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SHORTAGES - Construction Materials & Lorry Driver Shortage Set to Continue, and Prices Could Keep Rising


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SHORTAGES - Construction Materials Shortage Set to Continue, and Prices Could Keep Rising

https://www.homebuilding.co.uk/news/construction-materials-shortage

 Lorry driver shortage: UK government and retailers in emergency talks  

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/jun/28/lorry-driver-shortage-uk-government-and-retailers-in-emergency-talks-covid-brexit

Edited by Saving For a Space Ship
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1 minute ago, phantominvestor said:

As with any "labour shortage", the shortage would disappear pretty quickly if they paid properly. The shortage is shortage of people willing to take a low salary.

As clear as night and day, you'd have thought.

Sadly, no. For the Tory boys it's just another opportunity to bring in more immigrants.

Quote

Defra is also considering putting drivers on the official shortage occupation list to help make it easier to bring in workers from overseas.

 

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17 minutes ago, phantominvestor said:

As with any "labour shortage", the shortage would disappear pretty quickly if they paid properly. The shortage is shortage of people willing to take a low salary.

Lorry driving pays pretty well afaik

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6 minutes ago, phantominvestor said:

As with any "labour shortage", the shortage would disappear pretty quickly if they paid properly. The shortage is shortage of people willing to take a low salary.

 

I think this is at least partly true. But no matter what you pay there simply is not enough drivers, especially HGV all classes to go around.

It has all happened so quickly and we are all finding it difficult to keep our business's going at the same time as just managing to satisfy demand. I have had an employee hand in his notice today and our pallets were not collected till very late.

The answer all round is to raise our prices and not by the 7 to 10% everyone is doing but by the 25% plus that is really needed to maintain our profit margins and increase wages/investment etc.

We are just coming onto the second round of price increases this year for some companies. I had originally tried to last the year without a price increase but will be increasing on 1st July by 15% on average. It will be interesting to see if it detrimentally affects turnover. If it does not, why did I not increase by more? Elasticity of demand?

We are in very strange times.

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4 minutes ago, Flat Bear said:

 

I think this is at least partly true. But no matter what you pay there simply is not enough drivers, especially HGV all classes to go around.

It has all happened so quickly and we are all finding it difficult to keep our business's going at the same time as just managing to satisfy demand. I have had an employee hand in his notice today and our pallets were not collected till very late.

The answer all round is to raise our prices and not by the 7 to 10% everyone is doing but by the 25% plus that is really needed to maintain our profit margins and increase wages/investment etc.

We are just coming onto the second round of price increases this year for some companies. I had originally tried to last the year without a price increase but will be increasing on 1st July by 15% on average. It will be interesting to see if it detrimentally affects turnover. If it does not, why did I not increase by more? Elasticity of demand?

We are in very strange times.

All your competitors will have to increase prices by a very similar number, but all the other products your customers will purchase will also go up so theoretically your sales will go down.

You will also have fewer customers as the population goes down but your QOL may improve

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35 minutes ago, Saving For a Space Ship said:

SHORTAGES - Construction Materials Shortage Set to Continue, and Prices Could Keep Rising

https://www.homebuilding.co.uk/news/construction-materials-shortage

 Lorry driver shortage: UK government and retailers in emergency talks  

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/jun/28/lorry-driver-shortage-uk-government-and-retailers-in-emergency-talks-covid-brexit

Good Price? Everything is relative.

Less than one year ago I was paying less than $1000 dollars for a 20ft container. Last October I paid $1200 dollars and was annoyed at the increase.

Move forward to this morning and I have just paid $7400 dollars and I am very happy about this because generally they are now $8000 plus.

In the end everything will work its way through the system, and I would expect freight prices to come back down to realistic levels, but at what level the new realistic market price will end up I can only guess. The time frame is even harder to predict.

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8 hours ago, Flat Bear said:

Good Price? Everything is relative.

Less than one year ago I was paying less than $1000 dollars for a 20ft container. Last October I paid $1200 dollars and was annoyed at the increase.

Move forward to this morning and I have just paid $7400 dollars and I am very happy about this because generally they are now $8000 plus.

Seems like the perfect anecdote to the way people live. 
If we obtain a roof over our heads, we're not happy because the neighbour or friend/colleague/relative has somewhere a little larger with a nicer garden, and a better car, or has a bit more disposable income. We're agitated because we think someone else has it better. But then say that person loses their home, or becomes incredibly sick, that's when you start appreciating what you have. Relativity's a funny old thing.

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9 hours ago, Si1 said:

Lorry driving pays pretty well afaik

How much is pretty well though? I tend to agree with @phantominvestorpretty well means we would all be doing it. The market would then find an equilibrium with pay and benefits.

Edited by tep1
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14 minutes ago, tep1 said:

How much is pretty well though? I tend to agree with @phantominvestorpretty well means we would all be doing it. The market would then find an equilibrium with pay and benefits.

The average is low 30k which for a job without a boss micro managing your work and a radio in the cab isn't bad, much better so if you live in part of the country with low living costs. 

It costs a few thousand pounds to qualify, that's if you pass it first time. Realistically you need to be a bit of a petrol head, and/or enjoy your own company. A lot of mensa members who don't like working in offices do it.

I know someone who does it. Sometimes he's on nights sometimes on days. The antisocial hours can mean he doesn't see much of his family during the week. Also his wife had to cut up his credit card as he was spending too much on trucker food at motorway services to get him through the long boring shifts. He enjoys it. I met another bloke who hated it but needed it to pay the mortgage.

 

Edited by Si1
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21 minutes ago, tep1 said:

How much is pretty well though? I tend to agree with @phantominvestorpretty well means we would all be doing it. The market would then find an equilibrium with pay and benefits.

Prices will have to go up, and for everything all food all clothing all consumer goods so people would have less for their money, consumption will go down, and so all government revenue 

Edited by shlomo
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9 hours ago, phantominvestor said:

As with any "labour shortage", the shortage would disappear pretty quickly if they paid properly. The shortage is shortage of people willing to take a low salary.

I am glad you want pay drivers more. How much more are you ready to pay? 

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3 minutes ago, shlomo said:

Prices will have to go up, and for everything all food all clothing all consumer goods so people would have less for their money 

We should be thankful that debt is cheap to cover the increase in living costs! </sarcasm> But your point is more an outcome of excessive money printing and stagnating pay. 

 

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9 hours ago, Flat Bear said:

Good Price? Everything is relative.

Less than one year ago I was paying less than $1000 dollars for a 20ft container. Last October I paid $1200 dollars and was annoyed at the increase.

Move forward to this morning and I have just paid $7400 dollars and I am very happy about this because generally they are now $8000 plus.

In the end everything will work its way through the system, and I would expect freight prices to come back down to realistic levels, but at what level the new realistic market price will end up I can only guess. The time frame is even harder to predict.

Isn't there a lot of hoarding of containers in supply chains causing price increases?

A bit like the TPM market since Microsoft enforced a minimum security level for a Windows 11 upgrade. A lot of scalpers have been buying up the market and drip feeding them back to the market at higher prices.  Cynically, it wouldn't surprise me if there are alternative powers at force here.

 

 

 

 

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Went around 10 diy stores yesterday in Yorkshire for a bag of cement to finish off a project at home with no luck , even tried to borrow a bag from a local building site near us which I was informed was shutting down apart from security work due to lack of materials.

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I’ve got no issue with the market finding the correct rate to pay lorry drivers and a load of other jobs that cheap EU workers have suppressed for years. It’s these distortions that have kept goods and services so low meaning people have more money to throw at property, it will just need to rebalance.

If I were a lorry driver I would be annoyed, having just had a terrible time dealing with customs since Brexit (remember the Dover debacle at the end of Dec), but you are about to get a decent pay day for your troubles and the first thing the powers that be want to do is invite a specific load of cheap labour back into the country just to deny that from you. Also drivers were never really recognised during lockdown - we had clap for the NHS but frankly compared to the lorry drivers they were almost non essential. Imagine if all the hospitals had closed during the pandemic - bad for those who were sick, but then compare it to if all the lorry drivers had stopped working - nation anarchy within days.

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1 minute ago, LetsBuild said:

I’ve got no issue with the market finding the correct rate to pay lorry drivers and a load of other jobs that cheap EU workers have suppressed for years. It’s these distortions that have kept goods and services so low meaning people have more money to throw at property, it will just need to rebalance.

If I were a lorry driver I would be annoyed, having just had a terrible time dealing with customs since Brexit (remember the Dover debacle at the end of Dec), but you are about to get a decent pay day for your troubles and the first thing the powers that be want to do is invite a specific load of cheap labour back into the country just to deny that from you. Also drivers were never really recognised during lockdown - we had clap for the NHS but frankly compared to the lorry drivers they were almost non essential. Imagine if all the hospitals had closed during the pandemic - bad for those who were sick, but then compare it to if all the lorry drivers had stopped working - nation anarchy within days.

Lorry drivers just did their normal job during the pandemic and generally raked it in. I'm grateful for them sticking at it but it wasn't high risk or anything. They weren't doing 30 hour shifts in intensive care.

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22 minutes ago, tep1 said:

We should be thankful that debt is cheap to cover the increase in living costs! </sarcasm> But your point is more an outcome of excessive money printing and stagnating pay. 

 

With fixed money (and its velocity), someone needs to be paid less for someone else to be paid more.

With money printing everyone can be paid more but the money is worth less. So the same is true but in real terms, someone needs to be able to buy less for someone else to be able to buy more. Money is just medium of exchange, creating new money has not impact on the economy in the long term. 

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47 minutes ago, slawek said:

With fixed money (and its velocity), someone needs to be paid less for someone else to be paid more.

With money printing everyone can be paid more but the money is worth less. So the same is true but in real terms, someone needs to be able to buy less for someone else to be able to buy more. Money is just medium of exchange, creating new money has not impact on the economy in the long term. 

Money isn't just a medium of exchange. It's also a unit of account and a store of value. Money is created and destroyed on a continuous basis, inside and outside of the banking system.

Create too much and you get inflation, destroy too much and you get a recession.

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5 minutes ago, zugzwang said:

Money isn't just a medium of exchange. It's also a unit of account and a store of value. Money is created and destroyed on a continuous basis, inside and outside of the banking system.

Create too much and you get inflation, destroy too much and you get a recession.

Yes but if you stop creating or destroying money, after some time everything will return to the state before with only prices being higher or lower. In the real term nothing would have changed. It is just like adding or removing zero to every note, bank account, debt, price. 

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12 hours ago, Saving For a Space Ship said:

SHORTAGES - Construction Materials Shortage Set to Continue, and Prices Could Keep Rising

https://www.homebuilding.co.uk/news/construction-materials-shortage

 Lorry driver shortage: UK government and retailers in emergency talks  

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/jun/28/lorry-driver-shortage-uk-government-and-retailers-in-emergency-talks-covid-brexit

Reminds me of the farmers saying every year prices will go up because it's not rained/wasn't sunny enough


meanwhile....

Image

 

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1 minute ago, slawek said:

Yes but if you stop creating or destroying money, after some time everything will return to the state before with only prices being higher or lower. In the real term nothing would have changed. It is just like adding or removing zero to every note, bank account, debt, price. 

You can't stop creating and destroying money!

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24 minutes ago, zugzwang said:

You can't stop creating and destroying money!

The current modus operandi of the banking system is to increase money supply a few percent per a year to have around 2% inflation. What we have experienced recently was 10-20% jump in money supply, which will feed through the system until it reaches the previous dynamic steady state eventually.   

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