Jump to content
House Price Crash Forum

Mass changes to UK immigration requirements


Recommended Posts

 

My point was that the tragedy highlighted that Albanians are claiming asylum in the UK. 

Do you not think it's absurd that someone can claim asylum from a country that is an EU candidate?

It's a candidate. Human rights issues are a big part of why it's not a member. 

 

Albania can't both be too dangerous for her to return yet safe enough to consider granting freedom of movement to the whole country. 

It's not considered safe enough, which is why it's only a candidate. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 1.6k
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

 

Or operating cheap holidays to the same country - see above.

You used to be able to get cheap holidays to Poland in the 1980s despite human rights issues, so I'm not sure what point you are making. You could even get cheap and very chaperoned holidays to Alabania in the 1980s, showing you the workers' paradise. 

A friend if mine went to Poland in the late 80s, mostly because he was curious and wanted to have cultural learnings of the area. Apparently the quality of accommodation was terrible, but it was interesting and cheap and not chaperoned and enough people spoke German (which he did at school) that he got to hear first hand how awful things were. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
 

How would you prosecute someone for making a claim they are legally entitled to make? You can be prosecuted for giving false information but that isn't what I think you're referring to.

This from the government website:

"To be eligible you must have left your country and be unable to go back because you fear persecution."

 

I know people who got asylum and went back on holiday the next day.

Surely if someone claims asylum and they are not in danger that is fraud?  No different to someone telling the insurance company that their phone was nicked.

Link to post
Share on other sites
 

It's a candidate. Human rights issues are a big part of why it's not a member. 

Funny. The EU seem pretty keen to bring Albania in. 

No mention of human rights. France vetoed membership because Macron doesn't want another Hungary: let them into the EU then allow them to hold it to ransom. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
 

I know people who got asylum and went back on holiday the next day.

Surely if someone claims asylum and they are not in danger that is fraud?  No different to someone telling the insurance company that their phone was nicked.

Fear is a feeling, theft isn't.

How can you prove a genuine fear or not? 

I struggle to believe someone went on holiday back to the country they just claimed asylum from the next day. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
 

Funny. The EU seem pretty keen to bring Albania in. 

No mention of human rights. France vetoed membership because Macron doesn't want another Hungary: let them into the EU then allow them to hold it to ransom. 

They were the comments of a single person. 

I have posted the issues Albania had to address to start negotiations. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
 

I know (and l did say she was refused) however in 'considering' her asylum claim she's managed to remain in the UK since 2014. That's coming up for 7 years. My point is that the claim shouldn't even have been considered. She's from Europe and somewhere that is being very seriously considered for membership of the EU so Albania can't be that dodgy, right? 

Again true, however Von der Leyen (and Junker before her) were pushing for this to happen recently, and Albania along with (North) Macedonia seem to be the next countries to join. IIRC the latter changed its name for entirely this reason to appease Greece so that they wouldn't veto membership. 

How did Romania get into the EU then given mainstream Romanian treatment of the Roma? This is off-topic but i'm genuinely curious.  

The 1951 Refugee Convention doesn't prohibit asylum claims from people based on whether their country of origin has applied to join a trading bloc. 

Everyone has the right to apply for asylum or the idea of seeking asylum would become pointless. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
 

Fear is a feeling, theft isn't.

How can you prove a genuine fear or not? 

I struggle to believe someone went on holiday back to the country they just claimed asylum from the next day. 

Sorry I mistyped - they went on holiday as soon as they got asylum not claimed it.  Oops new year new typos!

Link to post
Share on other sites
 

Everyone has the right to apply for asylum or the idea of seeking asylum would become pointless. 

So, by that logic, there's no reason why we shouldn't consider asylum applications from Germany, France, and Italy now that FoM no longer applies to the UK from these countries? Would that not be a little absurd?

Link to post
Share on other sites
 

So, by that logic, there's no reason why we shouldn't consider asylum applications from Germany, France, and Italy now that FoM no longer applies to the UK from these countries? Would that not be a little absurd?

I bet that someone from the EU will claim asylum in the next 2 years to get housing benefit etc.

Link to post
Share on other sites
 

Have you clicked the bottom link in his twitter post and read it? 

I have. What about it? It seems to correspond with the Tweet. It's spoken in the first person i'll grant you that but this isn't Michel/Tusk's own personal thoughts. When they speak they are stating the policy of the EU. 

This section is telling. No mention of human rights issues holding up accession talks. Far from it. 

Let me be very clear: North Macedonia and Albania are not to blame for this. And the Commission reports are also clear that both these countries did what they were asked to do. And the adoption of the Prespa Agreement was a truly extraordinary achievement. So both countries have the right to start EU negotiations as of today. They are ready. 

It was only France and a few others that stopped talks going further.

Unfortunately, a few member states are not ready yet. This is why we didn't manage to reach a positive decision. Personally, I think it was a mistake, but I will not comment on it further.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Here is a story from Breitbart about refugees going home on holiday.

https://www.breitbart.com/europe/2019/07/09/syrian-refugee-complains-he-did-not-have-time-syria-vacation/

 

I am sure if it were wrong the BBC or Guardian would have debunked it.

The BBC has done for other mistakes on Breitbart and of course it was correct about the 2015/16 New Year rape gangs in Germany.

Link to post
Share on other sites
 

Syrians are largely Arab, Turks are not. Not that this excuses any behaviour as we are all humans. 

"Turkish" is much more linguistic nowadays, the Turkish impact was more political, cultural, and linguistic than genetic, like the Roman and Norman conquests of Britain.

A large percentage of Turks and Syrians really have shared Greco-Roman roots, but they were Islamified, with moderate genetic Arab, Kurdish, and Jewish imput.

Link to post
Share on other sites
 

So, by that logic, there's no reason why we shouldn't consider asylum applications from Germany, France, and Italy now that FoM no longer applies to the UK from these countries? Would that not be a little absurd?

We don't get to pick which claims we process as we are signatories to the 1951 convention which allows anyone from anywhere to seek asylum in the UK.

 

We either process all claims or none or the point of a convention on refugees becomes meaningless.

Link to post
Share on other sites
 

I have. What about it? It seems to correspond with the Tweet. It's spoken in the first person i'll grant you that but this isn't Michel/Tusk's own personal thoughts. When they speak they are stating the policy of the EU. 

This section is telling. No mention of human rights issues holding up accession talks. Far from it. 

Let me be very clear: North Macedonia and Albania are not to blame for this. And the Commission reports are also clear that both these countries did what they were asked to do. And the adoption of the Prespa Agreement was a truly extraordinary achievement. So both countries have the right to start EU negotiations as of today. They are ready. 

It was only France and a few others that stopped talks going further.

Unfortunately, a few member states are not ready yet. This is why we didn't manage to reach a positive decision. Personally, I think it was a mistake, but I will not comment on it further.

 

If it's in the first person then it's his personal thoughts.

What is the date of Albania accepting the conditions that cover the preconditions for accession negotiations and the date the Albania asylum seeker made a claim?

Link to post
Share on other sites
 

I struggle to believe the day after they were granted asylum they went back to their country of origin on holiday.

Why?  People do claim asylum fraudulently and so when they can go home on holiday they do so.  There is no danger in doing so after all.

Link to post
Share on other sites
 

Here is a story from Breitbart about refugees going home on holiday.

https://www.breitbart.com/europe/2019/07/09/syrian-refugee-complains-he-did-not-have-time-syria-vacation/

 

I am sure if it were wrong the BBC or Guardian would have debunked it.

The BBC has done for other mistakes on Breitbart and of course it was correct about the 2015/16 New Year rape gangs in Germany.

"Breitbart News Network is an American far-right syndicated news, opinion and commentary website founded in mid-2007 by American conservative commentator Andrew Breitbart, who conceived it as "the Huffington Post of the right"."

Even taking account of the above quote that story amounts to the net sum of zero. 

An 18 year old with a dodgy background getting paid to write for various news outlets makes serious unproven claims.

Link to post
Share on other sites
 

Why?  People do claim asylum fraudulently and so when they can go home on holiday they do so.  There is no danger in doing so after all.

Cab you evidence a single person that has been granted refugee status that has then been proven to be fraudulent?

Link to post
Share on other sites
 

Cab you evidence a single person that has been granted refugee status that has then been proven to be fraudulent?

Musta Jamal managed to stay because of danger in Somalia - he later fled there to escape justice.  That sounds fraudulent to me.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-423813/The-killer-asylum-seekers.html

 

Of course if he had been law abiding here - this would never have come out.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
 

Musta Jamal managed to stay because of danger in Somalia - he later fled there to escape justice.  That sounds fraudulent to me.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-423813/The-killer-asylum-seekers.html

 

Of course if he had been law abiding here - this would never have come out.

 

Mustafa Jamal came to the UK as a 12 year old.

He was granted leave to stay 6 years later.

He would at no time have been involved in making any asylum claims, fraudulently or not. It would have been his parents making the claim and given one of them was a warlord I'd say their claim to be fleeing persecution held up.

After he was released from prison he was considered for deportation but international law prevented this due to the precarious state of his homeland. 

Given this was 17 years after he was taken out of Somalia he probably calculated the difference between him being a 12 year old child and now a 29 year old man lessened his risk going back to his homeland and was preferable to being incarcerated for a long time (he got 35 years here in the end).

The DM use terms very loosely to confuse their readers into following their political agenda and needs to be read with a critical and analytical eye. Often though it's just cheap manipulated click bait.

I like to read around the subject a little more beyond the DM to at least get a more informed perspective.

So, back to square one.

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.