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jiltedjen

Smart meters - HPC hive mind

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HPC Hive mind! 

What do we all think of smart meters?

why is the government pushing them?

are they positive/negative?

is it just so they can chance peak time pricing? 

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13 minutes ago, jiltedjen said:

why is the government pushing them?

 

Same reason they do anything; control.

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There's a long thread somewhere, might be a few years back.

I don't want one,  I refused one under Scottish power but they still mithered me with phone calls and emails every month trying to sign me up.

I think you are right,  they could bring in pricing based on the data they collect.

I don't want a mobile phone signal transmitting stuff 24/7,  bad enough with existing phones and Wifi etc.

Also don't want hassle/mess of having meters changed. 

Don't need one, I know what I use and how efficient/inefficient my home is. 

Look up what happened in the US when they tried to force smart meters on people.

I have recently switched to a small supplier (Octopus), extremely competitive, and guess what - they don't even support smart meters, hooray!

 

 

 

Edited by Andy T
typo

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1 minute ago, Andy T said:

 

Don't need one, I know what I use and how efficient/inefficient my home is. 

 

 

That argument always annoyed me.  Are you going to not boil the kettle, cook dinner, or wash clothes, because (SHOCKER) the meter says it uses electricity to do so?

They must think we use it just out of spite :lol:

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6 minutes ago, chronyx said:

That argument always annoyed me.  Are you going to not boil the kettle, cook dinner, or wash clothes, because (SHOCKER) the meter says it uses electricity to do so?

They must think we use it just out of spite :lol:

Aye I've never tried dipping a teabag in cold water but i'm guessing it's not great.

A few people I know where 'wowed' by the whizzy lights and displays on their smart meter when it was telling them stuff they weren't 'smart' enough to know :lol:

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They'll be useful when mass market washing machines and dishwashers can negotiate with the electricity market to run a wash at the cheapest spot price possible during some point in the day or night. That's smart. Not sure about the current generation though.

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To be fair i have one and it's made my life much easier in that sense. I was stuck with a pay as you go meter when I moved in and I'm several floors away from the meter room. I had a smart meter put in and can do all my topping up and checking on my phone and dont have to go to the meter ever now which was quite an inconvenience. Estimated bills can cause nightmares so when they work it's brilliant

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We finally had them fitted this week after waiting for ages.

Great for us as we're away a lot and it means no more, totally wrong, estimated bills when we're not home to send a meter reading and are using no, or very little, energy.

I can't see a downside, communications are not through my broadband so no security issues.

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Can't see a downside?!

It opens the door for them to charge higher rates at peak times.

Only the rich will be able to use electricity whenever they want.

It's a massive invasion of privacy to gather an onerous amount of data which can be used to as part of a data warehouse to extrapolate my daily habits, when I'm in, when I'm out, what times I come and go, etc.

Also - they measure a different thing to normal meters, so you could be charged more:

 

The worst thing of all is that you can't switch suppliers. The new generation which allow switching are only in early trials. The companies are furiously fitting OLD gen1 smart meters which cannot switch suppliers properly EVEN TODAY because they are only in early trials of the gen2 ones. It's a MASSIVE waste of money, they'll all have to be ripped out.

For more on that subject, check of BBC Moneybox on Radio 4 - large back catalogue of podcasts and transcripts to get you started.

 

Edited by mrtickle

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42 minutes ago, Andy T said:

There's a long thread somewhere, might be a few years back.

I don't want one,  I refused one under Scottish power but they still mithered me with phone calls and emails every month trying to sign me up.

I think you are right,  they could bring in pricing based on the data they collect.

I don't want a mobile phone signal transmitting stuff 24/7,  bad enough with existing phones and Wifi etc.

Also don't want hassle/mess of having meters changed. 

 

Why did you give them your phone number?! NEVER EVER do that!

They don't need it. They can email you. If you don't give them your number, they can't bug you.

Agree with what you say, and these people expect me to take a day off work because they only fit Mon-Fri 9-5? It's them that wants to fit it - they can bloody well come over on a Sunday afternoon (if I agreed to it which I don't!).

 

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I don't really mind my energy supplier collecting information that I send them anyway.

You'd have to go a long way to find someone more privacy conscious than me, but there's nothing here that concerns me.

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17 minutes ago, kirstieb said:

To be fair i have one and it's made my life much easier in that sense. I was stuck with a pay as you go meter when I moved in and I'm several floors away from the meter room. I had a smart meter put in and can do all my topping up and checking on my phone and dont have to go to the meter ever now which was quite an inconvenience. Estimated bills can cause nightmares so when they work it's brilliant

Those are not the only two choices. You could have had a normal meter put in to replay the PAYG nightmare.

I submit readings monthly (only because I'm a geek and like the stats). Nothing is estimated. No big surprises, and zero need for anything smarter.

 

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19 minutes ago, kirstieb said:

To be fair i have one and it's made my life much easier in that sense. I was stuck with a pay as you go meter when I moved in and I'm several floors away from the meter room. I had a smart meter put in and can do all my topping up and checking on my phone and dont have to go to the meter ever now which was quite an inconvenience. Estimated bills can cause nightmares so when they work it's brilliant

The only people I would say would benefit would be those on a key/card meter.......for everyone else best avoided unless you particularly dislike reading your meter.......so many negatives to having one, anyway doing the meter reader out of a job.😉

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2 minutes ago, mrtickle said:

Those are not the only two choices. You could have had a normal meter put in to replay the PAYG nightmare.

I submit readings monthly (only because I'm a geek and like the stats). Nothing is estimated. No big surprises, and zero need for anything smarter.

 

I like the stats too so I've selected the daily "phone home" option, which I can change online if I wish. And I don't need to drive 1,000 miles to read the meters or accept an inaccurate estimate.

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7 minutes ago, Bruce Banner said:

I don't really mind my energy supplier collecting information that I send them anyway.

You'd have to go a long way to find someone more privacy conscious than me, but there's nothing here that concerns me.

Fair enough, but please watch the two videos I posted to inform yourself about how you could be overcharged.

 

 

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18 minutes ago, mrtickle said:

Fair enough, but please watch the two videos I posted to inform yourself about how you could be overcharged.

 

 

I couldn't see anything untoward there. My electricity meter measures in watts not VA so there should be no power factor issues.

The first thing I did when installed was to check the displayed usage against the nameplate rating of my appliances and they agreed. The meter is rated at 100A and is protected by my original 60A fuse so I should be able to draw 13.80KW, which is way more than I need.

As for not being able to change supplier, I can do that at any time but the meters may lose their smart capability if not compatible with a new supplier so it may be back to manual readings until the communication is sorted out.

If at any time I want the meters to stop communicating, they will stop communicating, but I can't see that being likely.

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https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/11/23/smart_meters_are_dog_toffee_says_nao/

Quote

The NAO [National Audit Office] calculated that savings to consumers will be a paltry £18 per year. Ten years ago, when the Cabinet Office was pondering whether to commit the country to the £11bn project, that per-household benefit was supposed to be £23 by 2020 – with estimates from the time reckoning that smart meters would cost around £390 per household, averaged across the country. That cost has now fallen slightly to £374.

We all paid for it whether we have one or not.  And that would be over 20 year payback.

Some are already obsolete, how long will the new ones last?

Waste of money.

I suppose there is occasional household who will benefit from a device indicating that heating house with electricity vs gas is expensive but I am not even sure if meters help with that.

Personally, I see them as pointless and I will resist one while it makes no difference in tariffs. 

I don't like they idea of them but can see how if it they were bundled with a cheaper tariff, I'd probably just get one.

Same as with mobile phones.  Hate the idea of Google but have the phone as it has one of the best cameras

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1 minute ago, Bear Hug said:

https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/11/23/smart_meters_are_dog_toffee_says_nao/

We all paid for it whether we have one or not.  And that would be over 20 year payback.

Some are already obsolete, how long will the new ones last?

 

As I explained before - they were obsolete the day they were fitted.

They didn't become obsolete because of some "breakthrough" with newer, better smart meters. They were obsolete because they are not Fit For Purpose (except with ONE supplier and if you NEVER switch); this is obviously ludicrous.

The scandal is that these so-called "First Gen" were allowed to be fitted at all, AND ARE STILL BEING FITTED TODAY.

 

 

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Quote

Meanwhile, irate MPs are determined to be seen to be taking back control of the fiasco. Rachel Reeves MP, chairwoman of Parliament's Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy committee, vowed to drag civil servants into a public Q&A.

“As a Committee, we will be keen to examine in our evidence hearing in the New Year whether it is feasible, desirable and cost-effective to continue to plough ahead with the Government’s 2020 target," said Reeves in a statement.

The hearing will take place on Wednesday 9th January.

Ooo! That was yesterday. There should be footage of it somewhere on the Parliament website...

 

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1 minute ago, mrtickle said:

As I explained before - they were obsolete the day they were fitted.

They didn't become obsolete because of some "breakthrough" with newer, better smart meters. They were obsolete because they are not Fit For Purpose (except with ONE supplier and if you NEVER switch); this is obviously ludicrous.

The scandal is that these so-called "First Gen" were allowed to be fitted at all, AND ARE STILL BEING FITTED TODAY.

 

 

SMETS 1 communicates with supplier direct.

SMETS 2 communicates with DDC and suppliers get info from DDC.

SMETS 1 should be able to communicate with DDC in a couple of years. 

 

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2 minutes ago, mrtickle said:

If I had a SMETS1 that's still a scandal and I'd want rid of it. 

 

I had SMETS 1 fitted this week. SMETS 2 is not available from my supplier yet and since I have a fixed price contract, at a very favourable rate, for the next 2 years I'm not likely to want to change and by that time compatibility should be sorted. If not, new supplier will need to change the communication device located adjacent to the electricity meter.

Rest assured, I would have not have gone ahead without first doing my homework. 

 

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4 minutes ago, mrtickle said:

As long as you're happy, it's your choice of course.

 

Very happy, so far, fingers crossed they keep working.

Smart meters are a real advantage in my situation, probably not so much for most people.

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