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Germany proposes replacing the French security council seat with a EU seat.

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Being reported by RT but not yet seen it elsewhere.

The start of the EU falling apart?

Nothing to do with the UK leaving the EU, no not at all .... :)

Obviously not a story that meets the propoganda needs of the brewhiner media. The UK up there as equals with the EU. LOL.

The unintended consequences start maybe and to take this on topic it'll get economic very quick if it does start.

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5 hours ago, ebull said:

Being reported by RT but not yet seen it elsewhere.

The start of the EU falling apart?

Nothing to do with the UK leaving the EU, no not at all .... :)

Obviously not a story that meets the propoganda needs of the brewhiner media. The UK up there as equals with the EU. LOL.

The unintended consequences start maybe and to take this on topic it'll get economic very quick if it does start.

That just shows the current srength of the EU-27. Countries are confortable asking other nations to give up their representation in pro of the EU. If France accepts, it will show even more cohesion. I assume they have already talked about it in such a way that it’s a done deal.

 The UK obviously thinks this is horrible, but this is just because we are, on average, a really eurosceptic nation.

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27 minutes ago, Burbujista said:

If France accepts

Which of course they won't. And the point of this thread is...?

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54 minutes ago, Burbujista said:

That just shows the current srength of the EU-27. Countries are confortable asking other nations to give up their representation in pro of the EU. If France accepts, it will show even more cohesion. I assume they have already talked about it in such a way that it’s a done deal.

 The UK obviously thinks this is horrible, but this is just because we are, on average, a really eurosceptic nation.

France responded straight away that the legal framework of the UN does not allow that to happen. So begins discord between the two countries that need to be united to keep the EU strong. It exposes the largest weakness, not strength.

The point is that whilst the UK media is only interested in our 'deal', Brexit will also have a huge effect on the EU which still has a huge Euro-crisis, bank-crisis etc etc to deal with.

Has anyone mapped DB derivatives liabilities yet?

What happens over there will certainly have an effect over here.

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3 hours ago, ebull said:

France responded straight away that the legal framework of the UN does not allow that to happen.

 

Easily solved, just update the EU constitution so that it does fit whatever the UN rules say.

It sounds like they're deliberately creating a problem that "ever closer union" can easily solve.  Call the EU a country, problem solved.

We were the main obstacle in the way of ever closer german dominance.  Without us, the brakes are off.

Edited by Tes Tickle

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4 hours ago, ebull said:

France responded straight away that the legal framework of the UN does not allow that to happen. So begins discord between the two countries that need to be united to keep the EU strong. It exposes the largest weakness, not strength.

The point is that whilst the UK media is only interested in our 'deal', Brexit will also have a huge effect on the EU which still has a huge Euro-crisis, bank-crisis etc etc to deal with.

Has anyone mapped DB derivatives liabilities yet?

What happens over there will certainly have an effect over here.

UK mainstream media seems to think that the EU is a bastion of financial success and good governance and leaving it will be suicide for the UK. Very few members of the public would be aware of the growing crisis in Italy, the unrest in France or the Eastern states rebelling against the crazy immigration policies of the EU.

 

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5 minutes ago, Sour Mash said:

UK mainstream media seems to think that the EU is a bastion of financial success and good governance and leaving it will be suicide for the UK. Very few members of the public would be aware of the growing crisis in Italy, the unrest in France or the Eastern states rebelling against the crazy immigration policies of the EU.

 

Maybe the Eastern states should try implementing some pro-worker policies to make their labour force want to stay rather than trying to trap them with restrictive migration policies elsewhere in the EU. It's good that Eastern European policymakers are feeling under pressure from the brain drain, gives them a reason to do something about it with carrot policies at home.

I don't understand why people who supposedly believe in personal freedom want to trap humanity in 200 cages guarded by men with guns and where you're not allowed to choose which cage you live in.

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That's the part of the argument relating to Brexit I've never understood - the fact so many in the EU see us as a pariah state post Brexit yet at the same time we've never seen so many people from all over the world risking life and limb to come here rather than settle in the EU.

Surely if the EU was all milk and honey why are there not more settling on the continent?

Edited by burk

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6 minutes ago, burk said:

Surely if the EU was all milk and honey why are there not more settling on the continent?

They are. The UK has about the same proportion of foreign-born inhabitants as similar Western European countries like France, Germany, Belgium, the Netherlands, Sweden etc.

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Germany is very good at poncing of other countries for their defense. Trump is right. Germany's military budget is only 1.2% of GDP even though they agreed to pay 2% as members of NATO. Putin could roll them over in a week.

Germany has never built nuclear weapons, they rely on the US, France and Britain to develop and maintain them instead.

Britain should leave NATO as well as the EU. We should replace trident with a more up to date strategic nuclear weapon, and at the same time develop tactical nukes to keep the Spanish out of Gibraltar and the Argentinians out of the Falklands. We have enough threats to deal with without looking after the Europeans.

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Germany was forced to spend next to nothing on its military for a long time as a result of that little incident 70-odd years ago that they don't like to mention when they sprayed all their neighbours with machine guns, bombs and poison gas.

Perhaps they're an interesting case study in how, by not spending money on stuff to blow people up, instead they created something of an economic and life-quality miracle within their own country.  I wish we could stop sticking our nose into far flung corners of the world and do something similar.

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Never understood why France got the fifth seat anyway - they were no more deserving than any other nation conquered by the Germans. China, UK, Russia and the USA were the winning powers - France was liberated by the UK/USA and the empire forces.

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36 minutes ago, MARTINX9 said:

Never understood why France got the fifth seat anyway - they were no more deserving than any other nation conquered by the Germans. China, UK, Russia and the USA were the winning powers - France was liberated by the UK/USA and the empire forces.

The permanent seats were awarded to nuclear powers (that was before North Korea, India and Pakland got the bomb). The obvious conclusion is that if Corbyn abolishes Trident, we will lose our seat on the security council.

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19 minutes ago, onlooker said:

The permanent seats were awarded to nuclear powers (that was before North Korea, India and Pakland got the bomb). The obvious conclusion is that if Corbyn abolishes Trident, we will lose our seat on the security council.

UN was established well before anyone had the bomb apart from the US. France got one because it had been a major military and colonial power up until WW2. I think it got a seat more for historical reasons. Also, it was still one of the largest economic powers who hadn't been in the losing side in the war. 

I doubt it occurred to anyone that they wouldn't get a permanent seat. 

Edited by Ah-so

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Haha

Lets see what a good European Macron is shall we.

What exactly are the EU going to do on the security council anyway apart from endless arguing and vetoing. To provide security you need security forces...good ones...like the French has got.

(deliberate phrasing since it sticks in my throat at the moment)

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On 30/11/2018 at 13:41, Sour Mash said:

UK mainstream media seems to think that the EU is a bastion of financial success and good governance and leaving it will be suicide for the UK. Very few members of the public would be aware of the growing crisis in Italy, the unrest in France or the Eastern states rebelling against the crazy immigration policies of the EU.

 

It's falling apart because they're all trying to stay within EU budget rules while the ECB desperately prints to support bank balance sheets.

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21 hours ago, onlooker said:

The permanent seats were awarded to nuclear powers (that was before North Korea, India and Pakland got the bomb). The obvious conclusion is that if Corbyn abolishes Trident, we will lose our seat on the security council.

The five permanent members were selected in 1945 - only one then had the atomic bomb (the USA). They were seen as the victorious powers.

As long as course as it suits the US the UK will never lose its permanent seat as we are its only reliable ally.

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5 hours ago, MARTINX9 said:

 

it suits the US the UK will never lose its permanent seat as we are its only reliable ally.

You mean we do as we are told.

 

Screen Shot 2018-12-02 at 20.22.43.png

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On 30/11/2018 at 13:52, Dorkins said:

Maybe the Eastern states should try implementing some pro-worker policies to make their labour force want to stay rather than trying to trap them with restrictive migration policies elsewhere in the EU. It's good that Eastern European policymakers are feeling under pressure from the brain drain, gives them a reason to do something about it with carrot policies at home.

I don't understand why people who supposedly believe in personal freedom want to trap humanity in 200 cages guarded by men with guns and where you're not allowed to choose which cage you live in.

Eastern Europe has massive increases in wealth thanks to our generous system.. rubbish wages and benefits here are worth a fortune in the eastern block countries.. literally we are exporting money to build other countries whilst ours crumbles.. 

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/544816/Roma-Gypsy-Migrant-Boasts-Free-Money-Benefits-System-Mansion

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On ‎30‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 15:04, Uncle_Kenny said:

Germany is very good at poncing of other countries for their defense. Trump is right. Germany's military budget is only 1.2% of GDP even though they agreed to pay 2% as members of NATO. Putin could roll them over in a week.

Germany has never built nuclear weapons, they rely on the US, France and Britain to develop and maintain them instead.

Britain should leave NATO as well as the EU. We should replace trident with a more up to date strategic nuclear weapon, and at the same time develop tactical nukes to keep the Spanish out of Gibraltar and the Argentinians out of the Falklands. We have enough threats to deal with without looking after the Europeans.

The US stole German miitary tech after the war on an industrial scale: rockets; guided missiles, modern subs (see type 23 U boot), axial jet engines (JUMO), swept wing (ME262); stealth (Horner) etc etc etc

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23 minutes ago, Gribble said:

The US stole German miitary tech after the war on an industrial scale: rockets; guided missiles, modern subs (see type 23 U boot), axial jet engines (JUMO), swept wing (ME262); stealth (Horner) etc etc etc

They were doing useful cutting edge research into poison gases as well.

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On 01/12/2018 at 20:30, dom said:

It's falling apart because they're all trying to stay within EU budget rules while the ECB desperately prints to support bank balance sheets.

I think the base issue is that the EU is trying to impose its will on the member states.   It's not like the states are actually willingly trying to stick to budget rules, they are being told to (or at least, certain ones are - the Germans and French seem to get a free pass).  So you have a situation where essentially unelected bureaucrats in Brussels are dictating policy to elected national governments.

The Euro makes this possible - once you give up the right to issue your own sovereign currency you are at the behest of whoever controls the money supply.  If you don't do what the EU tells you, you find that the ECB no longer wants to backstop your bonds.  Not that I am advocating central banks buying government bonds but it's an option that states need to have.

Also of course, the EU are trying to impose a more lax policy towards inward immigration than many states want and are also trying to force member states to share out the existing massive base of economic migrants (after Merkel practically opened the floodgates to massive migration) amongst themselves.

 

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The Euro was IMO only ever intended to force its members to become one country.  The concept of any country using someone else's currency is nonsense, presumably those in charge knew this so intended to create a problem that unifying into one country could later solve.

It would be very difficult for the olive oil countries to remove themselves from the euro now too - they'd be at risk of ending up with high inflation due to their debt and/or just not being able to borrow money.  They're all German now, it's only a matter of time really.

We can just be grateful that some of our politicians actually had the balls to resist heading into this when we were being pressured into it.  Really, that was the point where we became the outsider so set us on the path to where we've ended up.

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47 minutes ago, Tes Tickle said:

The Euro was IMO only ever intended to force its members to become one country.  The concept of any country using someone else's currency is nonsense, presumably those in charge knew this so intended to create a problem that unifying into one country could later solve.

It would be very difficult for the olive oil countries to remove themselves from the euro now too - they'd be at risk of ending up with high inflation due to their debt and/or just not being able to borrow money.  They're all German now, it's only a matter of time really.

Population of FR+ES+PT+IT+GR = 189 million

Population of DE = 83 million, and falling (expected to be around 73 million by 2050, smaller than both the UK and France)

After 300 years of monetary union Scottish people are still not English.

Anyway sorry for bringing facts into it, feel free to go back to your Hun invasion paranoia.

Edited by Dorkins

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  • 152 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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