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Saving For a Space Ship

Number of empty homes in England rises while homelessness reaches record levels

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5 minutes ago, Saving For a Space Ship said:

Number of empty homes in England rises while homelessness reaches record levels

 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/empty-homes-uk-homelessness-housing-crisis-data-a8818326.html

But but but there isn't enough supply in the UK, that's why house prices are so high!?....or so i keep getting told.

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7 minutes ago, Smiley George said:

But but but there isn't enough supply in the UK, that's why house prices are so high!?....or so i keep getting told.

Quite but the UK has always had a large number of empty properties and one estimate a few years ago was around 500,000+.  That's before we look at the scandal of second (or more) homes.  Our society is so caring that we can be fine with homeless people living on the street and yet its still OK for people to own more than one house.

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14 minutes ago, Smiley George said:

But but but there isn't enough supply in the UK, that's why house prices are so high!?....or so i keep getting told.

....there are plenty of empty properties, with electric wiring and plumbing....ready to go. Much of it is treated like a bar of gold held in storage, as if there will always be a demand for it and it has scarcity value.;)

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Although it's tempting to link the two they are (at least to a fair degree) two separate issues. The homeless are those people who have slipped through the cracks in society, however expensive houses are or how many empty ones. A lack of housing (or at least a lack of housing they can access) isn't really the cause. The people who are getting p1ssed on by the empty housing and second homes are those who are still part of the system, probably still working, and renting expensive poky and probably over-crowded accommodation. Freeing up unused housing will help them but won't make much difference to the homeless - that's a different problem with a different cause and hence needs a different solution, although you could make an argument that both stem from the nature of our current society.

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9 minutes ago, Riedquat said:

Although it's tempting to link the two they are (at least to a fair degree) two separate issues. The homeless are those people who have slipped through the cracks in society, however expensive houses are or how many empty ones. A lack of housing (or at least a lack of housing they can access) isn't really the cause. The people who are getting p1ssed on by the empty housing and second homes are those who are still part of the system, probably still working, and renting expensive poky and probably over-crowded accommodation. Freeing up unused housing will help them but won't make much difference to the homeless - that's a different problem with a different cause and hence needs a different solution, although you could make an argument that both stem from the nature of our current society.

There are unprecedented numbers of 21-35 year olds still living at home with their parents. A vast population of prospective or 'hidden' households displaced from the housing market semi-permanently by immigration, affordability and geography.

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1 hour ago, Big Orange said:

Disgusting. I notice more and more homeless tents in parks and even roundabout shrub areas in UK cities.

Agreed

 

I guess the homeless don't vote

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1 hour ago, Smiley George said:

But but but there isn't enough supply in the UK, that's why house prices are so high!?....or so i keep getting told.

Empty homes are not supply.  Tight supply and competitive bidding have driven high prices in parallel with the flood of credit.

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40 minutes ago, zugzwang said:

There are unprecedented numbers of 21-35 year olds still living at home with their parents. A vast population of prospective or 'hidden' households displaced from the housing market semi-permanently by immigration, affordability and geography.

Definitely an issue, conceptually I'd include that in the overcrowding part although how much it contributes towards overcrowding is questionable - at least it means the parents' house isn't full of empty rooms, even if it might be better used now by a young family. It's a bit of an arbitrary line I admit but I think I'd draw it somewhere between still living in a room at your parents and sleeping on a friend's sofa. That doesn't mean not getting out of the family house isn't an issue too.

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Good investment proposition for you...hoard food...prices increase...more investment demand and hoarding...prices increase...repeat.

Good idea for pension pot - can't go wrong with grain.

The banks might even lend into this savvy investment...fuelling higher prices.

The Express can run articles - Grain Prices to Soar....Has your hoard of grain earned more than you??? 

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5 hours ago, Saving For a Space Ship said:

Number of empty homes in England rises while homelessness reaches record levels

 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/empty-homes-uk-homelessness-housing-crisis-data-a8818326.html

Not if you read the article properly. 

“In October 2012, the overall number of vacant dwellings stood at 254,059. This figure fell consistently each year until October 2018, when it hit 216,186.”

This represents 0.8% of dwellings. Given landlord voids, house awaiting sale etc., I’ll let you decide it’s relevant... or click bait. 

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7 hours ago, Si1 said:

Agreed

 

I guess the homeless don't vote

A lot homeless people are arkward oddballs with mental health and drink/drug problems, but something has still gone badly wrong with the UK social and economic infrastructure for homelessness to become almost as widespread and visible as in the US.

Edited by Big Orange

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2 hours ago, Big Orange said:

A lot homeless people are arkward oddballs with mental health and drink/drug problems, but something has still gone badly wrong with the UK social and economic infrastructure for homelessness to become almost as widespread and visible as in the US.

Buying votes by making housing as expensive as possible is bound to have consequences, wouldn't you think? Trying to jack up the population to provide more customers for business interests and without regard to available infrastructure likewise.

Nothing has gone wrong, it has been deliberately made wrong in order to favour the already wealthy and powerful.

We now reached a situation whereby the "policy" isn't even producing the "desired" results and yet we are still stuck with its deleterious consequences.

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Just now, Big Orange said:

A lot homeless people are arkward oddballs with mental health and drink/drug problems, but something has still gone badly wrong with the UK social and economic infrastructure for homelessness to become almost as widespread and visible as in the US.

Sad state of affairs.......it has something to do with how we judge the value of a person, what they are worth to the wider community.......not productive enough, create wealth for themselves and/or for others, live a 'certain lifestyle'.....they are dismissed as a drain, a problem, a nuisance.....there is no one right way of living...everyone is unique, an individual with their own story to tell....down to those that can to help those that can't.;)

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“How much is xxxxx WORTH?” Has been deep state programmed into the plebs since birth. Where WORTH for 99% of the plebs is how much rightmove says their home is worth.

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21 hours ago, zugzwang said:

There are unprecedented numbers of 21-35 year olds still living at home with their parents. A vast population of prospective or 'hidden' households displaced from the housing market semi-permanently by immigration, affordability and geography.

Not just 35 year olds I know people in their 40s who just missed the boat.

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17 hours ago, LondonBound said:

Not if you read the article properly. 

“In October 2012, the overall number of vacant dwellings stood at 254,059. This figure fell consistently each year until October 2018, when it hit 216,186.”

This represents 0.8% of dwellings. Given landlord voids, house awaiting sale etc., I’ll let you decide it’s relevant... or click bait. 

That's still a significant chunk of housing, enough for a fairly large city.

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On 12/03/2019 at 11:47, Riedquat said:

Although it's tempting to link the two they are (at least to a fair degree) two separate issues. The homeless are those people who have slipped through the cracks in society, however expensive houses are or how many empty ones. A lack of housing (or at least a lack of housing they can access) isn't really the cause. The people who are getting p1ssed on by the empty housing and second homes are those who are still part of the system, probably still working, and renting expensive poky and probably over-crowded accommodation. Freeing up unused housing will help them but won't make much difference to the homeless - that's a different problem with a different cause and hence needs a different solution, although you could make an argument that both stem from the nature of our current society.

I agree, I think it’s important to distinguish rough sleeping from the general housing crisis. 

Greedy landlords are a big factor in both, but the causes of rough sleeping is far more complex than that. 

(Yeah I hate the term rough sleeping as well, but I can’t think of a better way of putting this). 

Edited by BorrowToLeech

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23 hours ago, Wayward said:

Good investment proposition for you...hoard food...prices increase...more investment demand and hoarding...prices increase...repeat.

Good idea for pension pot - can't go wrong with grain.

The banks might even lend into this savvy investment...fuelling higher prices.

The Express can run articles - Grain Prices to Soar....Has your hoard of grain earned more than you??? 

The market can provide additional food in response to increasing demand. It can’t provide additional land. 

What you have described is exactly the business model of landlords. 

Empty housing would be clear evidence that there is not a housing shortage, and that incentives to hoard land are the cause of the crisis.

An absence of empty houses does not prove the converse of course, because most hoarded houses will be landlorded out. 

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36 minutes ago, BorrowToLeech said:

The market can provide additional food in response to increasing demand. It can’t provide additional land. 

What you have described is exactly the business model of landlords. 

Empty housing would be clear evidence that there is not a housing shortage, and that incentives to hoard land are the cause of the crisis.

An absence of empty houses does not prove the converse of course, because most hoarded houses will be landlorded out. 

Yes it can.  There is plenty of land.  The shortage is of land with planning for housing.  This is a political construct.  The tap can be turned on or off as our leaders choose.

I think there is some confusion here about empty housing and supply.  If houses are sat empty they are not supply.  It is restricted supply that creates competitive bidding and inflation fuelled by loose credit

Yes most hoarding is housing let out.  It is occupational demand that drives this...few would be landlords would take the plunge and buy to let if there was nobody to rent it to.  It is scarcity that drives BTL as proxy buyers for occupational demand.

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10 minutes ago, Wayward said:

Yes it can.  There is plenty of land.  The shortage is of land with planning for housing.  This is a political construct.  The tap can be turned on or off as our leaders choose.

Sure, but it's a very unappealing prospect indeed to build even more. Looking to the long term a solution is absolutely required that doesn't create an ever decreasing quality of life for all; the current level of development in the UK, England in particular, is pretty unpleasant.

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I see all the interest only miss selling adverts appearing on the TV now.. 

so it will be a massive BTL/stupid O/O bailout.. 

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On 13/03/2019 at 12:06, BorrowToLeech said:

The market can provide additional food in response to increasing demand. It can’t provide additional land.

But food comes from the land.

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  • 298 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
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