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Saving For a Space Ship

The Big Hack: How China Used a Tiny Chip to Infiltrate U.S. Companies

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Fake News, completely fabricated out of thin air.

You can't just add a chip on a motherboard. You would have to redesign the whole board to add all the traces needed for the chip to function and there is no way the Chinese factories assembling Supermicro motherboards could do that without Supermicro noticing as the boards are designed by Supermicro, not the Chinese Assemblers.

I don't know what the ultimate purpose of this fake story is, but it certainly distracts from the fact that almost all boards with Intel chips (all designed by Intel's Israeli branch) from the last ten years have a barn door wide backdoor called the Intel Management Engine, which certainly US and Israeli intelligence services use routinely to hack into computers.

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I don't think this is 'fake news', have you seen how small this chip is?  Apparently its the size of a pencil tip.  I would have thought a small component like that could be slipped into the boards architecture without raising too much suspicion.

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1 hour ago, dougless said:

I don't think this is 'fake news', have you seen how small this chip is?  Apparently its the size of a pencil tip.  I would have thought a small component like that could be slipped into the boards architecture without raising too much suspicion.

Again, the size of the chip itself doesn't matter, you would have to redesign the whole board to add all the traces needed for the chip to function, and there is no way the Chinese factories assembling Supermicro motherboards could do that without Supermicro noticing.

These boards are highly optimised, to add some new traces you usually have to redesign the layout of the whole board as of course traces must not cross each other. Also length of traces affects timing and therefore it's quite tricky to redesign the board without affecting stability.

Supermicro themselves vehemently refute the Bloomberg story and they certainly wouldn't do that it it was true as in that case it would be undeniable:

https://www.supermicro.com/newsroom/pressreleases/2018/press181004_Bloomberg.cfm

Quote

SAN JOSE, Calif., October 4, 2018 — Super Micro Computer, Inc. (SMCI), a global leader in enterprise computing, storage, networking solutions and green computing technology, strongly refutes reports that servers it sold to customers contained malicious microchips in the motherboards of those systems.

In an article today, it is alleged that Supermicro motherboards sold to certain customers contained malicious chips on its motherboards in 2015. Supermicro has never found any malicious chips, nor been informed by any customer that such chips have been found.

Each company mentioned in the article (Supermicro, Apple, Amazon and Elemental) has issued strong statements denying the claims:

Apple stated on CNBC, “We are deeply disappointed that in their dealings with us, Bloomberg's reporters have not been open to the possibility that they or their sources might be wrong or misinformed. Our best guess is that they are confusing their story with a previously reported 2016 incident in which we discovered an infected driver on a single Supermicro server in one of our labs. That one-time event was determined to be accidental and not a targeted attack against Apple."

Steve Schmidt, Chief Information Security Officer at Amazon Web Services stated, "As we shared with Bloomberg BusinessWeek multiple times over the last couple months, at no time, past or present, have we ever found any issues relating to modified hardware or malicious chips in Supermicro motherboards in any Elemental or Amazon systems.‎" 

Supermicro has never been contacted by any government agencies either domestic or foreign regarding the alleged claims.

Supermicro takes all security claims very seriously and makes continuous investments in the security capabilities of their products. The manufacture of motherboards in China is not unique to Supermicro and is a standard industry practice. Nearly all systems providers use the same contract manufacturers. Supermicro qualifies and certifies every contract manufacturer and routinely inspects their facilities and processes closely.

 

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9 minutes ago, The Eagle said:

Again, the size of the chip itself doesn't matter, you would have to redesign the whole board to add all the traces needed for the chip to function, and there is no way the Chinese factories assembling Supermicro motherboards could do that without Supermicro noticing.

These boards are highly optimised, to add some new traces you usually have to redesign the layout of the whole board as of course traces must not cross each other. Also length of traces affects timing and therefore it's quite tricky to redesign the board without affecting stability.

"traces"

I assume you mean 'tracks' ?

I also assume, however, that you are not disputing the technical feasibility of the claims?

But even IF fully true.....why is anyone surprised by this?!

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25 minutes ago, The Eagle said:

Again, the size of the chip itself doesn't matter, you would have to redesign the whole board to add all the traces needed for the chip to function, and there is no way the  ̶C̶h̶i̶n̶e̶s̶e̶  Russian factories assembling Supermicro motherboards could do that without Supermicro noticing.

These boards are highly optimised, to add some new traces you usually have to redesign the layout of the whole board as of course traces must not cross each other. Also length of traces affects timing and therefore it's quite tricky to redesign the board without affecting stability.

=

You and your facts.  We're trying to make something stick here. I think I fixed it though.

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1 hour ago, chronyx said:

You and your facts.  We're trying to make something stick here. I think I fixed it though.

I see what you did... ;)

I'm not convinced that the intention is the same as with Russia (to build up a bogeyman), but it's a possibility.

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13 hours ago, The Eagle said:

Fake News, completely fabricated out of thin air.

You can't just add a chip on a motherboard. You would have to redesign the whole board to add all the traces needed for the chip to function and there is no way the Chinese factories assembling Supermicro motherboards could do that without Supermicro noticing as the boards are designed by Supermicro, not the Chinese Assemblers.

I don't know what the ultimate purpose of this fake story is, but it certainly distracts from the fact that almost all boards with Intel chips (all designed by Intel's Israeli branch) from the last ten years have a barn door wide backdoor called the Intel Management Engine, which certainly US and Israeli intelligence services use routinely to hack into computers.

They can even hack and switch the machine on when it is off.  i looked for ways to disable this but no luck yet. 

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59 minutes ago, longgone said:

They can even hack and switch the machine on when it is off.  i looked for ways to disable this but no luck yet. 

Block Chinese IP addresses at your router.

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 The tech giants, the US and the Chinese spy chips that never were… or were they?

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/oct/13/tech-giants-us-chinese-spy-chips-bloomberg-supermicro-amazon-apple

 

Quote

...Amazon, for its part, was equally unambiguous: “At no time, past or present, have we ever found any issues relating to modified hardware or malicious chips in Supermicro motherboards in any Elemental or Amazon systems. Nor have we engaged in an investigation with the government.”

Then the UK National Cyber Security Centre weighed in, saying that it had “no reason to doubt the detailed assessments made by AWS (Amazon Web Services) and Apple”.

 

The US Department of Homeland Security said much the same. And Supermicro (whose market value had been halved by the Bloomberg story) stated that it had “never been contacted by any government agencies either domestic or foreign regarding the alleged claims”.

In response, Bloomberg reporters stood by their story and even extended it, claiming that a “major US telecommunications company” had discovered manipulated Supermicro hardware in its network and removed it in August.

So what’s going on? Clearly, someone’s being economical with the actualité. Seeing what happened to Supermicro’s share price, you can see why the companies might be er, defensive. (And of course, the thought that security might oblige them to relocate manufacturing to the US would blow their minds, never mind their bottom lines.) Likewise, the intelligence agencies might be reluctant to draw too much public attention to supply-chain interference, given that they all do it.

Maybe things will become clearer in the next few weeks. In the meantime, the most illuminating contribution to the debate so far came from a Cambridge University researcher, Dr A Theodore Markettos, who conducted a fascinating investigation of a key bit of the Supermicro hardware to see if the Bloomberg claim passed what he called “the sniff test” of initial plausibility. His conclusion: it does. Stay tuned...

 

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On 13/10/2018 at 21:30, Saving For a Space Ship said:

 The tech giants, the US and the Chinese spy chips that never were… or were they?

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/oct/13/tech-giants-us-chinese-spy-chips-bloomberg-supermicro-amazon-apple

 

 

 

system on chip eavesdropping has been known about for years.

not even the add-on chip,but altered lithography in the IC's.

 

this is old news

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  • 149 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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