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The US on the brink of Civil War?


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40 million’s unemployed. Serious riots going on. Trump just tweeted people should start using force against those protesting. Also, in seems Anonymous just realised documents containing serious facts about his involvement with sex trafficking. 
 

This 2020 is one of those years where everything happens apparently. 

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I think saying it will be a civil war is like concluding we will have a 40% HPC based on janice in accounts chat with an estate agent. 

In reality its a very small number of rioters and a much larger number of peaceful protestors, still under a million who have no ambition for violence. 

Sad thing is their voice will be lost as the vast majority turns as already happening and demands tougher action on the rioters. 

 

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Its actually concentrated in a small number of Democrat run inner city areas. They will be the ones who suffer when this is over as their local shops,, restaurants, small businesses, drug stores, medical centres and housing have been destroyed and all the contents looted. Who would bother to set up there again - even if they could get insurance. On the first night in Minneapolis.a 190 apartment new development under construction was burned to the ground - every flat intended for people on low or very low incomes. Nothing much will change - but the mostly poor mostly black people in these areas will be the losers when all their services disappear.

Many if not most Americans of course live hundreds of miles from any of these incidents. 

And last year in the US 370 white men were killed in incidents involving police officers compared to 235 African American men - and white men are ten times more likely to be the victim of a police related death than black women in the US. But don't let the facts and emotions get in the way of a good riot - cos quite a lot of white people die too in incidents involving the police in the US too!

Edited by MARTINX9
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54 minutes ago, captainb said:

I think saying it will be a civil war is like concluding we will have a 40% HPC based on janice in accounts chat with an estate agent. 

In reality its a very small number of rioters and a much larger number of peaceful protestors, still under a million who have no ambition for violence. 

Sad thing is their voice will be lost as the vast majority turns as already happening and demands tougher action on the rioters. 

 

Civil war no, threat to the "recovery" yes, second wave of virus..possible, there isn`t going to be a V shaped recovery.

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Civil war - no. This is just the oppressed letting of steam. Calculated to prevent any meaningful political opposition (see those Blacks can't be reasoned with etc). 

When the NRA start advocating gun control, then it's civil war

 

 

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There were riots during Obama tenure as well.

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/14/us/most-americans-hold-grim-view-of-race-relations-poll-finds.html

 

Mr. Obama on Tuesday spoke at a memorial service in Dallas honoring the officers killed when Micah Johnson, a 25-year-old black Army veteran, opened fire at a protest last Thursday. Last week was among the most wrenching since the Black Lives Matter movement began three years ago: On back-to-back days, videos were released showing the deaths of Alton Sterling and Philando Castile at the hands of the police, and the Dallas attack followed a day later.

Its been happening irrespective of who is president.

Hopefully peace prevails.

Cnn is reporting as if Trump is responsible for these deaths.

He can't control individual officer's behaviour just like Obama couldn't control.

Strict laws are needed to prevent deaths like George Floyd. They could've handcuffed instead of pinning down by making him breathless.

Sad times.

 

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6 hours ago, MARTINX9 said:

And last year in the US 370 white men were killed in incidents involving police officers compared to 235 African American men - and white men are ten times more likely to be the victim of a police related death than black women in the US. But don't let the facts and emotions get in the way of a good riot - cos quite a lot of white people die too in incidents involving the police in the US too!

+1 every life matters including white lives.

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7 hours ago, MARTINX9 said:

Its actually concentrated in a small number of Democrat run inner city areas. They will be the ones who suffer when this is over as their local shops,, restaurants, small businesses, drug stores, medical centres and housing have been destroyed and all the contents looted. Who would bother to set up there again - even if they could get insurance. On the first night in Minneapolis.a 190 apartment new development under construction was burned to the ground - every flat intended for people on low or very low incomes. Nothing much will change - but the mostly poor mostly black people in these areas will be the losers when all their services disappear.

Many if not most Americans of course live hundreds of miles from any of these incidents. 

 

I would say the average US Suburban existence is nicer and safer than the average British equivalent.  One HPC related point though, I do think all of the downtown/inner city regeneration we had from the 1990's onward is going to go in reserve.

 

Might be a good time to offload that "City Living" apartment while there is some value in it, whether you are living in downtown Manchester or downtown Chicago.

Edited by reddog
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8 hours ago, captainb said:

I think saying it will be a civil war is like concluding we will have a 40% HPC based on janice in accounts chat with an estate agent. 

In reality its a very small number of rioters and a much larger number of peaceful protestors, still under a million who have no ambition for violence. 

Sad thing is their voice will be lost as the vast majority turns as already happening and demands tougher action on the rioters. 

 

Agreed, this is simply another American race riot. How more irrelevant to HPC can it get?

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7 hours ago, MARTINX9 said:

And last year in the US 370 white men were killed in incidents involving police officers compared to 235 African American men - 

Ratio of white to black in the USA is 6:1

Also I haven't seen the video evidence of a police officer kneeling on a white man's neck until he passed out with asphyxiation.

There have been some absolutely brutal police murders of whites that I've seen evidence of for sure. But it does seem a bit tipped against blacks.

Disclosure: I've had two black friends/aquaintences over last few years, both dual citizenship US/UK. My own character judgement of them is they have tangible justified fear of just being killed on the spot In America for being black, by cops or civilians with guns. They're not making it up.

Edited by Si1
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1 hour ago, Warlord said:

When are we going to have riots here do you think? We're long overdue one. 2011  wast the last 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_England_riots

We may just be a few days behind them. 

A friend of mine, whose family immigrated here from India, has stopped her teenage kids going out at night and has been posting on Facebook that she fears for their lives from the Manchester police. This was last week so before the riots really kicked off. 

There are already pockets of people who are scared ane nervous, there are already large demonstrations for them to gather at, and the police are already getting a bit excited with their riot squads (headlines today about breaking up an illegal rave with riot police) so the ingredients are there IMHO. 

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7 hours ago, dances with sheeple said:

Civil war no, threat to the "recovery" yes, second wave of virus..possible, there isn`t going to be a V shaped recovery.

Im skeptical reference 2nd virus wave.

The virus peak and decline seems to be independent of lockdown measures unless you are very selective in your sample. 

Seems much more like a communicable virus spreading and burning out in a population post 20% infected 

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3 minutes ago, regprentice said:

We may just be a few days behind them. 

A friend of mine, whose family immigrated here from India, has stopped her teenage kids going out at night and has been posting on Facebook that she fears for their lives from the Manchester police. This was last week so before the riots really kicked off. 

There are already pockets of people who are scared ane nervous, there are already large demonstrations for them to gather at, and the police are already getting a bit excited with their riot squads (headlines today about breaking up an illegal rave with riot police) so the ingredients are there IMHO. 

Thanks for passing that on, reg.  They seem to happen every 10-20 years (i.e 1990) and go hand in hand with recessions. Fascinating.

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RE:  Facebook ( @regprentice)

Quote

(CNN Business) Facebook CEO Mark Zuckerberg explained Friday night why his company would take no action on posts in which President Trump threatened "looting" in Minneapolis would lead to "shooting." That explanation came roughly 16 hours after Twitter did take action and despite Zuckerberg's having previously told Congress that posts inciting violence would not be tolerated on Facebook.

"I know many people are upset that we've left the President's posts up," Zuckerberg wrote in a Facebook post.

Trump's posts on Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter read, "These THUGS are dishonoring the memory of George Floyd, and I won't let that happen. Just spoke to Governor Tim Walz and told him that the Military is with him all the way. Any difficulty and we will assume control but, when the looting starts, the shooting starts. Thank you!"

Within two-and-a-half hours of the post, Twitter had placed a warning label on it saying it glorified violence.

Facebook, by contrast, remained silent on the matter for 18 hours until Zuckerberg's post appeared.

Justifying leaving the posts on Facebook and Instagram, Zuckerberg wrote, "We looked very closely at the post that discussed the protests in Minnesota to evaluate whether it violated our policies. Although the post had a troubling historical reference, we decided to leave it up because the National Guard references meant we read it as a warning about state action, and we think people need to know if the government is planning to deploy force. Our policy around incitement of violence allows discussion around state use of force, although I think today's situation raises important questions about what potential limits of that discussion should be."#

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/05/29/tech/facebook-explains-not-flagging-trump/index.html

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14 minutes ago, Si1 said:

Ratio of white to black in the USA is 6:1

Also I haven't seen the video evidence of a police officer kneeling on a white man's neck until he passed out with asphyxiation.

There have been some absolutely brutal police murders of whites that I've seen evidence of for sure. But it does seem a bit tipped against blacks.

Disclosure: I've had two black friends/aquaintences over last few years, both dual citizenship US/UK. My own character judgement of them is they have tangible justified fear of just being killed on the spot In America for being black, by cops or civilians with guns. They're not making it up.

Yes, I confess I was a little confused that the previous poster seemed the think the obvious conclusion was the opposite of what it said.

Racism is different in the USA. There are certainly more sensitive about it and from being an apartheid state until fairly recently, they have done well. But, even the smart professional black men and women I worked with were nervous of police interaction generally, and certainly nervous for their kids. And, my white colleagues who would see film and believe whatever the police said they saw was remarkable.

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1 minute ago, Warlord said:

Get it but to take something trump says at face value is to be taken in by his nonsense. 

That will get the right wing of his party happy. 

He will tweet something about learning from the experience and listening to protestors concerns to keep the middle ground happy. 

He has no intention of doing either. 

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I think you’re missing the point here. 40 millions people without any income and a President who cannot simply understand what’s going on around him. It’s on e day the Democrats, then China, maybe the EU, now Antifa tomorrow the Media. He should listen now. There’s a lot of pain in America.

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7 hours ago, captainb said:

Im skeptical reference 2nd virus wave.

The virus peak and decline seems to be independent of lockdown measures unless you are very selective in your sample. 

Seems much more like a communicable virus spreading and burning out in a population post 20% infected 

Maybe, but I meant that people rioting on a big scale shuts down a recovery almost as effectively as a virus?

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Forget about the economy. There’s a clear path here. Alt-right is a proto-fascist ideology where nationalism is sold along with a sort of corporativism plus anti-globalism. I am a liberal, UK and classic version of the term, not the XXI century American add-on. 
trump and those behind him are in search of a top-down state, because they believe this will protect their industries and economy, are bloody scared about globalisation as, once realised the US cannot control the system anymore, they will loose presence on the world stage. They couldn’t care less about whether American products are being sold worldwide they do not want imports to weaken the American players’ position at home. Now, in order to have such a control on the economy, you need to have a top-down approach, democracy is not useful here. What Trump and his aides are doing here is trying to represent the US institutions as weak, with the federal state and the president as the only place where true and effective decision making process can be achieved. He’s putting gas on flames, but not showing up, he wants the riots on the streets, it’s the only way he can then present himself as the man of law and order. This is classic fascist strategy. This is how Mussolini and Hitler took power. The bad news is that they will probably succeed. The American Congress is powerless, they’re like the Senate in Rome when the Republic collapsed. A brunch of corrupted and not very smart people, still thinking they’re worth what they read on history books. The last line of defend are the States and their governors in the US. They’re the only one in this situation capable of putting obstacles to the march of the Right in the US. They’ve been standings before the bullets from Trump since the start of the pandemic, with the riots the scale of attacks reached even higher levels. The Alt-Right know they’re the last door to smash before getting into the golden room. 
I wouldn’t be surprised if the re-election campaign from DT will be directed towards the States rather then JB. 
What I am not sure about is how powerful the States could be if DT pulls the trigger. 
Will they fight back? Will they secede? Will they just refuse to send their electors in November? 
Huge chapter to write here. 
 

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  • 417 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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