'Millions face hardship' as government support ends

[Warlord]

The end of a range of government support schemes could leave millions of people facing hardship, think tanks and political groups have warned.

Mortgage holidays and jobs furloughing are to end on Saturday, with other other support measures starting.

But there are still gaps in support that need filling, some organisations have said.

The Treasury said it had put in place a number of generous support schemes for individuals and businesses.

The mortgage holiday scheme introduced at the start of the Covid-19 crisis ends on Saturday as does the job furlough scheme, which is being replaced by the Job Support Scheme.

It will leave a fifth of mortgage holders - around 1.6 million households - worried about paying their mortgage over the next three months, according to the Joseph Rowntree Foundation.

The poverty campaign charity said: "There is a real risk that mortgage-holders on low incomes will be pulled into poverty and hardship."

It said 890,000 working households with a mortgage expect to see a drop in earnings over the next month, but 85% of them - 750,000 households - aren't eligible for any government support with their housing costs.

"It's not right that during a time of huge uncertainty, many households are discovering that they are excluded from the only lifeline that could help meet their housing costs," said Darren Baxter, policy and partnerships manager at the charity.

The Joseph Rowntree Foundation wants the Support for Mortgage Interest payment to be reformed to help people who lose their jobs to keep their homes as they weather the coronavirus storm.
 

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-54753885

 

[TheCountOfNowhere]

 

The end of a range of government support schemes could leave millions of people facing hardship, think tanks and political groups have warned.

Mortgage holidays and jobs furloughing are to end on Saturday, with other other support measures starting.

But there are still gaps in support that need filling, some organisations have said.

The Treasury said it had put in place a number of generous support schemes for individuals and businesses.

The mortgage holiday scheme introduced at the start of the Covid-19 crisis ends on Saturday as does the job furlough scheme, which is being replaced by the Job Support Scheme.

It will leave a fifth of mortgage holders - around 1.6 million households - worried about paying their mortgage over the next three months, according to the Joseph Rowntree Foundation.

The poverty campaign charity said: "There is a real risk that mortgage-holders on low incomes will be pulled into poverty and hardship."

It said 890,000 working households with a mortgage expect to see a drop in earnings over the next month, but 85% of them - 750,000 households - aren't eligible for any government support with their housing costs.

"It's not right that during a time of huge uncertainty, many households are discovering that they are excluded from the only lifeline that could help meet their housing costs," said Darren Baxter, policy and partnerships manager at the charity.

The Joseph Rowntree Foundation wants the Support for Mortgage Interest payment to be reformed to help people who lose their jobs to keep their homes as they weather the coronavirus storm.
 

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-54753885

 

Millions were sparred hardship by forcing even more hardship onto tax payers...now they want more....again

[Warlord]

 

Millions were sparred hardship by forcing even more hardship onto tax payers...now they want more....again

Yes.. Imagine having to sell up and rent.. oh the horror! 

 

[satsuma]

 

Yes.. Imagine having to sell up and rent.. oh the horror! 

 

I think people are hoping for more freebies from the government so they can plan to get fat in time for Christmas or continue building their model railway or smoking dope all day or whatever they chose to do with their new found idilness.  That’s why there is  no rush of houses to the market apart from the ones that are clearly from the smart money people shoring up their portfolios before they are forced to sell.  

[TheCountOfNowhere]

 

The end of a range of government support schemes could leave millions of people facing hardship, think tanks and political groups have warned.

Mortgage holidays and jobs furloughing are to end on Saturday, with other other support measures starting.

But there are still gaps in support that need filling, some organisations have said.

The Treasury said it had put in place a number of generous support schemes for individuals and businesses.

The mortgage holiday scheme introduced at the start of the Covid-19 crisis ends on Saturday as does the job furlough scheme, which is being replaced by the Job Support Scheme.

It will leave a fifth of mortgage holders - around 1.6 million households - worried about paying their mortgage over the next three months, according to the Joseph Rowntree Foundation.

The poverty campaign charity said: "There is a real risk that mortgage-holders on low incomes will be pulled into poverty and hardship."

It said 890,000 working households with a mortgage expect to see a drop in earnings over the next month, but 85% of them - 750,000 households - aren't eligible for any government support with their housing costs.

"It's not right that during a time of huge uncertainty, many households are discovering that they are excluded from the only lifeline that could help meet their housing costs," said Darren Baxter, policy and partnerships manager at the charity.

The Joseph Rowntree Foundation wants the Support for Mortgage Interest payment to be reformed to help people who lose their jobs to keep their homes as they weather the coronavirus storm.
 

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-54753885

 

To continue it will results in millions of tax payers unable to feed themselves or their children.

[msi]

Don't all the Tory fans love stating 'Socialism is great until you run out of other peoples money'?

 

[Dreamcasting]

Oh dear, another wrong prediction on the gold ole' HPC forum. Furlough extended to December. There will be many more schemes introduced throughout 2021 and beyond, make no mistake.

[Warlord]

 

Oh dear, another wrong prediction on the gold ole' HPC forum. Furlough extended to December. There will be many more schemes introduced throughout 2021 and beyond, make no mistake.

Many of us actually did predict that it would be replaced or extended but eventually the money runs out (if it hasn't already) 

Edited November 1, 2020 by Warlord

[adarmo]

 

Many of us actually did predict that it would be replaced or extended but eventually the money runs out (if it hasn't already) 

 It would if it went on and on but we will either 

Find a vaccine

Build up some level of immunity so it's endemic rather than epidemic

Build more ventilator beds and train nurses (but tbh by the time you need one of those you're as good as gone sadly)

I'm hopeful this will be mostly done come April/May. 

This second wave isn't rising at anything like the numbers in the first wave and most businesses will be able to continue. 

Tourism, restaurants, bars etc are sadly in for a very tough time. 

[Si1]

 

 It would if it went on and on but we will either 

Find a vaccine

Build up some level of immunity so it's endemic rather than epidemic

Build more ventilator beds and train nurses (but tbh by the time you need one of those you're as good as gone sadly)

I'm hopeful this will be mostly done come April/May. 

This second wave isn't rising at anything like the numbers in the first wave and most businesses will be able to continue. 

Tourism, restaurants, bars etc are sadly in for a very tough time. 

The service economy will take a battering. But some change was due in the economy anyway. I mean, why do we need to 'save the high street' again?? Save university education?

That's a big part of the UK economy, so there will be knock on effects. And the international economy will take a hit, that's a supply side hit. That's very uncertain. Personally I think the EU will be badly damaged by it.

So they'll be knock ons. Some demand side, some supply side. The latter can't be addressed with Keynesian stimulus of house prices.

[adarmo]

 

The service economy will take a battering. But some change was due in the economy anyway. I mean, why do we need to 'save the high street' again?? Save university education?

That's a big part of the UK economy, so there will be knock on effects. And the international economy will take a hit, that's a supply side hit. That's very uncertain. Personally I think the EU will be badly damaged by it.

So they'll be knock ons. Some demand side, some supply side. The latter can't be addressed with Keynesian stimulus of house prices.

Yeah i agree. But i also think they'll take the monetary response to the max since as pointed out in the comment i was responding to this can't go on forever, they'll run out of cash eventually. 

NIRP hands more money to those with mortgages and mashes loans cheaper blah blah blah. It's not fair of course but it does allow the government to improve the spending figures (through lower debt costs and hopefully higher tax receipts) than would otherwise be the case. 

I'm not advocating this as the pinnacle of how to build a just and equitable society but that it's the most likely response. 

[Si1]

 

Yeah i agree. But i also think they'll take the monetary response to the max since as pointed out in the comment i was responding to this can't go on forever, they'll run out of cash eventually. 

NIRP hands more money to those with mortgages and mashes loans cheaper blah blah blah. It's not fair of course but it does allow the government to improve the spending figures (through lower debt costs and hopefully higher tax receipts) than would otherwise be the case. 

I'm not advocating this as the pinnacle of how to build a just and equitable society but that it's the most likely response. 

Yeah, but nirp doesn't address the supply side. and that's a bit of an unknown as it looks more inflationary then in general monetary terms.

Edited November 1, 2020 by Si1

[adarmo]

 

Yeah, but nirp doesn't address the supply side. and that's a bit of an unknown as it looks more inflationary then in general monetary terms.

I'm conflicted on this. 

On the one hand,  based on affordability alone,  if my mortgage rate went to say 0% or very close to that i could borrow about 50% more since about a third of my monthly repayments are interest (give or take). So there we've got more magic money chasing a fixed number of assets on day one. 

Were it to continue though i would expect the costs of delivery to fall since borrowing on the supply side also gets cheaper. However, this is the English planning system so supply may well be constrained. 

I do have a pet theory that very low interst rates could be deflationary since they make start up costs (capital raising) lower, reduce capital barriers to entry which fosters competition, and allows existing producers to expand capacity... all very raw industry of course. 

Back to housing and yes NIRP will be inflationary for prices. 

[Warlord]

 

Yeah i agree. But i also think they'll take the monetary response to the max since as pointed out in the comment i was responding to this can't go on forever, they'll run out of cash eventually. 

 

We will see rampant inflation and a financial crisis maybe not right now but at some point in the future.

Gov't can't just carry on borrowing beyond its means or printing money without consequence. Sooner or later the chickens will come home to roost and sadly the poorest or those families on marginal incomes will feel it the most through taxes and inflation.  This is in addition to the economic calamity of the lockdowns and the jobs and businesses lost. 

 

[Si1]

 

I'm conflicted on this. 

On the one hand,  based on affordability alone,  if my mortgage rate went to say 0% or very close to that i could borrow about 50% more since about a third of my monthly repayments are interest (give or take). So there we've got more magic money chasing a fixed number of assets on day one. 

Were it to continue though i would expect the costs of delivery to fall since borrowing on the supply side also gets cheaper. However, this is the English planning system so supply may well be constrained. 

I do have a pet theory that very low interst rates could be deflationary since they make start up costs (capital raising) lower, reduce capital barriers to entry which fosters competition, and allows existing producers to expand capacity... all very raw industry of course. 

Back to housing and yes NIRP will be inflationary for prices. 

I meant the supply side of the general economy not houses. A shortfall in that area would push up inflation and nominal interest rates.

Edited November 1, 2020 by Si1

[MARTINX9]

 

Millions were sparred hardship by forcing even more hardship onto tax payers...now they want more....again

Agreed but none of those taking the decisions in the Cabinet or on Sage or the CMO and CSO and deputies are taking a pay cut. I expect Vallance’s drug company shares will be doing well though!

I don’t really begrudge a shop assistant in Debenhams, a ticket checker at Odeon, a receptionist at Virgin Active or a dental assistant getting some extra help for four weeks.

Of course given many firms in retail and hospitality will be losing a huge proportion of takings in the lead up to Christmas there is truly going to be carnage soon in terms of jobs going and firms collapsing.

And you even have to wait two years to see a dentist! The government will still allow noisy housebuilding work near where people live and can’t generally leave until 9pm but if you are in agony and need a tooth extraction or emergency this month - even if you are a 7 year old kid -  tough!!

Gotta save the NHS and prolong the lives of 85 year olds with underlying life limiting conditions - who are probably in pain and misery anyway - by a few more weeks.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/uknews/13070177/patients-two-year-dentist-double-coronavirus/amp/

Edited November 1, 2020 by MARTINX9

[Dreamcasting]

 

Many of us actually did predict that it would be replaced or extended but eventually the money runs out (if it hasn't already) 

Every major country in the world is printing money. The money can't run out, and you don't get hyperinflation unless you're the only country at it, therefore the system can carry on like it has since 2008.

You have a very narrow view of how the monetary system works in the modern world. It's these same flaws and lack of understanding that has caused people on this forum to be in a worse position at this point and still doesn't have a house.

[Si1]

 

Every major country in the world is printing money. The money can't run out, and you don't get hyperinflation unless you're the only country at it, therefore the system can carry on like it has since 2008.

https://reliefweb.int/report/syrian-arab-republic/hyperinflation-creates-mass-starvation-syria

 

You have a very narrow view of how the monetary system works in the modern world. It's these same flaws and lack of understanding that has caused people on this forum to be in a worse position at this point and still doesn't have a house.

https://www.learnersdictionary.com/qa/don-t-and-doesn-t#:~:text=Don't is a contraction," and "they").

 

[Greater Fool]

 

You have a very narrow view of how the monetary system works in the modern world. It's these same flaws and lack of understanding that has caused people on this forum to be in a worse position at this point and still doesn't have a house.

So how does it work, what happens to all the printed money? Surely increasing the money supply just devalues the existing money, unless it is taken back out of the system somehow. From what I've read in MMT the excess money has to clawed back through taxation.

[TheCountOfNowhere]

 

So how does it work, what happens to all the printed money? Surely increasing the money supply just devalues the existing money, unless it is taken back out of the system somehow. From what I've read in MMT the excess money has to clawed back through taxation.

Of course it does... Have you see the price of houses recently? 

[satsuma]

 

So how does it work, what happens to all the printed money? Surely increasing the money supply just devalues the existing money, unless it is taken back out of the system somehow. From what I've read in MMT the excess money has to clawed back through taxation.

Correct, however in the current situation there will be a lot of earning potential destroyed so that will reduce demand so that may impact inflation.  I think the injection of all this money will increase prices of certain things.  However the number of people out of work will mean other things could go down in price.  

[captainb]

 

Of course it does... Have you see the price of houses recently? 

And extending that argument printing a whole lot more causes prices to go up or down in GBP terms...

[Biggus]

Noticed yesterday that my local Morrisons seemed to be a bit low on stock. Some grocery lines were entirely missing. I'm guessing the new, ill advised, lockdown will make this worse. So I searched google news for 'empty shops'. While there were a couple of articles about a new panic buying spree there were dozens of local news stories about rows of empty shops on the high street. Here's a link for the lazy.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=empty+shops

It looks like a retail bloodbath. High street businesses up and down the country have gone bust. And now there's another lockdown in the run up to Christmas. This is going to be brutal.

The empty supermarket shelves are also a bit of a worry. When supply does not meet demand prices should, in theory at least, increase. All the extra money being created combined with the supply destruction look like a recipe for disasterous inflation in comsumer goods. Hopefully I'm wrong.

 

[winkie]

Re supermarkets, over last few months, there have been shortages of certain food items on shelves....very often no stock in certain items...having trouble getting them, more of it to come, will just have to adapt and not expect getting everything have been used to getting all of the time.

[Warlord]

 

So how does it work, what happens to all the printed money? Surely increasing the money supply just devalues the existing money, unless it is taken back out of the system somehow. From what I've read in MMT the excess money has to clawed back through taxation.

Careful, you're talking common sense economics there (rather than the voodoo economics preached by @Dreamcasting)