which) has Gordie advocating dropping the voting age to 16.

There was a political movement in Germany recently to drop the vote to 16 precisely to counter the numerically superior boomer vote, and because of the way the future of young people is being mortgaged to pay for present consumption and "investment" in housing.

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And secondly, it would literally bankrupt thousands within weeks. It would destroy their cash flow.

As the Sex Pistols said "Ever had the feeling you've been cheated?" :P

Seriously i'd put nothing past Nulab as they are gradually backed into the corner and need to raise extra taxes :(

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As the Sex Pistols said "Ever had the feeling you've been cheated?" :P

Seriously i'd put nothing past Nulab as they are gradually backed into the corner and need to raise extra taxes :(

More likey their plans for ID cards and a population register show you who will be paying the taxes! Tenants! (see below!)

Edited by brainclamp

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He did do the SIPPS u-turn.

He did, but that was more to do with the fact that it was a 'rich to profit only' tax break, it wasn't something that was nessesarily going to be benificial to your average mortgaged to the hilt BTLer.

If he started to enforce heavier taxation on BTLers he would be targeting the people most likely to keep him in office.

The Tory's and David Cameron are a big threat to Gordon Brown, the voters who are most likely to cross over to the Tory camp are (I would say) the BTLers, middle aged, middle class. He definately won't want to upset them.

On the other hand, if it moves, he usually taxes it, so I guess it's fair game. Also, we are more than 3 years from the next general election, good time to get those unpopular taxes in place.

If he did do it though, I think he may do it by giving the local councils more power, rather than dirty his own hands. They may target the BTLers and second home owners as they are desperately short of money now they have to pay for their employees pensions out of council tax contributions and some councils are concerned about the locals not being able to buy local property.

LG

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nonsense

BTL is not classed as a "business"

losses cannot be offset against other income.

there are specific rules such as the 10% wear and tear allowance that apply to residential furnished rented property, so therefore why not disallow interest to be w/o vs the income, or phase it out over time?

Nonsense. BTL is classed as a business and as with all businesses losses can be offset against future profits.

What you cannot do is use business 1 to offset its profits using the losses of business 2. It also means that you can't offset your BTL losses against your PAYE tax (that way lies madness or at best the Australian tax system).

Edited by eek

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  • 301 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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