Warlord Posted June 29, 2020 Author Share Posted June 29, 2020 1 minute ago, dugsbody said: Democracy is broken, it is just a team sport. Yeah I hate it. The political discourse in this country is nothing but childish to say the least. That's why I want PR for Westminster so smaller parties can form and cure the apathy that i and many others feel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dugsbody Posted June 29, 2020 Share Posted June 29, 2020 36 minutes ago, Warlord said: Yeah I hate it. The political discourse in this country is nothing but childish to say the least. That's why I want PR for Westminster so smaller parties can form and cure the apathy that i and many others feel. We won't get PR. That was dealt with by the powers that be. Instead, they managed to convince the population that externals are the problem. I would bet that support for PR is divided by age demographics in much the same way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warlord Posted June 29, 2020 Author Share Posted June 29, 2020 3 minutes ago, dugsbody said: We won't get PR. That was dealt with by the powers that be. Instead, they managed to convince the population that externals are the problem. I would bet that support for PR is divided by age demographics in much the same way. I think proper PR would do the trick and I think it would get support . The two party system has failed especially over the last 23 years and I think its going to be so obvious people will demand change.   Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dugsbody Posted June 29, 2020 Share Posted June 29, 2020 4 minutes ago, Warlord said: I think proper PR would do the trick and I think it would get support . The two party system has failed especially over the last 23 years and I think its going to be so obvious people will demand change. I hope so. But there are a lot of people around who just can't tolerate change and will immediately think of reasons not to do it rather than thinking, this thing is broken, here is a proposal to fix it, let's at least try it. I think PR isn't perfect but will be an improvement. I really hope it is in the future for the UK, but I doubt it. The current power system is too entrenched and they have a propaganda machine at their beck and call. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warlord Posted June 29, 2020 Author Share Posted June 29, 2020 1 minute ago, dugsbody said: I hope so. But there are a lot of people around who just can't tolerate change and will immediately think of reasons not to do it rather than thinking, this thing is broken, here is a proposal to fix it, let's at least try it. I think PR isn't perfect but will be an improvement. I really hope it is in the future for the UK, but I doubt it. The current power system is too entrenched and they have a propaganda machine at their beck and call. Yep. You would have to campaign and convince the public. Then you run into the Telegraph/Mail/Sun/Express/BBC/Sky who are all happy with the status quo. So yes, it's a herculean task to campaign and win a PR vote but i'm hoping people will be so sick of the current system the change will come from the bottom up stoked by anger and disillusionment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Banner Posted June 29, 2020 Share Posted June 29, 2020 FF jailed, good precedent. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-53217298 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Switch625 Posted June 29, 2020 Share Posted June 29, 2020 Can't see our spineless lot following suit. Well done French law Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warlord Posted June 29, 2020 Author Share Posted June 29, 2020 1 hour ago, Bruce Banner said: FF jailed, good precedent. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-53217298 Israel are also prosecuting Netanyahu (sp) and jail politicians. It's definitely the way forward! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shrink Proof Posted June 29, 2020 Share Posted June 29, 2020 7 hours ago, Warlord said: Yep. You would have to campaign and convince the public. Then you run into the Telegraph/Mail/Sun/Express/BBC/Sky who are all happy with the status quo. It's not just the Daily Mail and Co promoting the status quo. It said in The Guardian that Johnson was a cult too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkG Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 (edited) 15 hours ago, dugsbody said: Democracy is broken, it is just a team sport. No. It's a beauty contest. Would you let Miss World run the country? If not, why would you let some guy do it just because he got more votes than some other guy one day? Democracy always collapses because it's stupid, and we're pretty close to that point all across the West. PR would be less bad than what Britain (or Canada) has, but it's still stupid. Letting people with no skin in the game vote on the future of a country is about the dumbest idea our ancestors ever came up with. Edited June 30, 2020 by MarkG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckinlimbo Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 On 28/06/2020 at 13:32, nothernsoul said: There is a crucial difference between Johnson and what Corbyn would have done. Corbyn is an ideological socialist and Johnson has no principles at all. They might have printed, borrowed and spent the same amount of money, but corbyn would have also used the opportunity to alter the balance of power within society. Public sector contracts removed from private hands, demanding concessions from private companies in return for cash(shares to employees), bringing back the power of unions etc. The establishment know this too well after the twin scares of Brexit and the election in 2017. It is precisely BECAUSE johnson is an unprincipled opportunist, who will do whatever it takes to keep the public onside, and not upset existing interests, that he is the man of the moment. The right wing press know this too and will mute ideological criticism of his policies. In a similar way, German industrialist in the 1930s might not have been ideological Nazis, but viewed them as preferable to communism. Better having the state tell you what to make in your factory, but still owning it and taking good profits, than total confiscation by the state. For the sake of democracy and the economy too, I would like some political opposition to print and spend, but it wont happen. The only possibility would be from within the conservative party itself, but it isnt there. Spot on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warlord Posted June 30, 2020 Author Share Posted June 30, 2020 Another day.. another announcement from Boris (£5bn , where's he getting that from?) and more cheerleading in the Mail Boris Johnson pledges 'New Deal' to rebuild Britain: PM unveils £5 BILLION programme to construct schools, hospitals and roads to help country 'bounce forward' after coronavirus https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8472349/Boris-Johnson-unveils-massive-programme-construct-schools-hospitals-roads.html I can't be bothered reading it. all. i've work to do! back later Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btl_hater Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 Can someone please explain the appeal of Boris Johnson? I thought that by now I would have worked it out, but I have to admit defeat! All answers welcome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Banner Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 3 minutes ago, btl_hater said: Can someone please explain the appeal of Boris Johnson? I thought that by now I would have worked it out, but I have to admit defeat! All answers welcome. They think he's a lovable rogue, one of them, salt of the earth. Plus, many would sign a pact with Beelzebub if he promised to kick the foreigners out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxxx Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 On 6/28/2020 at 7:08 PM, xxxx said: I completely agree with you, they are my thoughts on BJ too.  He is going to save us with Brexit, blame Covid for the past and come out of this crisis a hero.  He will successfully be voted in for another term. Boris just said "This government is determined to use this crisis finally to tackle this country’s unresolved challenges of the last three decades.“ Covid was the pin that burst the housing bubble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluestone59 Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 7 hours ago, xxxx said: Boris just said "This government is determined to use this crisis finally to tackle this country’s unresolved challenges of the last three decades.“ Covid was the pin that burst the housing bubble. You didn't believe him did you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxxx Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 1 hour ago, Bluestone59 said: You didn't believe him did you? I don’t believe a word BJ or his party says.  They are liars and manipulate to suit their agenda.   This is what i think their agenda is for the future.  Crash the economy and then repair with Brexit, he will go down in history; glory etc.  It’s the only way he can win the next GC and earn voters.  He has to move peoples views on how much he has f@@cked up the past.  I think he is starting again and going to walk away from the sh@t of the past.  There is two different elements now; life before Covid and life after.  Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluestone59 Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 20 minutes ago, xxxx said: I don’t believe a word BJ or his party says.  They are liars and manipulate to suit their agenda.   This is what i think their agenda is for the future.  Crash the economy and then repair with Brexit, he will go down in history; glory etc.  It’s the only way he can win the next GC and earn voters.  He has to move peoples views on how much he has f@@cked up the past.  I think he is starting again and going to walk away from the sh@t of the past.  There is two different elements now; life before Covid and life after.  Rightly, I had suspected sarcasm. Like you I expect he'll probably win the next election, I think the opposition is not measurably better than it was before. A lot of people might not agree with that. Exhanged one bloke for a guy I can't listen to for any length of time. Just because BJ falls to pieces daily doesn't warrant the recent opinion poll figures, he's been doing that from the outset. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxxx Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 7 minutes ago, Bluestone59 said: Rightly, I had suspected sarcasm. Like you I expect he'll probably win the next election, I think the opposition is not measurably better than it was before. A lot of people might not agree with that. Exhanged one bloke for a guy I can't listen to for any length of time. Just because BJ falls to pieces daily doesn't warrant the recent opinion poll figures, he's been doing that from the outset. Bumbling Boris.  He is not a leader.  I don’t even believe he had Covid.  PR setup.  Nothing would surprise me. Yep, he will win next GE, providing he gives under 40’s houses.  He pledged that today.  I don’t really think there is much difference either, they are both self serving. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btl_hater Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 36 minutes ago, xxxx said: Bumbling Boris.  He is not a leader.  I don’t even believe he had Covid.  PR setup.  Nothing would surprise me. Yep, he will win next GE, providing he gives under 40’s houses.  He pledged that today.  I don’t really think there is much difference either, they are both self serving. I'll believe it when I see it, regarding housing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StuartMc Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 2 hours ago, xxxx said: I don’t believe a word BJ or his party says. Maybe the promised 30% first time buyers discount is an impending house price crash? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikhail Liebenstein Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 1 hour ago, xxxx said: Bumbling Boris.  He is not a leader.  I don’t even believe he had Covid.  PR setup.  Nothing would surprise me. Yep, he will win next GE, providing he gives under 40’s houses.  He pledged that today.  I don’t really think there is much difference either, they are both self serving. It will take too long to build those homes. He might be better focusing on the big gains from Brexit..... oh hang on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warlord Posted July 1, 2020 Author Share Posted July 1, 2020 (edited) Today's offering: Boris the bulldozer! PM Johnson vows to tear up planning system red tape and allow homes in disused High Street shops in drive to rebuild Britain and create jobs  https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8476781/Boris-Johnson-vows-tear-planning-red-tape-driver-rebuild-Britain-create-jobs.html Yes, the Daily Mail actually proclaiming that Boris can create jobs. Edited July 1, 2020 by Warlord Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warlord Posted July 1, 2020 Author Share Posted July 1, 2020 (edited) Another fable: Public Health England could be AXED as Boris Johnson admits parts of coronavirus response were 'sluggish'  Axe a bureaucracy? Don;t make me laugh.. He'll just rename it if he does anything that is... Is anyone keeping track of all the promises Boris has made and will break? Like 40 hospitals for northern constituencies? @zugzwang Edited July 1, 2020 by Warlord Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spaniard Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 On 29/06/2020 at 16:43, Bruce Banner said: FF jailed, good precedent. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-53217298 Six out of the eight jail years are suspended sentences, which reminded me of the opening scene of The Godfather. ? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K6LKszIrDzo  Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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