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Mass changes to UK immigration requirements


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8 minutes ago, iamnumerate said:

He said that his rent was being paid.

It doesn't matter what he said, as it's not how the benefit system works. 

8 minutes ago, iamnumerate said:

Getting entitled to shows that it would have been, seems like free to me.

See above. 

8 minutes ago, iamnumerate said:

Now you are talking about asylum seekers again. Different rules. 

8 minutes ago, iamnumerate said:

And I quote

" For others, this pragmatism took the form of being worried about access to welfare including free healthcare and income support. There was some anxiety also about the levels of prejudice and discrimination that might encounter if they were to return to their countries of citizenship:"

 

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1 minute ago, NobodyInParticular said:

As asylum seekers, they are not allowed to work, hence being unemployed. As asylum seekers we owe an obligation under international law to not let them starve. 

No one wants asylum seekers to starve - but why should they or anyone else get free housing in expensive areas?

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https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/jan/28/british-dream-europe-african-citizens

The British dream: why Europe's African citizens come to Britain

This article is more than 7 years old
 
 
Talking to African migrants, I have found many admire Britain so much they give up better public services elsewhere in the EU
 
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Indeed, we met so many Nigerians from Germany, or Somalis from Denmark, that we asked Oxford University's Migration Observatory to crunch the numbers on how many EU migrants are not originally from Europe. They found that 141,000 people, 7% of those who came to the UK under EU rules were born outside the continent. Somalis are one of the biggest such groups, with an estimated 20,000 coming to the UK from the Netherlands alone. Studies show that between one third and a half of the entire Dutch Somali community has moved to the UK.

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Quman's family had been housed by the Dutch government. She grew up there and spoke Dutch fluently. After finishing school, she would have been entitled to a subsidised university education; even her bus passes would have been paid for by the state.

Instead, in 2003, she told her father Jibril that she wanted to move to Britain, where she would have to pay for university. He wasn't upset – in fact he decided to quit his job in a printing firm and bring the whole family to London.

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3 minutes ago, NobodyInParticular said:

So you arrive in a country with nothing, and not allowed to work. How is it you are proposing exactly that they pay for housing? 

I think you are misunderstanding me.  My problem is that they get free housing in expensive areas.  I don't mind them getting housing similar to what the average Brit can afford.

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2 minutes ago, iamnumerate said:

I think you are misunderstanding me.  My problem is that they get free housing in expensive areas.  I don't mind them getting housing similar to what the average Brit can afford.

UK benefits system is unlimited, needs based rather than time limited,  contribution based, like the rest of the EU.

The Somalis above, like various other EY migrants dont like the continents workfare system, where benefits require them to work, learn the language  etc.

The UK benefit system is insane. It needs to be contribution based and time limited.

 

 

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1 minute ago, spyguy said:

UK benefits system is unlimited, needs based rather than time limited,  contribution based, like the rest of the EU.

The Somalis above, like various other EY migrants dont like the continents workfare system, where benefits require them to work, learn the language  etc.

The UK benefit system is insane. It needs to be contribution based and time limited.

 

 

Very true.  If that had happened in 97, Brexit probably wouldn't even be a word and this forum wouldn't exist.

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2 hours ago, iamnumerate said:

So why have prices not risen equally everywhere in the UK?  There are places where it is 10x since 97 others 2x times.

Because of the changing dynamics of supply and demand. Demand in cities increased because of more high paying jobs in cities and fewer in rural areas due to the changing composition of our economies. Supply and demand is still the primary underlying driver of rent increases. But cost of credit multiplies the effect in house prices because they're purchased with credit.

Can you not understand that it cannot be otherwise? Just do the maths.

Edited by dugsbody
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50 minutes ago, dugsbody said:

Because of the changing dynamics of supply and demand. Demand in cities increased because of more high paying jobs in cities and fewer in rural areas due to the changing composition of our economies. Supply and demand is still the primary underlying driver of rent increases. But cost of credit multiplies the effect in house prices because they're purchased with credit.

Can you not understand that it cannot be otherwise? Just do the maths.

Good explanation however one reason why demand in cities increased was because of people coming to the UK.

In some cases these people got social housing and increased the demand for private rent so fuelling BTL.

(Although the landlords I know apart from one hate Brexit, possibly because they fear the loss of tenants ).

Edited by iamnumerate
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44 minutes ago, iamnumerate said:

Good explanation however one reason why demand in cities increased was because of people coming to the UK.

In some cases these people got social housing and increased the demand for private rent so fuelling BTL.

(Although the landlords I know apart from one hate Brexit, possibly because they fear the loss of tenants ).

London is now majority foreign born.

This years census -assuming it goes ahead -is going to be dynamite.

 

 

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8 hours ago, iamnumerate said:

I think you are misunderstanding me.  My problem is that they get free housing in expensive areas.  I don't mind them getting housing similar to what the average Brit can afford.

They don't get free housing unless they are asylum seekers, although you've also claimed others do.

In which bit of the country do you think asylum seekers should live? 

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5 hours ago, dugsbody said:

Because of the changing dynamics of supply and demand. Demand in cities increased because of more high paying jobs in cities and fewer in rural areas due to the changing composition of our economies. Supply and demand is still the primary underlying driver of rent increases. But cost of credit multiplies the effect in house prices because they're purchased with credit.

Can you not understand that it cannot be otherwise? Just do the maths.

Exactly. 

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8 hours ago, spyguy said:

UK benefits system is unlimited,

No, it's not. 

8 hours ago, spyguy said:

needs based rather than time limited,  contribution based, like the rest of the EU.

As noted below, it's a mix, just like in the EU overall, but with different implementation details. 

8 hours ago, spyguy said:

The Somalis above, like various other EY migrants dont like the continents workfare system, where benefits require them to work, learn the language  etc.

Asylum seekers are not allowed to work. Non-EU immigrants who have not worked don't get full benefits. They do if they have worked (contribution based elements). But non EU immigrants get get limited options. My wife is from outside the EU and I know what she was entitled to when she moved here: nothing. 

8 hours ago, spyguy said:

The UK benefit system is insane. It needs to be contribution based and time limited.

If you are going to argue about the benefits system it would help if you knew how it worked. Already, many elements are time limited and contribution based. There is an backstop that isn't and without it people would literally starve. Do you want people to starve. 

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10 hours ago, iamnumerate said:

No one wants asylum seekers to starve - but why should they or anyone else get free housing in expensive areas?

Then which parts of the UK are acceptable? Already asylum seekers get moved, but often funding doesn't follow and councils don't necessarily want groups with no money, so they have to be dispersed. What is your plan? 

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1 hour ago, NobodyInParticular said:

Then which parts of the UK are acceptable? Already asylum seekers get moved, but often funding doesn't follow and councils don't necessarily want groups with no money, so they have to be dispersed. What is your plan? 

No one should get any benefits if they live in an expensive house.  Brit or Foreigners.

Expensive up to debate but it is a good principle  Wouldn't you agree?

I think councils would happily take asylum seekers if they got given the money we were going to spend on putting them in an expensive area.

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11 hours ago, NobodyInParticular said:

It doesn't matter what he said, as it's not how the benefit system works. 

See above. 

Now you are talking about asylum seekers again. Different rules. 

 

No I am not

"Because the Somalis we spoke to were European rather than British citizens however, the vote for Britain to leave the European Union threw any sense of ‘home’ or belonging they had into disarray."

Asylum seekers are never secondary migrants

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12 hours ago, spyguy said:

UK benefits system is unlimited, needs based rather than time limited,  contribution based, like the rest of the EU.

The Somalis above, like various other EY migrants dont like the continents workfare system, where benefits require them to work, learn the language  etc.

The UK benefit system is insane. It needs to be contribution based and time limited.

 

 

We speak English is also a huge effect, i was contacted by a Syrian researcher in Norway asking for a job in 2019. I asked him why he wanted to move given it was such a wealthy country, he replied that they had looked into staying in Norway but they would make his whole family learn norwegian "what use is that to us?".

Edited by debtlessmanc
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