Bruce Banner Posted September 5, 2021 Share Posted September 5, 2021 (edited) 14 minutes ago, anonguest said: No need to send an official to your home. In time the official will be in your home! Given the rapid take up, from those I see around me, I'm sure there'll be an Amazon Alexa or such like device in every home - and it will send you a polite reminder to take the pills. And IF you don't reply or give a verbal assurance that you have then.... I wouldn't be surprised if the next step up in these home 'help' devices will be for them to come with cameras or voice pattern recognition to detect signs of lying.....😟 People either don't know what these devices do, or they just don't care...... "If you've nothing to hide, you've nothing to fear" Talking about fear, this looks fun. While some hide in their houses, others don't . Dario Costa sets Guinness World Record in Tunnel Pass (redbull.com) Edited September 5, 2021 by Bruce Banner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riedquat Posted September 5, 2021 Share Posted September 5, 2021 1 hour ago, Bruce Banner said: People either don't know what these devices do, or they just don't care...... "If you've nothing to hide, you've nothing to fear" I really think that they just don't care, it's really quite disturbing just how much of it is in day to day life, and they just get utterly puzzled if you dislike it without having an immediate physical or financial downside threatening. The same society who just a few decades ago would've dismissed an accurate portrayal of now as a bit of far-fetched sci-fi dystopia. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Banner Posted September 5, 2021 Share Posted September 5, 2021 Ministers confirm vaccine passports WILL be required for large venues | Daily Mail Online "He said parents of healthy 12 to 15-year-olds will be asked for consent if coronavirus jabs are approved for their children. 'I can give that assurance, absolutely,' he said." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FallingAwake Posted September 5, 2021 Share Posted September 5, 2021 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FallingAwake Posted September 5, 2021 Share Posted September 5, 2021 February 7th, 2021. No plans, until they have plans. Won't do it, until they do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Banner Posted September 5, 2021 Share Posted September 5, 2021 What do you expect from a government led by this piece of work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneCernan Posted September 5, 2021 Share Posted September 5, 2021 (edited) So you can have two jabs, still catch COVID, not know it, and spread it to many people in the crowded venue that just welcomed you with open arms, yet you won't be let in without a passport if you take a test there and then to give a fairly accurate indication that you don't have COVID. Edited September 5, 2021 by GeneCernan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pig Posted September 5, 2021 Share Posted September 5, 2021 23 minutes ago, GeneCernan said: So you can have two jabs, still catch COVID, not know it, and spread it to many people in the crowded venue that just welcomed you with open arms, yet you won't be let in without a passport if you take a test there and then to give a fairly accurate indication that you don't have COVID. As far as I'm aware the vaccine makes no difference as to whether you catch COVID, and it makes no difference to your ability to spread it. I believe, and do correct me if I'm wrong, is that what it does do is reduce your chances of being seriously ill from COVID. Reason enough to choose to be vaccinated I grant you, but what I simply cannot see is how it makes a blind bit of difference to transmission, and therefore what the point of a passport is? Testing in a number of circumstances makes good sense to me, passports seems to be nothing more than a means to coerce people into being vaccinated. Indeed, if some people are (quite reasonably) cautious about being vaccinated, then the coercion will undoubtedly make them even less trusting of vaccines. The vaccines reduce the likelihood of you spreading the disease. They reduce the likelihood of you catching it and reduce the severity and period of infectiousness. However as far as I understand you’re just as infectious when you’ve got it - that’s where it gets slightly confusing. I think what that means is put 10 known infected people with Covid passports in a room with a thousand people and they will be (more or less) just as infectious as putting 10 known infected people without passports. But…. There will be on average much less spreading of disease in 1000 person rooms full of vaccinated people vs non-vaccinated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneCernan Posted September 5, 2021 Share Posted September 5, 2021 ^ Yes, I went to read up on this so I removed the last two paragraphs, but it appears that you had them quoted before I did so 🙂 No matter though, and thank you for your comments. They have clarified the passports thing a little more for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FallingAwake Posted September 5, 2021 Share Posted September 5, 2021 (edited) 5 hours ago, Bruce Banner said: Ministers confirm vaccine passports WILL be required for large venues | Daily Mail Online "He said parents of healthy 12 to 15-year-olds will be asked for consent if coronavirus jabs are approved for their children. 'I can give that assurance, absolutely,' he said." And then... Children could override parents’ decision on vaccines, says Zahawi https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/sep/05/vaccine-passports-to-be-required-for-nightclubs-and-mass-events-in-england "Nadhim Zahawi, the vaccines minister, said parents of healthy 12- to 15-year-olds would be asked for consent if coronavirus jabs were approved for their children – expected to be pushed through by ministers this week. But he added that children could override their parents’ wishes “if they’re deemed to be competent to make that decision, with all the information available”. In my opinion, the best way to test their competency would be to give them a quiz on the JCVI's decision not to recommend vaccinating this group, and the reasons behind it. If the child can fully understand the JCVI's decision, I'd say they're Gillick competent Edited September 5, 2021 by FallingAwake Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pig Posted September 5, 2021 Share Posted September 5, 2021 7 minutes ago, FallingAwake said: And then... Children could override parents’ decision on vaccines, says Zahawi https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/sep/05/vaccine-passports-to-be-required-for-nightclubs-and-mass-events-in-england "Nadhim Zahawi, the vaccines minister, said parents of healthy 12- to 15-year-olds would be asked for consent if coronavirus jabs were approved for their children – expected to be pushed through by ministers this week. But he added that children could override their parents’ wishes “if they’re deemed to be competent to make that decision, with all the information available”. In my opinion, the best way to test their competency would be to give them a quiz on the JCVI's decision not to recommend vaccinating this group, and the reasons behind it. If the child can fully understand the JCVI's decision, I'd say they're Gillick competent Yes well worth parents and children carefully reading the JCVI decision. https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/jcvi-statement-september-2021-covid-19-vaccination-of-children-aged-12-to-15-years/jcvi-statement-on-covid-19-vaccination-of-children-aged-12-to-15-years-3-september-2021 It’s not that long and is itself carefully worded to cut through the anti-vaxx crap, summarise areas of doubt and incomplete information, highlight the boundary between its remit of individual considerations and whatever the CMO’s will come out with next week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FallingAwake Posted September 5, 2021 Share Posted September 5, 2021 Another interesting question is: why are there currently only mRNA vaccines potentially available to this age-group? What about the more traditional types of vaccines? Why are they still not available for this age group? It seems there was a "warp speed" to get this mRNA technology out there, but less so with more traditional vaccine routes (which is part of the reason for my own caution as well). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arpeggio Posted September 5, 2021 Share Posted September 5, 2021 11 hours ago, anonguest said: No need to send an official to your home. In time the official will be in your home! Given the rapid take up, from those I see around me, I'm sure there'll be an Amazon Alexa or such like device in every home - and it will send you a polite reminder to take the pills. And IF you don't reply or give a verbal assurance that you have then.... I wouldn't be surprised if the next step up in these home 'help' devices will be for them to come with cameras or voice pattern recognition to detect signs of lying.....😟 If you go up one letter from each letter of HAL you get IBM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikhail Liebenstein Posted September 5, 2021 Share Posted September 5, 2021 22 minutes ago, Arpeggio said: If you go up one letter from each letter of HAL you get IBM. Indeed, though IBM isn't really what it used to be these days. There are some much better AI companies out there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arpeggio Posted September 5, 2021 Share Posted September 5, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, FallingAwake said: Another interesting question is: why are there currently only mRNA vaccines potentially available to this age-group? What about the more traditional types of vaccines? Why are they still not available for this age group? It seems there was a "warp speed" to get this mRNA technology out there, but less so with more traditional vaccine routes (which is part of the reason for my own caution as well). Good point. They would put the actual virus into the jabs that way. This should be very easy to do knowing that the virus has been isolated. Whichever strain they can put in like Alpha, Delta, Mu, Epsilon, Lambda, Chernobyl Zoster 5, Lala, Po, Doomsday, Schnitzel, Sleepy, Grumpy, Dopey, Papa Bear XylonB435-S5 and Tropanthium bi-variate Z96 etc. I can't see why they don't do this. Edited September 5, 2021 by Arpeggio Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottbeard Posted September 5, 2021 Share Posted September 5, 2021 2 hours ago, FallingAwake said: Another interesting question is: why are there currently only mRNA vaccines potentially available to this age-group? What about the more traditional types of vaccines? Why are they still not available for this age group? It seems there was a "warp speed" to get this mRNA technology out there, but less so with more traditional vaccine routes (which is part of the reason for my own caution as well). The more traditional AstraZeneca one has more side effects - most notably blood clot risk - which makes it not as appropriate to give to young people given their risk from covid is tiny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pig Posted September 5, 2021 Share Posted September 5, 2021 (edited) 3 hours ago, GeneCernan said: ^ Yes, I went to read up on this so I removed the last two paragraphs, but it appears that you had them quoted before I did so 🙂 No matter though, and thank you for your comments. They have clarified the passports thing a little more for me. No worries. But I’m not sure the paragraph left works either. You won’t be ‘let in with open arms’ if you’ve tested positive then and there even if you have a passport. Edited September 5, 2021 by pig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arpeggio Posted September 5, 2021 Share Posted September 5, 2021 1 minute ago, scottbeard said: The more traditional AstraZeneca one has more side effects - most notably blood clot risk - which makes it not as appropriate to give to young people given their risk from covid is tiny AZ is chimpanzee adeno into the nucleus of your cells. Not traditional. 4 minutes ago, Mikhail Liebenstein said: Indeed, though IBM isn't really what it used to be these days. There are some much better AI companies out there. If you go up one letter from each letter of AI you get BJ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arpeggio Posted September 5, 2021 Share Posted September 5, 2021 (edited) Virus czar calls to begin readying for eventual 4th vaccine dose "This is our life from now on, in waves" Edited September 5, 2021 by Arpeggio Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottbeard Posted September 5, 2021 Share Posted September 5, 2021 48 minutes ago, Arpeggio said: AZ is chimpanzee adeno into the nucleus of your cells. Not traditional. Depends upon your viewpoint. @FallingAwake was really just using the word "traditional" to be "non-mRNA". Injecting viruses into you is very much the traditional way that vaccines have worked. Specifically injecting a chimpanzee virus - well to be honest I have no idea whether that's been done before or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arpeggio Posted September 5, 2021 Share Posted September 5, 2021 4 minutes ago, scottbeard said: Depends upon your viewpoint. @FallingAwake was really just using the word "traditional" to be "non-mRNA". Injecting viruses into you is very much the traditional way that vaccines have worked. Specifically injecting a chimpanzee virus - well to be honest I have no idea whether that's been done before or not. Being injected with chimpanzee adenovirus is not "the virus" in the normal traditional vaccine sense. It's a method to enter the nucleus of the cells in order to deliver instructions to produce spike protein. "be a pal n gis a wee nana for me bairn wouldya" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FallingAwake Posted September 5, 2021 Share Posted September 5, 2021 40 minutes ago, Arpeggio said: Did it start drinking too? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikhail Liebenstein Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 7 hours ago, Arpeggio said: Virus czar calls to begin readying for eventual 4th vaccine dose "This is our life from now on, in waves" My be they should just put it in the water! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freki Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 I'm surprised we are not hearing yet about updates for the vaccines to deal better with the delta variant Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arpeggio Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 10 hours ago, FallingAwake said: Did it start drinking too? As you can imagine Scotland isn't the natural habitat of Chimpanzees. There aren't as many trees and / or not the same type of trees to climb. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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