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'Tax the wealthy to pay for coronavirus' .....Starting with the Tax Havens ??


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Wouldn’t that be amazing. Extremely unlikely with this govt though.

i'm reminded of an old hpc thread ..

We allow the rich to escape charges, admits taxman HMRC says secret deals are done

https://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/forum/index.php?/topic/233360-we-allow-the-rich-to-escape-charges-admits-taxman-hmrc-says-secret-deals-are-done/

"

Richard Las, the deputy director of HMRC in charge of organised crime, said that “very wealthy and prominent members of the community” were afraid of the “reputational damage” that a criminal trial for fraud, money-laundering or tax evasion would bring.

He admitted that “criminal justice” was never a “default option” for HMRC. “We use it where it is necessary and it will have the greatest effect,” Las said.

“When deciding whether to deploy our resources, we try to understand what motivates different types of offenders. For example, some tax offenders are very wealthy, prominent members of the community. We know that these types of people do not want the reputational damage of custodial sentences, and we can use that to our advantage.”

The news raises fresh questions about the approach of HMRC, which has been criticised for failing to prosecute high-profile people with financial interests in offshore tax havens.

This weekend, experts said the admission revealed there was one law for the average citizen and another for the rich and powerful.

Meg Hillier, who chairs the Commons public accounts committee, said: “This raises questions over the public’s equality under the law. Just because you have highly paid tax advisers, you must not be seen to be getting away with it.”

Prem Sikka, professor of accounting at Sheffield University, said: “This shows just how far removed the senior leadership of HMRC are from public opinion. This policy provides absolutely no deterrent to tax cheats.”

In 2016, the global elite was embarrassed by the leak of millions of documents from the tax haven of Panama. The so-called Panama Papers led to four arrests and six interviews under caution by HMRC.

However, officials in Germany mounted 71 prosecutions, and in Pakistan, Nawaz Sharif, the former prime minister, was sentenced to 10 years in prison and fined £8.2m on corruption charges after his children were linked to offshore companies that owned four London flats.

In Spain, the tax authorities have recovered millions of pounds in lost revenue after threatening to prosecute leading footballers including Cristiano Ronaldo and Lionel Messi.

Earlier this year, HMRC was embarrassed when it emerged that it had refused to assist a French investigation into suspected money-laundering and tax fraud by the UK telecoms giant Lycamobile, citing the fact that the company was the “biggest corporate donor to the Conservative Party”.

HMRC initially denied the Lycamobile story, saying: “This is the United Kingdom for God’s sake, not some Third World banana republic where the organs of state are in hock to some sort of kleptocracy.” It later conceded that the story was accurate.

HMRC said: “Everyone must pay their fair share of tax, regardless of wealth and status — no one is above the law. We do not take an individual’s wealth or background into account deciding whether to pass a criminal investigation to the Crown Prosecution Service.”

Edited by Saving For a Space Ship
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Talked about this before.  An apx 15% one off wealth tax (without exception and without avoidance) would CLEAR the national debt.  The quid-pro-quo of this would be to mandate balanced budgets, massive spending reform, a wholesale tax review,  and release the resultant savings as Tax cuts to stimulate growth and self sufficiency.

 

I might as well talk about free love, middle east peace, and ending world poverty too with the likelihood of anything other than a pathetic fudge

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Talked about this before.  An apx 15% one off wealth tax (without exception and without avoidance) would CLEAR the national debt.  The quid-pro-quo of this would be to mandate balanced budgets, massive spending reform, a wholesale tax review,  and release the resultant savings as Tax cuts to stimulate growth and self sufficiency.

 

I might as well talk about free love, middle east peace, and ending world poverty too with the likelihood of anything other than a pathetic fudge

Do you have a link to a previous thread, i could not see one , cheers 

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'Tax the wealthy to pay for coronavirus'

.Starting with the Tax Havens ?? (sic)

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-55236851

They'd be hitting the wrong people with that proposal though. The claim that people with just over £1m of assets per couple are wealthy is pretty ludicrous and would hit most people in the South East and placed like Cheshire and the posh parts of Yorkshire/Birmingham. 

Again this is trying to let the offshore gang through the net. 

For example how would they value public sector pensions?  If they took a 4% annuity rate, a £25k pension would be valued at £625k add in £350k for a modest house and some other savings (say £30k), and that would take someone over £1m.

What they need to do is look at CGT especially on business sales.

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Talked about this before.  An apx 15% one off wealth tax (without exception and without avoidance) would CLEAR the national debt.  The quid-pro-quo of this would be to mandate balanced budgets, massive spending reform, a wholesale tax review,  and release the resultant savings as Tax cuts to stimulate growth and self sufficiency.

 

I might as well talk about free love, middle east peace, and ending world poverty too with the likelihood of anything other than a pathetic fudge

But how would you "define" wealth? You would need another "Domesday Book" level of national audit. Would land be included? If so big bills for The Queen , Royals and blue blood class. how would the duke of Westminster pay for a wealth tax on all the land he owns in the square mile?

Made up of 133,100 acres across the UK, the Duke of Westminster owns 0.22% of Britain's land - compared with the 19,768 acres or 0.03% of the country owned privately by the Queen.10 Aug 2016

My wife and i own a £600k house, on a 1100m2 plot, but with a £260k outstanding mortgage. Is our land and property wealth £600k (gross) or £340k (net)? 

A sudden 15% tax on £340k would mean a out of the blue £51k tax bill.  HTF are we going to pay that? We only have 10% of that as cash. 

Or would wealth only be considered as "cash in the bank".  No worries, all our cash would go instantly into Bitcoin, off they system, we have no wealth. 

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My wife and i own a £600k house, on a 1100m2 plot, but with a £260k outstanding mortgage. Is our land and property wealth £600k (gross) or £340k (net)? 

Read the article... yes it is meant to be net. 

And yes the only wealth tax that would work those days to be "fair" and have the ultra wealth pay for it is to levy on houses and not other assets that can be held offshore, in trusts, in free trade ports when it comes to art and the list surely could go on. That wealth tax would be called Land Value Tax, could replace most of the "income" tax and be virtuous for the country encouraging people earning an income instead of the stupid 42% marginal rate we see for a good chunk of people in this country

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Read the article... yes it is meant to be net. 

 

So with low interest rates you "forever" remortage your property , using the remortage money to pay the mortgage payments, making your "net" land value as low as possible, to pay less wealth tax. 

Even 1% would mean a £3400 bill p/a for us, and it would rise every year as our mortgage is paid off. Fook that. 

Now this would cause a collapse in land prices. We get on very well with out neighbours in a identical house. We would colluded with them to "buy" each others houses for £400k , rather than the £600k market value, and then buy them back 5 years later, also for £400k, just to set the property price benchmark for our houses lower, to reduce tax. 

 

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The largest source of of wealth are DB public sectors pensions.

 

Comes back to how they define "wealth".   

My 73 y/o dad has about £250k in unit trust investments, £20k in cash savings and local gov DB index linked pension that pays him £18k /a.   He rents his HA flat. 

If his DB pension was included and valued @ £750k , he would suddenly up for this tax. 

My wife has a now frozen £15k p/a DB pension she will take in 20 years time, i have a six figure Private SIPP .  Those combined with our house would most likely push us over the 1m per couple limit. 

We are not "wealthy" . 

Kill the poor i say, Need a food bank, your a liability, execution.  One off disposal cost for the feckless. 

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Comes back to how they define "wealth".   

My 73 y/o dad has about £250k in unit trust investments, £20k in cash savings and local gov DB index linked pension that pays him £18k /a.   He rents his HA flat. 

If his DB pension was included and valued @ £750k , he would suddenly up for this tax. 

My wife has a now frozen £15k p/a DB pension she will take in 20 years time, i have a six figure Private SIPP .  Those combined with our house would most likely push us over the 1m per couple limit. 

We are not "wealthy" . 

Kill the poor i say, Need a food bank, your a liability, execution.  One off disposal cost for the feckless. 

Marky you should seriously consider helping people with their finances. Most people (including myself) are hopeless but you seem to run a tight ship. Maybe having a family focuses the mind 

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Kill the poor i say, Need a food bank, your a liability, execution.  One off disposal cost for the feckless. 

Let me guess: you are a devout Christian attending mass regularly.

Otherwise, if you are top 6% of the country in terms of wealth, you are not wealthy. Okay okay, I note that.

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Instead of taxing why not cut government spending and balance the budget? 

That means sacking bureaucrats and closing down unnecessary departments.

We don't have a tax problem we have a spending problem 

That’s sooooo 2010, you need to get with the program man. It’s all about bureaucracy and state aid now. Kent border checks and red walls. Charity begins at home, level up. 

Literally everything this government is doing is about spending more, not less, and the voters are lapping it up. 

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Marky you should seriously consider helping people with their finances. Most people (including myself) are hopeless but you seem to run a tight ship. Maybe having a family focuses the mind 

There are people in life who are "good" with money, and people who are "terrible". My answer is simple, in any financial relationship couple or family unit, you can have 3 combinations of people. 

2 that are "Good" with money

2 that are "Bad" with money

1 That is Good, 1 that is bad with money. 

1st group are sorted, i could have "married" into that group, with an attractive woman too, but she had 2 kids already, had her tubes cut despite only being early 30's , and would have meant no kids of my own. so i bailed. 

2nd group is doomed, they are the couples who "have everything" it seems, but it's all hidden behind a wall of debt that takes them down eventually and they end up feckless. 

Group 3 is me / us. The key here is to get the one bad with money to agree to be "financially managed" buy the one who is good with money. And i do this. Wife is awful, would bankrupt us within 5 years if i let her. But, she agreed to let me handle all the family finances. 

An believe it or not, this wife of mine, who earns £45k p/a, never sees her wages. It goes into a joint account she does not have access to or look at, and every time she gets paid i give her "pocket" money from her £2800 wages. She gets £400 pcm to do as she wishes. she has her own credit cards but I have possession of them. I do EVERYTHING else. all the bills, and mortgage, savings, investments, food shopping. 

If she wants anything spent on the kids / house above her £400, we have to agree it and me approve it. 

And she is happy, because she knows she is terrible with money, goes through her married and family life with no money worries, and a nice life, is just about to get an new electric car in 2021, now her old one is paid off. 

May seem strange to many, but it works for us. 

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