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reddog

How many outwardly respectable businesses are a vehicle for fraud?

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Just bought the Harry Marcopolis book on Bernie Madoff, and was also thinking about fraud due to Patisserie Valerie going from fraud being reported to wound up in about 12 hours.

 

Got me thinking what other respectable companies are out their that could quickly implode due to ongoing fraud, my take is that it is higher than most people think.

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far more numbers on paper than there is stock and labour.

From small businesses to the largest of organisations, only difference is the size of the numbers.

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wasn't Patisserie Valerie a poster child of the Osborne boom?

 

very symbolic

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18 hours ago, EnglishinWales said:

All of them. 

Childish comment - my business is totally 100 legit 

 

1 minute ago, PeanutButter said:

I mean, literally every single "cash only"  nail bar and Chinese restaurant in the UK?

Agree any company that is cash only should be investigated by the HMRC 

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2 hours ago, happyguy said:

Childish comment - my business is totally 100 legit 

 

Agree any company that is cash only should be investigated by the HMRC 

Youd need to employ about 1 tax inspaector per 5 businesses then.

Most retail are cash.

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What about all the non-viable ''self-employed'' hobby businesses that are nothing but a vehicle to claim tax credits and other associated benefits?

Just another form of fraud, even if it is fully endorsed by the govt to fudge the unemployment figures.

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6 hours ago, happyguy said:

Childish comment - my business is totally 100 legit 

 

Agree any company that is cash only should be investigated by the HMRC 

100% you mean.

So you make no purchases through the business that are not for the use of the business.

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local yorkshire-based expanding restaurant chain goes into administration - honest response from the owner:

https://www.leeds-live.co.uk/best-in-leeds/restaurants-bars/leeds-restaurant-chain-cats-pyjamas-15273509

"However, unforeseen circumstances with power problems meant the site couldn’t open fast enough.

"That, coupled with building a strong head office team to support me to run the business whilst I had my first child some 12 weeks ago, has resulted in a loss for the business of over £50,000 a month.”

Now, Alison has assured customers her business is on a strong footing going forward.

She continued: "We have been working with accountants for the last four weeks, seeing if there was anyone out there who could help us, to first and foremost secure the 130 jobs of the amazing team members we have.

"Due to the current climate in the restaurant sector no support was forthcoming.

"We have managed to save the business, and it comes down to family. I am so grateful to have such an amazing personal network around me, and I appreciate that not all entrepreneurs are in this situation.

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20 hours ago, Si1 said:

local yorkshire-based expanding restaurant chain goes into administration - honest response from the owner:

https://www.leeds-live.co.uk/best-in-leeds/restaurants-bars/leeds-restaurant-chain-cats-pyjamas-15273509

"However, unforeseen circumstances with power problems meant the site couldn’t open fast enough.

"That, coupled with building a strong head office team to support me to run the business whilst I had my first child some 12 weeks ago, has resulted in a loss for the business of over £50,000 a month.”

Now, Alison has assured customers her business is on a strong footing going forward.

She continued: "We have been working with accountants for the last four weeks, seeing if there was anyone out there who could help us, to first and foremost secure the 130 jobs of the amazing team members we have.

"Due to the current climate in the restaurant sector no support was forthcoming.

"We have managed to save the business, and it comes down to family. I am so grateful to have such an amazing personal network around me, and I appreciate that not all entrepreneurs are in this situation.

Not been in. Im still getting nagged to go to the Prashad beer and curry snacks place when im next in Leayds.

However - and I not having a dig at this person, rather than the sceptical review of the whole operation/sense.

One. shes the sole director. And shes knocked up. Hows that going to work FFS?

Two, her fiancée and family are no where to be seen on the accounts - no joint director etc etc. Where's this fiancée in the trade?

The company incorporated in 2015.

'"That, coupled with building a strong head office team to support me to run the business whilst I had my first child some 12 weeks ago, has resulted in a loss for the business of over £50,000 a month.”'

Thats ridiculous. Are you telling me she provided ~750k of labour a year. Or replacing her has cost ~1m in staff costs. BS.

From May 2018 - 6 months ago:

https://www.caterlyst.com/caterlyst3/insight/Insight.aspx?n=21162

'Growing restaurant brand, The Cat’s Pyjamas has opened its third site in York this week, which joins sister sites in Leeds and the original venue in Headingley'

She'd have been in her last 3 months  then.

The website lists 5 sites. Thats a nuts rate of expansion by a compnay.

You just cannot recruit honest, capable people to work in what is a cash business - says spy, hier to a fishnchips empire that never was.

'"There came a point over the last three months where we found ourselves in a difficult situation due to our recent high-level investment into business growth and expansions, and our reliance on short-term high interest crippling loans.'

Eateries are are risky business. Thats why those loans are high FFS.

If I was to guess Id say that she's a bit of a headstrong/greedy person who, stupidly, has took on a lot of rent free business premises.

For 2 years, the cash flow will have been fantastic - no/low rent to pay, margins at ~60% Woohoo! If I just open 100 of these Ill be worth ...... millions.

Then the rent free period ends and shes got another ~4k month to find. The place is no longer new and fun, so trades dropped off. She cannot get reliable people - who wants to work for equity in eatry business???

Eateries dont scale or up. Or rather onle if you go massive scale and simplify the food - MaccyDs, Pizza Hut etc.

 

 

 

 

Growing restaurant brand, The Cat’s Pyjamas has opened its third site in York this week, which joins sister sites in Leeds and the original venue in Headingley. - See more at: https://www.caterlyst.com/caterlyst3/insight/Insight.aspx?n=21162#sthash.N7Svd1uO.dpuf

 

 

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'"We had a planned new site opening in Wakefield which would support our cash flow and bottom line.'

How in FFS?

Almost Ponzi-esque.

Wakeys been bombed out, businesswise, since the 80s.

Itll offer cheap/frree sites which are cheap/free for a reason - everyone's on benefits.

 

 

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Ah. Interesting. I've been half intending to give it a visit owing to its great reputation. But I've just ended up at one of my more local reliable Indians instead, the kind that's been carefully shuffling along for 30 years serving the community.

You make what seem to be excellent points.

 

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The UK's shadow (black) economy is apparently worth around 200 billion a year, and half of all circulating cash is linked to it apparently. 

Drugs, prostitution, etc etc. 

Things being illegal doesn't miraculously make demand go away and there will always be folk willing to meet supply. 

Instead of finding a workable legitimate solution we currently spend tens of billions trying to police a lot of illegal things that people happily spend hundreds of billions on a year. 

You'd imagine a lot of legitimate businesses exist solely to clean shadow market money. 

I do often wonder where some of our high profile political cocaine users get their gear from. BoJo has been challenged to take a drug test recently, and you do wonder if George Osborne still likes his sniff. 

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1 hour ago, spyguy said:

'"We had a planned new site opening in Wakefield which would support our cash flow and bottom line.'

How in FFS?

Almost Ponzi-esque.

Wakeys been bombed out, businesswise, since the 80s.

Itll offer cheap/frree sites which are cheap/free for a reason - everyone's on benefits.

 

 

I thought that  'I had assemble a fantastic team to support me'  while I conveniently got pregnant about two years into the venture, they say London's streets are paved with gold - think I might be looking up North if there is money available for C*** like this 

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23 hours ago, Si1 said:

local yorkshire-based expanding restaurant chain goes into administration - honest response from the owner:

https://www.leeds-live.co.uk/best-in-leeds/restaurants-bars/leeds-restaurant-chain-cats-pyjamas-15273509

"However, unforeseen circumstances with power problems meant the site couldn’t open fast enough.

"That, coupled with building a strong head office team to support me to run the business whilst I had my first child some 12 weeks ago, has resulted in a loss for the business of over £50,000 a month.”

Now, Alison has assured customers her business is on a strong footing going forward.

She continued: "We have been working with accountants for the last four weeks, seeing if there was anyone out there who could help us, to first and foremost secure the 130 jobs of the amazing team members we have.

"Due to the current climate in the restaurant sector no support was forthcoming.

"We have managed to save the business, and it comes down to family. I am so grateful to have such an amazing personal network around me, and I appreciate that not all entrepreneurs are in this situation.

Is the "honest" you're referring to sarcasm? I'll run this through the bull**** to English translator:

"We had a planned new site opening in Wakefield which would support our cash flow and bottom line" = We've never head of over-trading so decided to go ahead with it, or risk so we took some stupid finance decisions.

"strong head office team...resulted in a loss" = The team is so fantastic that they crater the income of the business without doing anything about it.

"assured customers her business is on a strong footing" = We'll be bust in 6 months.

All in my opinion of course, I could well be wrong.

 

Edited by Ghostly

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27 minutes ago, Ghostly said:

Is the "honest" you're referring to sarcasm? I'll run this through the bull**** to English translator:

 

Naivety on my part . Yeah I suspect they'll go but again in another 6 months taking family money when them.

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1 hour ago, GregBowman said:

I thought that  'I had assemble a fantastic team to support me'  while I conveniently got pregnant about two years into the venture, they say London's streets are paved with gold - think I might be looking up North if there is money available for C*** like this 

West Yorkshire took a big blow from the credit crunch - it's biggest employers were high street finance and public sector.

 

SMEs of all kinds have been promoted to try to fill the gap. I think we're at the swimming with no cossie stage no w.

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15 minutes ago, Si1 said:

West Yorkshire took a big blow from the credit crunch - it's biggest employers were high street finance and public sector.

 

SMEs of all kinds have been promoted to try to fill the gap. I think we're at the swimming with no cossie stage no w.

True.

But call it what it was - Browns huge recession caused by blowing a massive real estate credit bubble.

West Yorkshire got hammered because:

Bradford n Bingley, Halifax BS, etc blew up. These were huge direct and indirect employees. 90% of tgese jobs have gone. A bank with no money (capital) is like a pub with no beer.

Massive number of low end legal work - para legals conveyancing. Trying to make that last longer ppi, ambulance chasing stuff.

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Leeds is still a legal centre and I know a few people making reasonable livings from it

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What do you expect. We've had over a generation where the idea of 'work hard and build yourself up' has been systematically ripped up in the quest to financialise everything. The media portray the winners as some sort of prophetic guru lauding their acumen instead of admitting they were simply in the right place at the right time - HPI being the perfect example.

 

The focus on self gain (remember there is no society just individuals and families) meant the idea of give back - either through taxation or self guidance evaporated.  What you see is an endemic of corruption to keep the plates spinning - what can a leech do when there are no more hosts to feed from.

 

The culture of financialisation and all that support it have to be cauterised out of the economy.  Conservatism, and to some extent the original Labour movement were built on earning your keep and giving back as you gained to help the next guy.

 

I'll leave my contribution here.  Inheritance wealth management fund goes under

 

 

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On 14/10/2018 at 11:26, Si1 said:

West Yorkshire took a big blow from the credit crunch - it's biggest employers were high street finance and public sector.

 

All of Yorkshire. I was born in Barnsley just as the mining strike was kicking off. My parents moved to Scarborough 4 months later. My first proper job was in York at CPP (card protection) but was lost after my team was transferred to Malaysia in 2006, so I moved to Norwich Union Life (headquarters are in York not Norwich) but told after 6 months or so this whole team is being moved to India in 18 months. 1,750 total job losses eventually were announced. Realised Yorkshire was done for. Left in 2009 to seek my fortune in Wales.  

 

 

 

 

Still seeking....

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