Spindler Posted April 13, 2019 Share Posted April 13, 2019 40 minutes ago, The Matador said: The above must be the most difficult to read posting style ever. One long sentence with many spelling mistakes and typos and devoid of any normal punctuation or structure. I can't get past a few words before losing interest. dont read it then...wasnt planning on publishing it.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrtickle Posted April 13, 2019 Share Posted April 13, 2019 7 minutes ago, Spindler said: dont read it then...wasnt planning on publishing it.... Erm... you did, you posted it here? Unless I'm imagining both it, and the post I'm now replying to! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spindler Posted April 13, 2019 Share Posted April 13, 2019 its not for a book you know...go away...if you dont like t dont read it move on ...guess you expect gold to come staright out of the made into jewellery Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hotblack42 Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 *Cough* meanwhile, back on topic. This is close to wife & my hearts as we tried to sell a 4 bed det. a year ago & gave up & rented. We did kite fly but somewhat unintentionally - we looked at the trend in prices, & asking prices for similar places, & priced at the high end of the range, naively thinking that we would get offers 5-15% off that. After 6 months & 1 offer from a nutter we gave up & let it. Letting was easy & the net rent after fairly aggressive tax mitigation using our pension funds covers the rent & council tax on a lovely 2 dble flat with loft & garage in Aldwick (one of the non sh1tty bits of Bognor, other being Felpham) 10 mins walk from beach. The learning points for us & in general: Most people are timid or brain washed into thinking sellers won't consider sensible offers. If selling ALWAYS find out what places have actually exchanged for & how long ago. Agents don't like telling you this so tell them that's the only way you'll do business with them. LR helps but agents know whats happening *right now*. Brexit has hammered confidence. If you are not selling a classic red brick 3 bed semi in a good location its really tough & has been for over a year. There's no guarantee that a brutal cut in asking will shift a property when sentiment is poor. Most will question whether there is something wrong with it. You can't win. Plus sellers are looking to buy somewhere else & risk selling low & buying high. If anyone knows how to get a vendor to cut their price aggressively because we cut ours, I'd very be grateful to hear the details. Meanwhile we are where we want to be by letting & I would expect an awful lot who need, or want, to move to do the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spindler Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 22 minutes ago, hotblack42 said: *Cough* meanwhile, back on topic. This is close to wife & my hearts as we tried to sell a 4 bed det. a year ago & gave up & rented. We did kite fly but somewhat unintentionally - we looked at the trend in prices, & asking prices for similar places, & priced at the high end of the range, naively thinking that we would get offers 5-15% off that. After 6 months & 1 offer from a nutter we gave up & let it. Letting was easy & the net rent after fairly aggressive tax mitigation using our pension funds covers the rent & council tax on a lovely 2 dble flat with loft & garage in Aldwick (one of the non sh1tty bits of Bognor, other being Felpham) 10 mins walk from beach. The learning points for us & in general: Most people are timid or brain washed into thinking sellers won't consider sensible offers. If selling ALWAYS find out what places have actually exchanged for & how long ago. Agents don't like telling you this so tell them that's the only way you'll do business with them. LR helps but agents know whats happening *right now*. Brexit has hammered confidence. If you are not selling a classic red brick 3 bed semi in a good location its really tough & has been for over a year. There's no guarantee that a brutal cut in asking will shift a property when sentiment is poor. Most will question whether there is something wrong with it. You can't win. Plus sellers are looking to buy somewhere else & risk selling low & buying high. If anyone knows how to get a vendor to cut their price aggressively because we cut ours, I'd very be grateful to hear the details. Meanwhile we are where we want to be by letting & I would expect an awful lot who need, or want, to move to do the same. Interesting but you sound savvy...i think a lot are not, what happens when you get some chancer renting your property and stops paying for 6 months or damages the property....you have suddenly gone into a business with the pitfalls that entails...and if as Zilly says we are turning Japanese (and i really think so) this is just the start. You could get falling capital value and a possible no payer or voids.....at the end of the day you are still holding out for your fantasy kite price....perhaps the nutter you described wasn't a nutter he just offered you future value that you may look back at and wish you'd taken ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
“Nasty Piece of work” Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 (edited) 41 minutes ago, hotblack42 said: Most people are timid or brain washed into thinking sellers won't consider sensible offers. You are right. Nearly 30 years of mental coverage has encouraged the Unwashed to accept asking prices as selling prices. This has been reinforced by the acceptance of the RM index, and the Gimp and Bearded Hippo “negotiating” to Asking +. Edited April 14, 2019 by Freezer? Best place for it Awful spacing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewig Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 One offer from a nutter = that’s your market price ”most people are too timid or brainwashed to offer the right amount for my house so I’ll just rent it out” Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spindler Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 1 minute ago, Freezer? Best place for it said: You are right. Nearly 30 years of mental coverage has encouraged the Unwashed to accept asking prices as selling prices. This has been reinforced by the acceptance of the RM index, and the Gimp and Bearded Hippo “negotiating” to Asking +. well when the one offer someone has is described as a nutter...maybe there is something to this..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spindler Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 chum who is str rent and then buy outright took me along to a view viewings with him......some comments i made in earshot of the vendors....like needs a total new heating system or that flat roof needs replacing......oh gosh you could feel the venom in the air....those same people selling a used car with defects would likely be much more realistic....but with property its like they have been conditioned to think they are doing you a favour by selling you some freaking project Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spindler Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 I have had to learn the hard way...i bought a detached house and had to replace the heating system...zinc pipes(70's copper shortage) a boiler situated on the floor because it was the size of a washing machine ! "maintained by a friend" first gas repairman condemned it....the previous owner was a ********** fireman with a small kid....******** i was younger then and it was my second purchase....i learned a lot from that house.....not a bad house.....can you believe chipboard floors in a 70's build.....i see houses much more for what they are now than i did then including build and state of repair......i understand why the japanese are disgusted by and knock down houses over 40 years.....just look at the flith for hundreds of thousands of pounds alogside any railway track as you pass by...a great way to see property Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
“Nasty Piece of work” Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 (edited) A geezer in the Pub was talking about “offering” the Asking Price, it was neither bravado or boasting - just stupidity. Edited April 14, 2019 by Freezer? Best place for it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 They never offer the asking price on 'a place in the sun'...... perhaps they no longer leave their brains on the plane. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spindler Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 50 minutes ago, Freezer? Best place for it said: A geezer in the Pub was talking about “offering” the Asking Price, it was neither bravado or boasting - just stupidity. i was in the 02 shop a while back....assistant recommended a smartphone.to this guy...."nah if i wanna talk to someone i just wanna call em" revelling in stupidity because he can;t cope with technology and tries to make out he's the smart one ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simon2 Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 Most people offer, but I think it is right that there is some thinking that if someone offers too low this will be treated as some kind of insult and therefore won't be taken seriously. In reality the EA may not even disclose that a subsequent offer comes from the same person. I have seen places priced well go really quickly. There is a block of flats close to where I am which are fairly standardised, so prices should all be similar. The kite-flying price is £450k, which obviously is a joke, even for a relative new-build. This invariably gets knocked down to £400k after x months and at this price point people seem reluctant to go much lower, common next reduction is £399,999, or £395,000, lol. Currently the lowest priced one is £375,000. Only a few are selling it seems. One listed at £440k amazingly got a bite, although not possible to tell what the buyer offered. A few months ago one came on at £335,000, was SSTC inside a couple of days. Perhaps they had reason for a lower price, an investor simply wanting rid, or another personal reason. After all, it seems that the off-plan price for these was £250,000 in 2014 so there is still profit. One thing is for sure, I don't see places that are priced well relative to the market hanging around long. One of my friends is selling, and is on for £370,000 and cannot sell since last year (the price is too high, but the estate agents told him to go with that). I could bet that if they started at something like £320,000 it would go quickly but I guess the feeling is that once the agents price is put in peoples heads, a £50k price cut must seem like real money even though it never existed in the first place. For that place, I reckon the price might be chopped at least another 10%. It doesn't offer great value for money considering there are other places on for £80k less, which you could make to the same standard or better by spending £50k or so. A real good price crash is if we have lots of people trampling over themselves to get to the exit. In my friends case dropping the price by £50k could produce a quick sale because there is value relative to the competition. But if the competition saw this and cut their prices as well, we could get a situation where things spiral downward. At the moment I think this seems unlikely, most people can afford to reduce slowly and hope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushblairandbrown Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 18 hours ago, spyguy said: home.co.uk is more about optimism. Try houseprices.io for the brutal reality of transactions and sales. I use houseprices.io all the time. Nothing else is nearly as user friendly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spyguy Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 17 hours ago, PeanutButter said: Were foreign investors laying into Japanese real estate the same way they have been in London and Sydney or was it home grown? No. Foreign captial, in companies or real estate, or anything is pretty much non existent in Japan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spyguy Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 4 hours ago, hotblack42 said: If selling ALWAYS find out what places have actually exchanged for & how long ago. Agents don't like telling you this so tell them that's the only way you'll do business with them. LR helps but agents know whats happening *right now*. Get the street name, put it in houseprices.io, print out and give tio the selling EA and ask them why they think the price is correct. MMR is a big change. Massive. Now housing is being priced to what people earn - after regular outgoing, which can be fing huge thee days. Pick an area. Look at how much people 25-45 earn - and youll find 80% of people dont earn more than 30% more than the local median wage. Times it by 4. Thats how much mortgage finance is available. Thats your selling market. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spyguy Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 3 hours ago, Spindler said: I have had to learn the hard way...i bought a detached house and had to replace the heating system...zinc pipes(70's copper shortage) a boiler situated on the floor because it was the size of a washing machine ! "maintained by a friend" first gas repairman condemned it....the previous owner was a ********** fireman with a small kid....******** i was younger then and it was my second purchase....i learned a lot from that house.....not a bad house.....can you believe chipboard floors in a 70's build.....i see houses much more for what they are now than i did then including build and state of repair......i understand why the japanese are disgusted by and knock down houses over 40 years.....just look at the flith for hundreds of thousands of pounds alogside any railway track as you pass by...a great way to see property That was pretty standard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spindler Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 1 hour ago, spyguy said: Get the street name, put it in houseprices.io, print out and give tio the selling EA and ask them why they think the price is correct. MMR is a big change. Massive. Now housing is being priced to what people earn - after regular outgoing, which can be fing huge thee days. Pick an area. Look at how much people 25-45 earn - and youll find 80% of people dont earn more than 30% more than the local median wage. Times it by 4. Thats how much mortgage finance is available. Thats your selling market. "after regular outgoing, which can be fing huge thee days."Steve Keene jumped into my head on that....PRIVATE DEBT.....those outgoings are going to include servicing that private debt...credit cards...pcp plans...student debt....commuting costs...council tax..utilities.....etc...so after you've run al that through MMR....not a lot to lever the debt money with.....how does HTB even get by MMR btw....or being govt backed is it like anti matter....just passes right through ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longgone Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 It always surprises what people accept for things in offers. I bought a laptop two weeks ago on eBay 99p start and had the offers button active, so offered 35 delivery was included. Sold it the week later for 180 eBay is just free money for nothing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longgone Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 7 hours ago, Spindler said: I have had to learn the hard way...i bought a detached house and had to replace the heating system...zinc pipes(70's copper shortage) a boiler situated on the floor because it was the size of a washing machine ! "maintained by a friend" first gas repairman condemned it....the previous owner was a ********** fireman with a small kid....******** i was younger then and it was my second purchase....i learned a lot from that house.....not a bad house.....can you believe chipboard floors in a 70's build.....i see houses much more for what they are now than i did then including build and state of repair......i understand why the japanese are disgusted by and knock down houses over 40 years.....just look at the flith for hundreds of thousands of pounds alogside any railway track as you pass by...a great way to see property The 70s house I did up for my mum had that terrible warm air krap installed.cost a fortune to run and blew dust and muck around the house. Fun removing all the ducting and asbestos sheets. If copper was expensive then I see why they installed it. Although looking at the deeds the first purchaser paid 44k for the house in 1970 so was expensive then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spyguy Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 5 hours ago, Spindler said: "after regular outgoing, which can be fing huge thee days."Steve Keene jumped into my head on that....PRIVATE DEBT.....those outgoings are going to include servicing that private debt...credit cards...pcp plans...student debt....commuting costs...council tax..utilities.....etc...so after you've run al that through MMR....not a lot to lever the debt money with.....how does HTB even get by MMR btw....or being govt backed is it like anti matter....just passes right through ? Before Ms n Master FTB get to the mortgage shop, theyll have a student loan, a car loan, a few credit cards. Theres very little left to drive tge housing market. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeanutButter Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 8 hours ago, spyguy said: No. Foreign captial, in companies or real estate, or anything is pretty much non existent in Japan. Safe to conclude then that any surface parallels between their market (and crash) and ours are false. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hotblack42 Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 14 hours ago, Spindler said: well when the one offer someone has is described as a nutter...maybe there is something to this..... Its a fascinating insight into the orthodoxy on here that people are assuming 'nutter' is code for someone making an 'insulting' offer. In fact she was a bone fide nutter - made an apparently reasonable offer but didn't have the means to purchase. Apparently she was doing it repeatedly & was known to agents, just not to ours initially. We would have welcomed a low but serious offer & the opportunity to negotiate. Never happened. Our tenant is a letting agent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spindler Posted April 15, 2019 Share Posted April 15, 2019 8 hours ago, hotblack42 said: Its a fascinating insight into the orthodoxy on here that people are assuming 'nutter' is code for someone making an 'insulting' offer. In fact she was a bone fide nutter - made an apparently reasonable offer but didn't have the means to purchase. Apparently she was doing it repeatedly & was known to agents, just not to ours initially. We would have welcomed a low but serious offer & the opportunity to negotiate. Never happened. Our tenant is a letting agent. fair enough hotblack that's a nutter i agree...but that aside you didn't actually get even an offer .... hence no price discovery actually happened because your listing price was obviously too high..everything will find a price if it is marketed correctly....there is a price you are willing to accept in your head and what the market will pay..seems to me we are talking buyers with less than 60/70 %of bridge to reach you on the other side of the gorge.....so they didn't even feel like building the bridge to reach you....and this correction is just getting started....there is an element of "i'm not giving it away here" hence renting out......interesting times i feel...sorry but i've got the popcorn stocked up....the asset holders whether leveraged or not have had their way too long the shoe is rapidly moving to the other foot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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