TheCountOfNowhere Posted January 26, 2021 Share Posted January 26, 2021 11 hours ago, Insane said: I don't understand what you mean but thank you for making that clear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamnumerate Posted January 26, 2021 Share Posted January 26, 2021 15 hours ago, Insane said: I think we agree on a lot of things we just have different ideas of what was good/bad old Labour new Labour Tory-lite ect. I think Tax Credits was meant well , but what a mess it turned out. Apparently it was costed at £1 Billion a year and now costs £30 Billion. Due to employers changing the way they employed people for them to pay as little as possible and the low paid workers to get as much as possible in Tax Credits topping up the wages. Why pay one person a decent wage plus sick pay ,pension contributions , holiday pay ect when you can have 3 part times make sure they get 16 (now 20 hours) hours a week work and let the Tax Payer pay the rest. I have heard of many situations where people cut their working week as there was no point in working any more hours as what you earned extra you lost on TC. Great if you are in the TC group horrendous if your not but needing full time work and trying to compete with those very flexible low paid. A lot of the low paid employment is now dependent on TC like a person hooked on Heroin it is so difficult to get back off it. I believe TC was the back bone of the Zero Hours Contracts without TC firms would not have been so able to introduce them. I agreed with the minimum wage (funny how the Tory's did not at the time but do now) the only problem was it became a default wage for many as well as putting a floor on wages it also had the impact of many finding wages which had been higher dropping down to it. To be honest I really don't think that many people were that interested in Iraq or what was going on in the middle East as it did not impact them directly. I and many people I know are ex Labour voters and Iraq never comes up when we discuss why we are ex Labour. That might sound selfish but people are selfish. I think Labour blew their chances in 2010 by their attitude towards average everyday people when immigration came up we were told we were bigoted, racist, little Englanders and Lazy. Do you remember Gordon Browns hick up when he agreed and nodded his head with a woman saying there was to much immigration, when he thought the cameras were off after speaking nicely to her he called her a Bigot. Positive Discrimination in jobs ect is Discrimination if your not in the right group. Labour did to much of this kind of policy. Today I think people have had it up to the back teeth with the whole lot in Westminster , Labour , Liberal and Tory. But will vote for the best of a bad bunch. At present that is the Tory party. Labour say they lost the working class vote. But they never say what it was they did/did not do, said/did not say to the working class. It is just a chestnut they roll out with little thought. Well let's be honest they did not lose the working class vote they lost the white working class vote. They concentrated on Minorities and told the working class they had white privilege. Today they have still not learnt their lesson and so therefore are still unelectable. We are in the middle of a major Pandemic as we all know. Yet this week I have seen on the internet no less than 5 yes 5 Bame members of parliament declare that the pandemic is due to structural racism and they have declared this in the house of commons. One MP who is currently waiting a criminal court case for allegedly obtaining a council house by fraud asked that Bame people get the jab before others. Do you really think the average white working class person is going to vote for a party that harbours so many race baiting racist mps ? Until Labour can cleanse itself of such nonsense it has no chance of office. +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamnumerate Posted January 26, 2021 Share Posted January 26, 2021 11 hours ago, Si1 said: As Norman Tebbit said, Cameron has no leadership. He just takes the path of least resistance without any longer term vision or strategy. Help to Buy is absolutely characteristic of his style. Very true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearishonhouses Posted January 27, 2021 Share Posted January 27, 2021 On 25/01/2021 at 13:06, 12fixer said: Around Bristol the increase in people living in vans is huge, they are every where, you can spot them by the giveaway flu on the roof. It never seems to be mentioned on the TV. News, perhaps the journos aren't aware of the extent of it, although they can't miss the ones on The Downs, you would think it would be a top news story and something should be down about it now. https://www.google.com/maps/@51.4776043,-2.6178926,3a,75y,349.01h,79.99t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1slX8yUv_7Tk7pog7ZTzqhoA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192 Love this one - close the back door and no-one even knows it's a camper van! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12fixer Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 On 27/01/2021 at 16:18, bearishonhouses said: Love this one - close the back door and no-one even knows it's a camper van! Haha, that's it, many build them what they call 'stealth' so no one would know, perhaps to stop being bothered by police / public? I have heard of some putting ladders on the roof purely for this reason, LOL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spyguy Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 On 25/01/2021 at 16:44, TheCountOfNowhere said: Woohoo! Steers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spyguy Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 On 26/01/2021 at 01:25, Insane said: I think we agree on a lot of things we just have different ideas of what was good/bad old Labour new Labour Tory-lite ect. I think Tax Credits was meant well , but what a mess it turned out. Apparently it was costed at £1 Billion a year and now costs £30 Billion. Due to employers changing the way they employed people for them to pay as little as possible and the low paid workers to get as much as possible in Tax Credits topping up the wages. Why pay one person a decent wage plus sick pay ,pension contributions , holiday pay ect when you can have 3 part times make sure they get 16 (now 20 hours) hours a week work and let the Tax Payer pay the rest. I have heard of many situations where people cut their working week as there was no point in working any more hours as what you earned extra you lost on TC. Great if you are in the TC group horrendous if your not but needing full time work and trying to compete with those very flexible low paid. A lot of the low paid employment is now dependent on TC like a person hooked on Heroin it is so difficult to get back off it. I believe TC was the back bone of the Zero Hours Contracts without TC firms would not have been so able to introduce them. I agreed with the minimum wage (funny how the Tory's did not at the time but do now) the only problem was it became a default wage for many as well as putting a floor on wages it also had the impact of many finding wages which had been higher dropping down to it. To be honest I really don't think that many people were that interested in Iraq or what was going on in the middle East as it did not impact them directly. I and many people I know are ex Labour voters and Iraq never comes up when we discuss why we are ex Labour. That might sound selfish but people are selfish. I think Labour blew their chances in 2010 by their attitude towards average everyday people when immigration came up we were told we were bigoted, racist, little Englanders and Lazy. Do you remember Gordon Browns hick up when he agreed and nodded his head with a woman saying there was to much immigration, when he thought the cameras were off after speaking nicely to her he called her a Bigot. Positive Discrimination in jobs ect is Discrimination if your not in the right group. Labour did to much of this kind of policy. Today I think people have had it up to the back teeth with the whole lot in Westminster , Labour , Liberal and Tory. But will vote for the best of a bad bunch. At present that is the Tory party. Labour say they lost the working class vote. But they never say what it was they did/did not do, said/did not say to the working class. It is just a chestnut they roll out with little thought. Well let's be honest they did not lose the working class vote they lost the white working class vote. They concentrated on Minorities and told the working class they had white privilege. Today they have still not learnt their lesson and so therefore are still unelectable. We are in the middle of a major Pandemic as we all know. Yet this week I have seen on the internet no less than 5 yes 5 Bame members of parliament declare that the pandemic is due to structural racism and they have declared this in the house of commons. One MP who is currently waiting a criminal court case for allegedly obtaining a council house by fraud asked that Bame people get the jab before others. Do you really think the average white working class person is going to vote for a party that harbours so many race baiting racist mps ? Until Labour can cleanse itself of such nonsense it has no chance of office. TCs were costed at a 200m increase to the existing in work benefits, mainly family allowance. It's hard to be clear, up to date spending on in work benefits. Social spending which covers pension is about 30% of ukgov spending. Education is a good 10% Both were going up 5% in real terms from 2000. Insane, as other than a large deficit theresvery little to show. Ditto healthcare spending. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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