Anecdotes of Increasingly Desperate Housing Situations / Acts

[Insane]

1 hour ago, A17 said:

It's the people who boast about how much their house has gone up in value, but can't link that to why they have their 23 and 26 year old children still living there that crack me up.

23 and 26 Bumped into many people who have offspring in their 30's and 40's still at home or who have moved back home. I did it once in my 40's for a while I was embarrassed at first but then realised it had become the norm.  

[iamnumerate]

24 minutes ago, A17 said:

It's the people who boast about how much their house has gone up in value, but can't link that to why they have their 23 and 26 year old children still living there that crack me up.

 

It makes me despair to be honest

[Insane]

1 minute ago, Freki said:

Would the UK be able to shift to a new model? In France it is common to buy a plot of land and get the house you want / can afford built on it. In some parts like the South, you won't have 2 identical houses. I have seen a similar business model in other parts. 

I guess you still need different type of competence when build to order and build to scale

I think to a degree we did have some of that here in the past but quite limited. I have seen the identical houses in Suburbia however if you take a closer look there are some differences in some streets. I was told that back in the 30's they built the houses to order once someone had reserved a plot you then chose from a limited choice of styles. That is why there is a mix of house types in the streets and purchases could make some changes.

There was a house opposite me growing up 3 bed semi and it was 2 foot wider than the one it was joined on to . The story was when the pair were built the original buyer opted to pay extra for this change. 

If you look at expensive areas in the UK where there are detached houses there you will see many individual houses. At present in the UK with the volume house builders there is a take it or leave it attitude as that is all your getting. A reduction in planning laws would surely lead to more competition and higher standards with more choice.  

[NobodyInParticular]

7 hours ago, Locke said:

We need to abolish planning permission.

People worry that without planning cartels, developers would just build what they want, but what has actually happened is that planning prevents people who would retain the village character from building, while enabling developers to continue building their character destroying shitboxes.

So the 'shitboxes' would still be built. On floodplains. With inadequate sewerage and overload roads. And people would ruin villages too. Where is the gain here?

[TheCountOfNowhere]

7 minutes ago, NobodyInParticular said:

So the 'shitboxes' would still be built. On floodplains. With inadequate sewerage and overload roads. And people would ruin villages too. Where is the gain here?

[TheCountOfNowhere]

[Freki]

You know Count that you are victim or survival bias? All the sh!t houses have go to the sh!ter. 

I am not trying to imply it is perfect now, but don't get your rose tinted glasses on. 

Apparently planning permission came to law in 1948. But I doubt before on a Lord's estate you would be able to build how you want and when you need it.

[NobodyInParticular]

14 minutes ago, TheCountOfNowhere said:

Want me to post some engravings of London slums from the 1780s?

[12fixer]

Around Bristol the increase in people living in vans is huge, they are every where, you can spot them by the giveaway flu on the roof.

It never seems to be mentioned on the TV. News, perhaps the journos aren't aware of the extent of it, although they can't miss the ones on The Downs, you would think it would be a top news story and something should be down about it now. https://www.google.com/maps/@51.4776043,-2.6178926,3a,75y,349.01h,79.99t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1slX8yUv_7Tk7pog7ZTzqhoA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

[Staffsknot]

4 hours ago, iamnumerate said:

Very sad, I wouldn't have bit my tongue and would have told him.

 

Please tell me that is not true.

I don't think a family Zoom chat checking everyone is ok is the right setting to tell your uncle he's a tool.

Edited January 25, 2021 by Staffsknot

[Si1]

3 minutes ago, Staffsknot said:

I don't think a family Zoom chat checking everyone is ok is the right setting to tell your uncle he's a tool.

Oh I dunno, is there not a cool filter you can employ to make yourself look like Beelzebub or something?

[iamnumerate]

8 minutes ago, Staffsknot said:

I don't think a family Zoom chat checking everyone is ok is the right setting to tell your uncle he's a tool.

I would have tried to say it in a subtle way.

[steve99]

12 hours ago, iamnumerate said:

I know left wingers who are the same.

I do too, however not to the same extent as right wing nut jobs, ie everyone that reads the daily mail, sun, times, telegraph etc

[Si1]

2 minutes ago, steve99 said:

I do too, however not to the same extent as right wing nut jobs, ie everyone that reads the daily mail, sun, times, telegraph etc

I think this might depend on who's in govt. Because we have a right wing govt, right wing nutters need be less guarded as they are closer to the mainstream political default. I seem to recall that rabid hypocritical champagne socialists where extremely conspicuous and raking in unseemly salaries in trendy public sector non jobs prior to the 2010 GE.

[steve99]

8 hours ago, Si1 said:

I think this might depend on who's in govt. Because we have a right wing govt, right wing nutters need be less guarded as they are closer to the mainstream political default. I seem to recall that rabid hypocritical champagne socialists where extremely conspicuous and raking in unseemly salaries in trendy public sector non jobs prior to the 2010 GE.

True but many civil servant jobs are just that, careers for money and the more the better.  The last Labour govt was just tory-lite as far as I am concerned and apart from some better social policy, NHS policy and education for eg it let the bankers and housing market go wild (and got zero criticism from the right wing rags for that side of things, which means it was not doing its job as a labour government)

[iamnumerate]

22 minutes ago, steve99 said:

True but many civil servant jobs are just that, careers for money and the more the better.  The last Labour govt was just tory-lite as far as I am concerned and apart from some better social policy, NHS policy and education for eg it let the bankers and housing market go wild (and got zero criticism from the right wing rags for that side of things, which means it was not doing its job as a labour government)

As far as I know, no Tory government has knocked down decent housing as Labour did.

Actually I think the right wing rags did attack that. 

[msi]

30 minutes ago, steve99 said:

True but many civil servant jobs are just that, careers for money and the more the better.  The last Labour govt was just tory-lite as far as I am concerned and apart from some better social policy, NHS policy and education for eg it let the bankers and housing market go wild (and got zero criticism from the right wing rags for that side of things, which means it was not doing its job as a labour government)

Labour sold themselves to get into power and avoid the 'Red' label from the Rabid Right.  They effectively became Tory-Lite with a view to taking over the political centre and pushing the Tories to the hard right. 

They almost succeeded if it wasn't for siding with the US NeoCons on Iraq

[Insane]

1 hour ago, steve99 said:

True but many civil servant jobs are just that, careers for money and the more the better.  The last Labour govt was just tory-lite as far as I am concerned and apart from some better social policy, NHS policy and education for eg it let the bankers and housing market go wild (and got zero criticism from the right wing rags for that side of things, which means it was not doing its job as a labour government)

I don't think Labour are doing their job as a decent opposition either.

You speak about the Blair/Brown Govt as tory-lite but I don't think that is the case they tried to run with the Hare and the Hound. I think Blair called it the 3rd way which is impossible to achieve. 

As you said earlier in the thread. 

Its not uncommon to find people with two or more completely conflicting narratives going on in their heads and never join the two together and see the irony of it  That sums up the 13 years we had of Labour. 

They promised to stop Boom and Bust and not let the housing market get out of hand like it had in the 80's. They could have done this by raising interest rates in the late 90's early 00's , but they wanted the next election and put party before country by keeping the votes of the house owning classes. 

They did build new schools and hospitals but paid for it via PFI.

They were very generous to the low paid with Tax Credits but that affected the same kind of people they were meant to help by wages reducing. 

They spoke about looking after the minorities and the poor but ignored their plight when Zero Hour contracts appeared. They watched the low paid semi skilled compete with immigrants for jobs and called them Bigots if they questioned it. 

They pumped Billions to the Banks after robing Mr/Mrs Averages Pension pot. 

No I do not see them as Tory lite more extreme to the left and extreme to the right.  

[Staffsknot]

Tbh I think interpretation of political spectrum depends a lot on the leanings of those talking to you.

In my village I've been accused of being a socialist ( champagne because I've travelled and went to Sandhurst) for asking for a pothole to be filled in, a communist for not agreeing with a ranting old man bemoaning giving up Empire, an unpatriotic loafer ( must have red my Army service record 😂) for not wearing a Poppy 3 weeks after Rememberence Day and a Nazi because I invaded Iraq (in Desert 'Nam the sequel) and took down a Vote Leave poster someone had put on my wall without asking.

I think that makes me a centrist.

But this digresses from the anecdotes so:

Spoke to my cousin - she's cheesed off as they are being sent lots of overpriced closer homes by him in a guilt trip. Not a scoobie.

[TheCountOfNowhere]

6 hours ago, NobodyInParticular said:

Want me to post some engravings of London slums executive £1m homes from the 1780s?

Fixed that for you 😉 

[TheCountOfNowhere]

2 hours ago, Insane said:

Its not uncommon to find people with two or more completely conflicting narratives going on in their heads 

 

That's nonsense.

No it's not.

[Insane]

6 minutes ago, TheCountOfNowhere said:

That's nonsense.

No it's not.

I don't understand what you mean but thank you for making that clear. 

[msi]

2 hours ago, Insane said:

I don't think Labour are doing their job as a decent opposition either.

You speak about the Blair/Brown Govt as tory-lite but I don't think that is the case they tried to run with the Hare and the Hound. I think Blair called it the 3rd way which is impossible to achieve. 

As you said earlier in the thread. 

Its not uncommon to find people with two or more completely conflicting narratives going on in their heads and never join the two together and see the irony of it  That sums up the 13 years we had of Labour. 

They promised to stop Boom and Bust and not let the housing market get out of hand like it had in the 80's. They could have done this by raising interest rates in the late 90's early 00's , but they wanted the next election and put party before country by keeping the votes of the house owning classes. 

They did build new schools and hospitals but paid for it via PFI.

They were very generous to the low paid with Tax Credits but that affected the same kind of people they were meant to help by wages reducing. 

They spoke about looking after the minorities and the poor but ignored their plight when Zero Hour contracts appeared. They watched the low paid semi skilled compete with immigrants for jobs and called them Bigots if they questioned it. 

They pumped Billions to the Banks after robing Mr/Mrs Averages Pension pot. 

No I do not see them as Tory lite more extreme to the left and extreme to the right.  

Labour tried to carve a new path - the 3rd way spiel was to appeal to Tory Donors to put it in their interests to fund social development (just don't call it taxation).  PFI was his bung to get them to invest in state building without getting hit by the Rabid Right for 'Tax n Spend, innit'.  Same with Tax Credits - topping up work instead of straight benefits, with the hope the minimum wage would provide a floor and lift everyone up in time. 

New Labours downfall was Iraq - selling out to serve the US without reward.  The GFC and Brown's idiotic handling (boasting about negative growth in spending instead of mentioning the word cuts FFS) opened the door for the Tory's to out Tory-Lite him. 

In came 'hug a hoody' Cameron promising a softer caring compassionate conservative.  We all know how well that went.  Cameron and Osborne had a golden chance to lance the boil and drop the blame at Brown's feet - a short sharp shock with the 'compassionate conservative' looking after the worst hit - it would've got a generation of Tory Rule and put to bed the image of the 'nasty party'. With that Cameron would've gained a comfortable majority in 2015 allowing him to p*ss on the ERG and Scottish Nationalists

 

 

[Insane]

19 minutes ago, msi said:

Labour tried to carve a new path - the 3rd way spiel was to appeal to Tory Donors to put it in their interests to fund social development (just don't call it taxation).  PFI was his bung to get them to invest in state building without getting hit by the Rabid Right for 'Tax n Spend, innit'.  Same with Tax Credits - topping up work instead of straight benefits, with the hope the minimum wage would provide a floor and lift everyone up in time. 

New Labours downfall was Iraq - selling out to serve the US without reward.  The GFC and Brown's idiotic handling (boasting about negative growth in spending instead of mentioning the word cuts FFS) opened the door for the Tory's to out Tory-Lite him. 

In came 'hug a hoody' Cameron promising a softer caring compassionate conservative.  We all know how well that went.  Cameron and Osborne had a golden chance to lance the boil and drop the blame at Brown's feet - a short sharp shock with the 'compassionate conservative' looking after the worst hit - it would've got a generation of Tory Rule and put to bed the image of the 'nasty party'. With that Cameron would've gained a comfortable majority in 2015 allowing him to p*ss on the ERG and Scottish Nationalists

I think we agree on a lot of things we just have different ideas of what was good/bad old Labour new Labour Tory-lite ect.

I think Tax Credits was meant well , but what a mess it turned out. Apparently it was costed at £1 Billion a year and now costs £30 Billion. Due to employers changing the way they employed people for them to pay as little as possible and the low paid workers to get as much as possible in Tax Credits topping up the wages.

Why pay one person a decent wage plus sick pay ,pension contributions , holiday pay ect when you can have 3 part times make sure they get 16 (now 20 hours) hours a week work and let the Tax Payer pay the rest. I have heard of many situations where people cut their working week as there was no point in working any more hours as what you earned extra you lost on TC. Great if you are in the TC group horrendous if your not but needing full time work and trying to compete with those very flexible low paid. A lot of the low paid employment is now dependent on TC like a person hooked on Heroin it is so difficult to get back off it. I believe TC was the back bone of the Zero Hours Contracts without TC firms would not have been so able to introduce them. 

I agreed with the minimum wage (funny how the Tory's did not at the time but do now) the only problem was it became a default wage for many as well as putting a floor on wages it also had the impact of many finding wages which had been higher dropping down to it. 

To be honest I really don't think that many people were that interested in Iraq or what was going on in the middle East as it did not impact them directly. I and many people I know are ex Labour voters and Iraq  never comes up when we discuss why we are ex Labour. That might sound selfish but people are selfish.  

I think Labour blew their chances in 2010 by their attitude towards average everyday people when immigration came up we were told we were bigoted, racist, little Englanders and Lazy. Do you remember Gordon Browns hick up when he agreed and nodded his head with a woman saying there was to much immigration, when he thought the cameras were off after speaking nicely to her he called her a Bigot. Positive Discrimination in jobs ect is Discrimination if your not in the right group. Labour did to much of this kind of policy. 

Today I think people have had it up to the back teeth with the whole lot in Westminster , Labour , Liberal and Tory. But will vote for the best of a bad bunch. At present that is the Tory party. Labour say they lost the working class vote. But they never say what it was they did/did not do, said/did not say to the working class. It is just a chestnut they roll out with little thought. 

Well let's be honest they did not lose the working class vote they lost the white working class vote. They concentrated on Minorities and told the working class they had white privilege. Today they have still not learnt their lesson and so therefore are still unelectable. We are in the middle of a major Pandemic as we all know.

Yet this week I have seen on the internet no less than 5 yes 5 Bame members of parliament declare that the pandemic is due to structural racism and they have declared this in the house of commons. One MP who is currently waiting a criminal court case for allegedly obtaining a council house by fraud asked that Bame people get the jab before others.   Do you really think the average white working class person is going to vote for a party that harbours so many race baiting racist mps ? Until Labour can cleanse itself of such nonsense it has no chance of office.   

[Si1]

4 hours ago, msi said:

Labour tried to carve a new path - the 3rd way spiel was to appeal to Tory Donors to put it in their interests to fund social development (just don't call it taxation).  PFI was his bung to get them to invest in state building without getting hit by the Rabid Right for 'Tax n Spend, innit'.  Same with Tax Credits - topping up work instead of straight benefits, with the hope the minimum wage would provide a floor and lift everyone up in time. 

New Labours downfall was Iraq - selling out to serve the US without reward.  The GFC and Brown's idiotic handling (boasting about negative growth in spending instead of mentioning the word cuts FFS) opened the door for the Tory's to out Tory-Lite him. 

In came 'hug a hoody' Cameron promising a softer caring compassionate conservative.  We all know how well that went.  Cameron and Osborne had a golden chance to lance the boil and drop the blame at Brown's feet - a short sharp shock with the 'compassionate conservative' looking after the worst hit - it would've got a generation of Tory Rule and put to bed the image of the 'nasty party'. With that Cameron would've gained a comfortable majority in 2015 allowing him to p*ss on the ERG and Scottish Nationalists

 

 

As Norman Tebbit said, Cameron has no leadership. He just takes the path of least resistance without any longer term vision or strategy. Help to Buy is absolutely characteristic of his style.