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More than 200 UK shopping centres 'in crisis'

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Local governments spent £4bn on land and buildings in 2018, most of it on commercial property:

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/748292/Local_Authority_Capital_Expenditure_and_Receipts__England_2017-18_Final_Outturn.pdf

It's considered an investment craze. The cheap debt is provided by central government in light of funding cuts, although obviously it will be added to debt at the point of default. The money is spent on defined benefit pensions.

Tangentially related, the higher crime rates in London are caused by police forces choosing to cut staff rather than forego defined benefit pensions.

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19 minutes ago, darkmarket said:

Tangentially related, the higher crime rates in London are caused by police forces choosing to cut staff rather than forego defined benefit pensions.

Would you forgo your own pension? Why do you not make a contribution? 

I am not in the police force but I do not envy them dealing with the scum they have to deal with every day.  Most of those who whine about the police sit in an office and sit in front of a PC every day. 

Police numbers have been cut dramatically.  Stop and search has been stopped.  They are afraid to stop anyone who is not white for fear of being accused of racism. 

Why is anyone in anyway suprised that shopping centes are struggling.  I cannot remember the last time I or anyone I know went to a retail area to trawl around shops and buy stuff.  I and most people use the internet.

High streets can be developed for housing that is what will happen in the ling term. 

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32 minutes ago, happyguy said:

Would you forgo your own pension? Why do you not make a contribution? 

I am not in the police force but I do not envy them dealing with the scum they have to deal with every day.  Most of those who whine about the police sit in an office and sit in front of a PC every day. 

Police numbers have been cut dramatically.  Stop and search has been stopped.  They are afraid to stop anyone who is not white for fear of being accused of racism. 

Why is anyone in anyway suprised that shopping centes are struggling.  I cannot remember the last time I or anyone I know went to a retail area to trawl around shops and buy stuff.  I and most people use the internet.

High streets can be developed for housing that is what will happen in the ling term. 

I'm not depending on the government for a pension and I'm not in favour of things like housing bubbles and stock market bubbles to delay the inevitable reality.

The point is not that shopping centres are obviously in crisis, it's that local government is taking an insane leveraged bet on them.

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They would make nice municipal buildings, such as law courts, council buildings, library, debt counselling centers. One day you will tell your grand kids, "when I were young, all this were shops..."

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They should make them into Vegas style casinos.

Or indoor villages where all the shops are turned into apartments.

Or very large bingo halls.

Or preserve them so future generations can see how stupid we were.

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12 hours ago, darkmarket said:

Local governments spent £4bn on land and buildings in 2018, most of it on commercial property:

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/748292/Local_Authority_Capital_Expenditure_and_Receipts__England_2017-18_Final_Outturn.pdf

It's considered an investment craze.

Pretty sure that has been going on for a few years now. There have been threads here before I remember. Nobody is really talking about it though so that could actually be a thing that really does hit. Its going to be something people do not see coming after all.

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13 hours ago, darkmarket said:

Local governments spent £4bn on land and buildings in 2018, most of it on commercial property:

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/748292/Local_Authority_Capital_Expenditure_and_Receipts__England_2017-18_Final_Outturn.pdf

It's considered an investment craze. The cheap debt is provided by central government in light of funding cuts, although obviously it will be added to debt at the point of default. The money is spent on defined benefit pensions.

Tangentially related, the higher crime rates in London are caused by police forces choosing to cut staff rather than forego defined benefit pensions.

This is a real issue, and the tax payer will foot the bill when these reckless investments go up in smoke. Heads should roll, but unfortunately unlike the poll tax riots in the past, the MSM will most likely have a media blackout to placate the masses. 

In this example in the area I grew up in, £53m for this retail park is ridiculous. Due to the location and having to drive there, the last time it was popular was in 1990 when it was an indoor water park. Then when that closed down the main attraction was a nightclub in the heydays of the late 90’s that put on a free bus to get punters in.

https://insidecroydon.com/2018/11/01/council-pays-53m-to-buy-unloved-colonnades-centre/

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1 hour ago, sideysid said:

This is a real issue, and the tax payer will foot the bill when these reckless investments go up in smoke. Heads should roll, but unfortunately unlike the poll tax riots in the past, the MSM will most likely have a media blackout to placate the masses. 

In this example in the area I grew up in, £53m for this retail park is ridiculous. Due to the location and having to drive there, the last time it was popular was in 1990 when it was an indoor water park. Then when that closed down the main attraction was a nightclub in the heydays of the late 90’s that put on a free bus to get punters in.

https://insidecroydon.com/2018/11/01/council-pays-53m-to-buy-unloved-colonnades-centre/

So do you have any interesting stories about the place when it was a disco

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14 hours ago, happyguy said:

Would you forgo your own pension? Why do you not make a contribution? 

I am not in the police force but I do not envy them dealing with the scum they have to deal with every day.  Most of those who whine about the police sit in an office and sit in front of a PC every day. 

The situation is amusing in a way, in how twisted it is, like an episode of The Twilight Zone.

 

The government steals money from productive people, who generally don't have time or the will to commit crime

This causes them to produce and breed less, so you have less work done and fewer people willing to do it

The government then hands this stolen wealth to unproductive people (which includes wealthy business owners- corporate welfare), who are much more wont to commit crime and have the time available to do it, which causes them to breed more and causes formerly-productive people to fall into this class

Falling productivity means less tax revenue to fund police, while criminality increases.

 

If the government would just ****** off, this problem would solve itself.

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1 hour ago, prozac said:

So do you have any interesting stories about the place when it was a disco

Croydon girls were pretty much renowned for many an interesting story. The club itself was a pain in the **** to get home from, so we didn’t go too often. The ‘booze bus’ they put on to take you there was more fun. I remember once a group of girls were sitting at the back and all going commando in short skirts to avoid VPL. We obviously got talking to those pretty sharpish after them giving us a flash or two. Alas those days are long gone for the younger generation.

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Consumer capitalism is a thing of the past..........a later half of the 20th century blip.  It's just that most people haven't noticed yet.

Working in non jobs as a wage slaves to buy things you don't need is a useless way to live a life and a total waste of the planets resources.

Many are waking up to this fact.  Debenhams will go bust next, then Next, then M&S and so on.  Who will be the last to switch the lights out.  Probably Primark.

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15 hours ago, darkmarket said:

I'm not depending on the government for a pension and I'm not in favour of things like housing bubbles and stock market bubbles to delay the inevitable reality.

The point is not that shopping centres are obviously in crisis, it's that local government is taking an insane leveraged bet on them.

You may not be in favour of housing bubbles or stock market bubbles but that is capitalism - 

You seem to think the police have great benefits that you are envious of.  If it is such an attractive proposition join then you can enjoy the same benefits. 

 

3 hours ago, AdamoMucci said:

Or indoor villages where all the shops are turned into apartments.

Shopping centres in high streets will be turned into housing - who shops in a high street now when it is all on line 

15 hours ago, NoGo said:

One day you will tell your grand kids, "when I were young, all this were shops..."

Same as now we can say those red things were phone boxes - those things were steam trains - shopping is going online so shops will close 

11 minutes ago, Social Justice League said:

Consumer capitalism is a thing of the past..........a later half of the 20th century blip.  It's just that most people haven't noticed yet.

yea amazon are doing so badly 

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When shop workers and servers wages are so little how does anyone expect the low paid workers to spend money in the shops and eateries in the same environment they work in, they don't earn enough to live nevermind spending on non essential extras?.......shopping centre environment another down side to a shopping centre, the noise, the air, the light, the atmosphere, the smell, the depressed looking faces of the people working with no windows or natural light all day......people wouldn't pay to visit.😉

  Edit, found this:.   https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/Sick-building-syndrome/.😉

Edited by winkie

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21 minutes ago, sideysid said:

Croydon girls were pretty much renowned for many an interesting story. The club itself was a pain in the **** to get home from, so we didn’t go too often. The ‘booze bus’ they put on to take you there was more fun. I remember once a group of girls were sitting at the back and all going commando in short skirts to avoid VPL. We obviously got talking to those pretty sharpish after them giving us a flash or two. Alas those days are long gone for the younger generation.

I don’t know I think we all have similar stories, the only thing in common is that we were young and the girls were also young 

the world was our oyster when we were young 

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9 minutes ago, happyguy said:

yea amazon are doing so badly 

It's just a matter of time before they go to the wall as well. 

People wasting their time working in non jobs and borrowing funny money from scum banks to by sh1te peddled by these online mongers of tat is an embarrassment.

Human animals consuming the worlds resources to feed insecurities is broken model that will end soon imo.

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8 minutes ago, Social Justice League said:

It's just a matter of time before they go to the wall as well. 

People wasting their time working in non jobs and borrowing funny money from scum banks to by sh1te peddled by these online mongers of tat is an embarrassment.

Human animals consuming the worlds resources to feed insecurities is broken model that will end soon imo.

They are doing better and better, have you heard of AWS

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5 minutes ago, prozac said:

They are doing better and better, have you heard of AWS

I'm talking about a cultural shift away from consumer capitalism.   Amazon will move away from peddling rubbish if it is to survive, long term.......say the next 50 to 100 years.

Human beings will gradually move away from todays broken Western consumerist model, as it is a relic of a time long since gone.

Young people are already consuming far less "things" in general.  This will continue.

Most traditional "shops" and shopping centres have got no chance, long term.

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Quote

Steve Hall, from Essex, said: "I like shopping centres but they do seem to be dying and I wish some money was spent on making them good again."

As long as it's not your money, right Steve?

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4 hours ago, sideysid said:

This is a real issue, and the tax payer will foot the bill when these reckless investments go up in smoke. Heads should roll, but unfortunately unlike the poll tax riots in the past, the MSM will most likely have a media blackout to placate the masses. 

In this example in the area I grew up in, £53m for this retail park is ridiculous. Due to the location and having to drive there, the last time it was popular was in 1990 when it was an indoor water park. Then when that closed down the main attraction was a nightclub in the heydays of the late 90’s that put on a free bus to get punters in.

https://insidecroydon.com/2018/11/01/council-pays-53m-to-buy-unloved-colonnades-centre/

I agree 100%, btw what was the indoor water park called?

 

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8 minutes ago, Social Justice League said:

I'm talking about a cultural shift away from consumer capitalism.   Amazon will move away from peddling rubbish if it is to survive, long term.......say the next 50 to 100 years.

Human beings will gradually move away from todays broken Western consumerist model, as it is a relic of a time long since gone.

Young people are already consuming far less "things" in general.  This will continue.

Most traditional "shops" and shopping centres have got no chance, long term.

Have to agree there's more than a whiff of cultural change in the air and it's not just coming from the extractor fans in our now-legal cannabis greenhouses. The maker movement; public revulsion at fracking and disposable plastics; the surging popularity of veganism and recycling/upcycling all point to the same thing: People are becoming Earth conscious again in a way they haven't been since the early seventies.

 

make_every_day_earth_day_stickers-r1bc49

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15 minutes ago, zugzwang said:

Have to agree there's more than a whiff of cultural change in the air and it's not just coming from the extractor fans in our now-legal cannabis greenhouses. The maker movement; public revulsion at fracking and disposable plastics; the surging popularity of veganism and recycling/upcycling all point to the same thing: People are becoming Earth conscious again in a way they haven't been since the early seventies.

 

make_every_day_earth_day_stickers-r1bc49

I hope so but I think consumption is taking other forms; tourism, foodie culture, the rise of upmarket barbershops, spa days, botox, fitness/personal training, instagram dogs... it's still competitive, it's still capitalism, but it's less acquisitive of physical items to connote taste/wealth and more about individual performative pursuit. 

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  • 152 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

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      • down 5% +
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      • up 5%



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