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Cornona Effects on House Prices


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2 hours ago, 2buyornot2buy said:

I remember San Fran residents up in arms at the google influx not so long ago. I've a few relations living in the city. I'm not sure if they'll be pleased or disappointed at the exodus you describe. I'll note that Facebook have already mentioned regional pay for those not working in their more expensive Cali location. 

With regards Belfast, we'll know soon enough if you anecdotes have any statistical relevance. NISRA publish internal migration figures. It will be interesting to see if there's any statistically relevant increase on migration from London postcodes. 

I can see the appeal. If I was on 80-90k in London, I'd be the first to jump ship from the HMO or 1 bed I'd no doubt be living in on that sort of money. If your mates were working remotely pre pandemic why not move somewhere cheaper years ago? 

And what happens to these people once lockdown ends?  Sure, some will remain remote, but most will have their ass hauled back to their grotty London HMO to be able to get to the office where the boss can see them.  

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55 minutes ago, satsuma said:

And what happens to these people once lockdown ends?  Sure, some will remain remote, but most will have their ass hauled back to their grotty London HMO to be able to get to the office where the boss can see them.  

That's it. I know a quite a few software developers. Stayed local because they didn't want to move to London. They work for the usual suspects here. Not my area of expertise but obviously skilled people. Their salary is capped because they refuse to move to London, with a larger salary but lower living standard. 

As a business owner I can say this. If the new norm is remote working, they won't be at London salaries, they'll revert to the lowest that can be achieved for the expertise required. 

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Yes in the long term if these engineers can work remote, the London companies won't want to keep paying £90K per engineer.

They'll do what all the American companies are doing and just lay off the £90K engineers and re-hire £50K ones with help from Invest NI to further subsidise the wage.

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You can bet your ass employers will be slavering at the thought of being able to drop salaries and pocket the difference.  “Sorry lads, this pandemic is hell and we have to cut costs, we are temporarily reducing the salaries of all staff”.  I suppose there will be a variety of ******** reasons cleared with HR.  The reality being, people are allowed to continue working from home while employers take total advantage of the situation.  You can replace the 90k London lads with 45k Norn Ireland based folks.  Top of the line Norn Ireland developers are on 60K, the journeymen are on 45k.

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2 hours ago, JoeDavola said:

They'll do what all the American companies are doing and just lay off the £90K engineers and re-hire £50K ones with help from Invest NI to further subsidise the wage.

Or just hire some Indian bod @ £peanuts/year and not worry about the fact he found VB a 'challenge' at university.

Disclaimer: I'm not saying India doesn't produce good coders, just that it seems most of their universities as well as the students that go there are, well, not very good to put it lightly.

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31 minutes ago, LandOfConfusion said:

Or just hire some Indian bod @ £peanuts/year and not worry about the fact he found VB a 'challenge' at university.

Disclaimer: I'm not saying India doesn't produce good coders, just that it seems most of their universities as well as the students that go there are, well, not very good to put it lightly.

😅😅 ah well, the price of progress, Norn Ireland should be happy to be at the point where local jobs are offshored 

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1 hour ago, satsuma said:

You can bet your ass employers will be slavering at the thought of being able to drop salaries and pocket the difference.  “Sorry lads, this pandemic is hell and we have to cut costs, we are temporarily reducing the salaries of all staff”.  I suppose there will be a variety of ******** reasons cleared with HR.  The reality being, people are allowed to continue working from home while employers take total advantage of the situation.  You can replace the 90k London lads with 45k Norn Ireland based folks.  Top of the line Norn Ireland developers are on 60K, the journeymen are on 45k.

Yes, people are deluded if they think their London employer is gonna pay them 90K to code in Belfast.

I know someone works in Belfast for a huge US financial software company, made billions in profit this year, they've still cancelled bonuses in 2020 and laid people off stateside because of a 'difficult economy' despite huge profits.

As an employee you are a cost to be minimized. If your job is completely remote then that's not necessarily a good thing.

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27 minutes ago, JoeDavola said:

Yes, people are deluded if they think their London employer is gonna pay them 90K to code in Belfast.

I know someone works in Belfast for a huge US financial software company, made billions in profit this year, they've still cancelled bonuses in 2020 and laid people off stateside because of a 'difficult economy' despite huge profits.

As an employee you are a cost to be minimized. If your job is completely remote then that's not necessarily a good thing.

I suspect it'll be some sort of blend, where it will be 2 days in the London office and 3 days at home. 

90k sounds good if it's actual remote working. Not so good when it's 2 flights a week and a night in a hotel on 4.5k a month. You'd be better off taking the 45k Belfast job offer. 

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5 hours ago, 2buyornot2buy said:

I suspect it'll be some sort of blend, where it will be 2 days in the London office and 3 days at home. 

90k sounds good if it's actual remote working. Not so good when it's 2 flights a week and a night in a hotel on 4.5k a month. You'd be better off taking the 45k Belfast job offer. 

Yeah, some people might just have to suck it up, they have flipped a coin and come back to Norn Ireland in the hope the boss will let them keep working from home, some are in for a shock when they realise they need to pay for flights and hotels.

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18 hours ago, 2buyornot2buy said:

I suspect it'll be some sort of blend, where it will be 2 days in the London office and 3 days at home. 

90k sounds good if it's actual remote working. Not so good when it's 2 flights a week and a night in a hotel on 4.5k a month. You'd be better off taking the 45k Belfast job offer. 

I think some people would still take that for the ego boost of being able to say they earn £90K, even though they'd have an overall better quality of life earning £45K in Belfast.

Never fails to amaze me how people sacrifice huge amounts of leisuire time and pile on massive amounts of stress to earn ever-so-slightly more money when they'd still have plenty of money in a job that was far less stressful.

Mate of mine moved from an easy 50K a year to a 55K job working 60 hour weeks. Mug.

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58 minutes ago, JoeDavola said:

I think some people would still take that for the ego boost of being able to say they earn £90K, even though they'd have an overall better quality of life earning £45K in Belfast.

Never fails to amaze me how people sacrifice huge amounts of leisuire time and pile on massive amounts of stress to earn ever-so-slightly more money when they'd still have plenty of money in a job that was far less stressful.

Mate of mine moved from an easy 50K a year to a 55K job working 60 hour weeks. Mug.

Personally I have lost friends who were ex colleagues over this type of stuff.  I realised a long time ago that the whole wage slave thing is not for me.  I think people would rather cut off contact than have their little illusions shattered.  Its not easy to see the evidence that all the commuting, back stabbing and long hours are not worth it financially.  When they see what you can do as a self employed person I think it sticks in their throat.  I realised this when after a year of busting a gut for an employer I had a 6k pay increase and half went to the tax man.  Meanwhile my uneducated uncle was pulling in 7k a week doing site works.  He was keeping most of it and retired at 55.  I decided his way made more sense.  

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6 hours ago, satsuma said:

Personally I have lost friends who were ex colleagues over this type of stuff.  I realised a long time ago that the whole wage slave thing is not for me.  I think people would rather cut off contact than have their little illusions shattered.  Its not easy to see the evidence that all the commuting, back stabbing and long hours are not worth it financially.  When they see what you can do as a self employed person I think it sticks in their throat.  I realised this when after a year of busting a gut for an employer I had a 6k pay increase and half went to the tax man.  Meanwhile my uneducated uncle was pulling in 7k a week doing site works.  He was keeping most of it and retired at 55.  I decided his way made more sense.  

Yep.

I'll never be a big earner, but I've found a low stress enjoyable job that pays me more money than I need. I've experienced work that was making me ill before and I'm doing my best never to have to be in that situation again.

The people who have chased the 'career' seem to be the most miserable and stressed out, and for an extra 5-10K in many cases pre-tax.

Happiest bloke I know stacks shelves in Tesco and has done since he was 17. Intelligent bloke with plenty of hobbies and interests who still values his free time.

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20 hours ago, satsuma said:

Personally I have lost friends who were ex colleagues over this type of stuff.  I realised a long time ago that the whole wage slave thing is not for me.  I think people would rather cut off contact than have their little illusions shattered.  Its not easy to see the evidence that all the commuting, back stabbing and long hours are not worth it financially.  When they see what you can do as a self employed person I think it sticks in their throat.  I realised this when after a year of busting a gut for an employer I had a 6k pay increase and half went to the tax man.  Meanwhile my uneducated uncle was pulling in 7k a week doing site works.  He was keeping most of it and retired at 55.  I decided his way made more sense.  

I agree with all that however self employment brings its own worries for me. I've had a few sleepless nights when it's suddenly dawned on me I'm "responsible" for dozens of mortgage payments and retirement plans. I sometimes think I'm not ruthless enough for it. In saying all that, unless you're really top of your game in a professional job here, you're not going to make that much money and the end result of being top in many professions (law, accountancy, consultancy) is self employment(equity) anyway. 

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14 hours ago, JoeDavola said:

Yep.

I'll never be a big earner, but I've found a low stress enjoyable job that pays me more money than I need. I've experienced work that was making me ill before and I'm doing my best never to have to be in that situation again.

The people who have chased the 'career' seem to be the most miserable and stressed out, and for an extra 5-10K in many cases pre-tax.

Happiest bloke I know stacks shelves in Tesco and has done since he was 17. Intelligent bloke with plenty of hobbies and interests who still values his free time.

Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen nineteen and six , result happiness.
Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds ought and six, result misery

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On 15/02/2021 at 10:36, 2buyornot2buy said:

Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen nineteen and six , result happiness.
Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds ought and six, result misery

Spot on.

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15 minutes ago, JoeDavola said:

Absolutely unbelievable.

Is it really unbelievable. You have government paying the wages for millions of citizens, giving on average 7k every 3 months to the self employed and grants to every candle making business going, along with zero SDLT in the fave of price rises. The money has to go somewhere. 

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2 hours ago, 2buyornot2buy said:

Is it really unbelievable. You have government paying the wages for millions of citizens, giving on average 7k every 3 months to the self employed and grants to every candle making business going, along with zero SDLT in the fave of price rises. The money has to go somewhere. 

To be fair there are millions Of self employed left to rot by the Tory spiv government, not everyone is sitting so high on the hog

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3 hours ago, 2buyornot2buy said:

Is it really unbelievable. You have government paying the wages for millions of citizens, giving on average 7k every 3 months to the self employed and grants to every candle making business going, along with zero SDLT in the fave of price rises. The money has to go somewhere. 

Are there stats out for the average amount given out on the self employed income support scheme? I’d be surprised if the average given out was so close to the maximum allowed.

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7 hours ago, nigooner said:

Are there stats out for the average amount given out on the self employed income support scheme? I’d be surprised if the average given out was so close to the maximum allowed.

The stats are published on you Gov and you're quite right. The average is much smaller. I should have checked. Its around 2.9k per grant. 

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6 hours ago, 2buyornot2buy said:

The stats are published on you Gov and you're quite right. The average is much smaller. I should have checked. Its around 2.9k per grant. 

Good to know that, thanks. Feel sorry for any self employed that don’t qualify fir any grants or support, or who can’t even get access to bounce back loans or CBILS loans. It seems a complete lottery, with the biggest being who you originally banked with before covid existed. Most banks now aren’t even allowing new customers to open an account which is ridiculous. 

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59 minutes ago, nigooner said:

Good to know that, thanks. Feel sorry for any self employed that don’t qualify fir any grants or support, or who can’t even get access to bounce back loans or CBILS loans. It seems a complete lottery, with the biggest being who you originally banked with before covid existed. Most banks now aren’t even allowing new customers to open an account which is ridiculous. 

I think that's it. You either doing really well with covid, got a few grants and can trade at or above pre covid levels or you're just surviving. 

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