UK economy requires fundamental structural shift, says landmark think tank report

[Lurkerbelow]

Akin to last months policy exchange paper IPPR have come up with their own one pushing for the need for significant large scale economic reform. 

I don't think the Tories can hold back the tide for too much longer.   They are in the same position Labour were in in the 1970's, where they are protecting vested interests while causing significant and demonstrable harm because those VI's comprise their core voting blocks.   But the tides coming in and they are going to get swept away just as happened with Labour in the late 70's.

Quote

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/uk-economy-ippr-commission-on-economic-justice-report-justin-welby-a8499686.html

The UK economy requires a series of fundamental structural overhauls – from giving workers more rights, to raising state investment, to empowering regulators to bust monopolies – a landmark commission on the state of the UK economy has concluded.

The Institute for Public Policy Research’s Commission on Economic Justice, which has been analysing every aspects of the UK economy for the past 18 months, also argues in its final report that it is necessary to “hard-wire” justice into our economic system, rather than treating this as “an afterthought”. 

“A fairer economy is a stronger economy,” it says.

The Commission’s interim report last year argued that reforms on the scale of the founding of the state in the 1940s by Labour and the wrenching Thatcher reforms of the 1980s were necessary.

The final document fleshes out that manifesto, recommending five major “shifts”:

• Ending the cycle of debt-led consumption growth and raising national saving and investment levels
• A “new industrialisation” policy based on developing industrial clusters around universities
• Breaking the UK’s “low-wage, low productivity equilibrium” by ending excessive flexibility in labour markets and giving workers more influence in companies and a higher minimum wage
• A focus on “managed automation”, promoting technological diffusion but also investing heavily in re-skilling and re-training displaced workers
• Breaking up monopolies and regulating the activities of internet giants and digital platforms much more closely

“In each of these ways, the UK economy needs to be reshaped if we are to achieve prosperity and justice together”, the report argues.

“And change must happen on a sufficient scale to achieve ‘escape velocity’ from the economy we have today to the one we need.”

The Commission met 10 times over the past year and a half.

Its members include Justin Welby, the archbishop of Canterbury, Dominic Barton, the boss of the management consultancy firm McKinsey, Lord Kerslake, the former head of the home civil service, the Brexit-supporting businessman John Mills and the Trade Union Congress general secretary Frances O’Grady.

The Commission was politically independent and takes no view on Brexit. Nor does it seek to attribute political blame for the economic condition of the UK now.

It steers clear of the fraught subject of utility re-nationalisation, part of Labour’s manifesto, although it does, like the opposition, propose a National Investment Bank.

It calls for a “serious debate” about the level of taxes as a share of GDP, without recommending its own target, but it does say income and wealth should be “taxed in the same way”.

The Commission says the Bank of England’s mandate should be expanded from price stability to also include a target for minimising unemployment, underemployment, and also the level of nominal GDP.

It argues the Bank should be given the power to ask the new National Investment Bank to expand lending, to stimulate aggregate demand, when its own interest rates can go no lower.

It calls for public investment to be increased by 0.8 per cent of GDP on top of current plans.

On immigration, it suggests dropping the government’s net annual aggregate target, but replacing it with a series of sectoral targets.

It proposes a “National Economic Council”, headed by the Chancellor and involving devolved UK regional administrations, business leaders and trade unions to create a “co-ordinated 10-year plan for the UK economy”.

The package of measures would certainly constitute a new direction for the UK, taking it closer to a European-style co-ordinated market economy like Germany and away from the current liberal model.

The report takes comfort from the fact that the UK economic model was previously radically shaken up in the 1940s and 1980s.

“It is precisely because we have achieved change of this magnitude before that we believe it is possible to do so again,” it says.

 “We can bridge the gap between the country we are and the country we would like to be,” says the IPPR’s director Tom Kibasi.

 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Lurkerbelow said:

Akin to last months policy exchange paper IPPR have come up with their own one pushing for the need for significant large scale economic reform. 

I don't think the Tories can hold back the tide for too much longer.   They are in the same position Labour were in in the 1970's, where they are protecting vested interests while causing significant and demonstrable harm because those VI's comprise their core voting blocks.   But the tides coming in and they are going to get swept away just as happened with Labour in the late 70's.

 

What I find hilarious is the fact that BTL investors think they are going to get free houses on the back of hosting off working tenants like some parasite when they cross the finishing line in a decade or two, no chance. Heard it more than once, some thick  hairdresser or junior office manager "well I get my tenants to pay my mortgage/s off dun I". 

Some would of made a lot of money, and in all seriousness good luck to then, but they have or are probably leaving the exit now, the ones that see the top and then a few drops in prices will be the funniest ones to watch leaving, always trying to get top $ and never having the brains to drop lower than other sellers trying to get out

[Lurkerbelow]

53 minutes ago, inbruges said:

What I find hilarious is the fact that BTL investors think they are going to get free houses on the back of hosting off working tenants like some parasite when they cross the finishing line in a decade or two, no chance. Heard it more than once, some thick  hairdresser or junior office manager "well I get my tenants to pay my mortgage/s off dun I". 

Some would of made a lot of money, and in all seriousness good luck to then, but they have or are probably leaving the exit now, the ones that see the top and then a few drops in prices will be the funniest ones to watch leaving, always trying to get top $ and never having the brains to drop lower than other sellers trying to get out

Yeah its pretty obvious this situation isn't going to last another decade never mind two.   The hosts these parasites are feeding off of are getting antsy and they are just going to keep growing in electoral strength.   At some point rather less than they hope for it won't matter what they want, there simply won't be enough of them to hold back the calls for full scale reform and they'll end up getting scalped.   So if they were smart they'd take their winnings and quit now while they are ahead.   If they were less smart they'd demand the Tories act so that though they'd lose somewhat, they'd still not lose as much as they would under Corbyn or a Corbyn clone.   But they'll do neither and so they'll go down with the Tory ship.

[Guest]

9 hours ago, Lurkerbelow said:

Yeah its pretty obvious this situation isn't going to last another decade never mind two.   The hosts these parasites are feeding off of are getting antsy and they are just going to keep growing in electoral strength.   At some point rather less than they hope for it won't matter what they want, there simply won't be enough of them to hold back the calls for full scale reform and they'll end up getting scalped.   So if they were smart they'd take their winnings and quit now while they are ahead.   If they were less smart they'd demand the Tories act so that though they'd lose somewhat, they'd still not lose as much as they would under Corbyn or a Corbyn clone.   But they'll do neither and so they'll go down with the Tory ship.

I am amazed we have not had some of repeat of the 2012 UK riots, back then it only took the shooting of a grubby little hoodlum by the police to spark things off. Violence in major cities is now common place, for every daily stabbing that now happens there are a 100 or even a 1000 incidents of someone wanting to kick the s*** out f you for just looking at them funny or getting in their way.

Society now has a vast group of people that have just been totally swept under the carpet, a feral society that at best is forced to work at Sports Direct or some grubby zero hours contract job doing a job that will never even come close to paying all the bills and rent with the crappy insulting wages. Day by day it is getting worse as day by day governments work harder at protecting the immoral debt induced gains of the early 2000's from the likes of rampant housing costs and wealth of the top 1%.

If these millions of BTL landlords think they will make it to the magic utopia of all their houses being paid off by tenant no choice mugs as they walk into the sunset to a life of luxury they are totally delusional, you can feel the anger now, never mind in several years time

[zugzwang]

1 hour ago, inbruges said:

I am amazed we have not had some of repeat of the 2012 UK riots, back then it only took the shooting of a grubby little hoodlum by the police to spark things off. Violence in major cities is now common place, for every daily stabbing that now happens there are a 100 or even a 1000 incidents of someone wanting to kick the s*** out f you for just looking at them funny or getting in their way.

Society now has a vast group of people that have just been totally swept under the carpet, a feral society that at best is forced to work at Sports Direct or some grubby zero hours contract job doing a job that will never even come close to paying all the bills and rent with the crappy insulting wages. Day by day it is getting worse as day by day governments work harder at protecting the immoral debt induced gains of the early 2000's from the likes of rampant housing costs and wealth of the top 1%.

If these millions of BTL landlords think they will make it to the magic utopia of all their houses being paid off by tenant no choice mugs as they walk into the sunset to a life of luxury they are totally delusional, you can feel the anger now, never mind in several years time

There's an epidemic of shooting, stabbing and carjacking on our streets which even the heavily manipulated crime stats can no longer disguise.

The luxury gangster lifestyle of father-of-nine gun dealer Carlington 'Mad Dog' Grant

[Guest]

32 minutes ago, zugzwang said:

There's an epidemic of shooting, stabbing and carjacking on our streets which even the heavily manipulated crime stats can no longer disguise.

The luxury gangster lifestyle of father-of-nine gun dealer Carlington 'Mad Dog' Grant

I wonder how much money out of his pocket goes to raising his 9 kids?

[Errol]

He evidently can't afford to dress himself sensibly.

[Big Orange]

4 hours ago, inbruges said:

I am amazed we have not had some of repeat of the 2012 UK riots, back then it only took the shooting of a grubby little hoodlum by the police to spark things off. Violence in major cities is now common place, for every daily stabbing that now happens there are a 100 or even a 1000 incidents of someone wanting to kick the s*** out f you for just looking at them funny or getting in their way.

I see homeless people (or people in shared accommodation) roving around Bath, Bristol, and Weston Super Mare with obvious mental health issues, saying and doing inappropriate things, walking time bombs waiting to go *BOOM!*.

Broadmead is in particularly dangerous - I keep hearing about violent assaults happening there, I first hand witnessed a violent brawl, heard about somebody threatened with a hammer, and on a handful of occasions got subjected to wannabe tough guy threats and tantrums by creeps because I looked at them a split second too long or had my smartphone pointed in the wrong direction. 

[ebull]

Does anyone else think posts here resemble ever more a modern day equivalent of bloke with sandwich board reading the end is nigh?

[ebull]

Just now, Big Orange said:

I see homeless people (or people in shared accommodation) roving around Bath, Bristol, and Weston Super Mare with obvious mental health issues, saying and doing inappropriate things, walking time bombs waiting to go *BOOM!*.

Broadmead is in particularly dangerous - I keep hearing about violent assaults happening there, I first hand witnessed a violent brawl, heard about somebody threatened with a hammer, and on a handful of occasions got subjected to wannabe tough guy threats and tantrums by creeps because I looked at them a split second too long or had my smartphone pointed in the wrong direction. 

I thought HPCers were much too smart to stand on the street with a small desired item worth more than a months disposable for many around them waving it around like an invitation to be robbed.

Or is that an age related logical conclusion of watching the local news?

 

[Lurkerbelow]

5 hours ago, ebull said:

Does anyone else think posts here resemble ever more a modern day equivalent of bloke with sandwich board reading the end is nigh?

No one is saying the end is nigh but its pretty obvious the country is approaching some sort of tipping point.

The broad masses don't vote for radical change like they have in Brexit and Corbyn if everything is going well and they live happy and contented lives.

But both of these have now been normalized so what is not normal now seems normal, but that doesn't mean that that point of disjunction and severe non-linear change isn't rapidly reaching its climax.

[Lurkerbelow]

11 hours ago, inbruges said:

I am amazed we have not had some of repeat of the 2012 UK riots, back then it only took the shooting of a grubby little hoodlum by the police to spark things off. Violence in major cities is now common place, for every daily stabbing that now happens there are a 100 or even a 1000 incidents of someone wanting to kick the s*** out f you for just looking at them funny or getting in their way.

Society now has a vast group of people that have just been totally swept under the carpet, a feral society that at best is forced to work at Sports Direct or some grubby zero hours contract job doing a job that will never even come close to paying all the bills and rent with the crappy insulting wages. Day by day it is getting worse as day by day governments work harder at protecting the immoral debt induced gains of the early 2000's from the likes of rampant housing costs and wealth of the top 1%.

If these millions of BTL landlords think they will make it to the magic utopia of all their houses being paid off by tenant no choice mugs as they walk into the sunset to a life of luxury they are totally delusional, you can feel the anger now, never mind in several years time

I think its because people are still hoping for a political solution.   Its only when all other options have been exhausted that they turn to violence.   Hence our democracy is currently acting as a safety valve that is preventing that turn to violence from occurring.  If things don't start to improve though with the next gov, or worse still some type of internal political party coup happens to prevent needed change then I believe we will see that turn to violence.

[Lurkerbelow]

9 hours ago, zugzwang said:

There's an epidemic of shooting, stabbing and carjacking on our streets which even the heavily manipulated crime stats can no longer disguise.

The luxury gangster lifestyle of father-of-nine gun dealer Carlington 'Mad Dog' Grant

Its an end result of having such a giant gaping gap between the have and have nots in our society.   There will always be scum like this about, but such a lifestyle only becomes attractive to large swathes of people if they feel they have no other realistic option of getting ahead in society.   If you feel you have no chance and no hope no matter how hard you try by playing by the rules of the game, it makes not playing by the rules of the game a far far more attractive proposition.

[Lenelby]

7 hours ago, ebull said:

Does anyone else think posts here resemble ever more a modern day equivalent of bloke with sandwich board reading the end is nigh?

Or is it just a perception. Maybe I'm lucky as in my life I don't come across people who are struggling like that. 

[Wayward]

7 hours ago, ebull said:

Does anyone else think posts here resemble ever more a modern day equivalent of bloke with sandwich board reading the end is nigh?

No...posters are reporting on their observations of erosion in societal cohesion in the UK...all predictable and a direct result of policy. 

[jonb2]

16 hours ago, Wayward said:

No...posters are reporting on their observations of erosion in societal cohesion in the UK...all predictable and a direct result of policy. 

Exactly - 100% on target WW.

[cashinmattress]

On 05/09/2018 at 20:02, Lurkerbelow said:

Akin to last months policy exchange paper IPPR have come up with their own one pushing for the need for significant large scale economic reform. 

I don't think the Tories can hold back the tide for too much longer.   They are in the same position Labour were in in the 1970's, where they are protecting vested interests while causing significant and demonstrable harm because those VI's comprise their core voting blocks.   But the tides coming in and they are going to get swept away just as happened with Labour in the late 70's.

 

Easily done if you create a republic and do away with hereditary entitlements... which is never going to happen.

This report is wasted money... reads like its from some university Marxist rally pamphlets.

[disenfranchised]

On 06/09/2018 at 20:20, Lurkerbelow said:

No one is saying the end is nigh but its pretty obvious the country is approaching some sort of tipping point.

The broad masses don't vote for radical change like they have in Brexit and Corbyn if everything is going well and they live happy and contented lives.

We were locked in an internationalist socialism -vs- nationalist capitalism ideological war from the 1920s until Labour gave up in about 1992.

We settled down into a kind of puny compromise of "socially liberal global capitalism with a pretence of social democracy". People often talk of the modern world being Orwellian, and mean a kind of 1984 dystopia - but it can be applied in another respect - the Blairites and Tory "moderates" are about as far apart ideologically as Orwell's pigs & men at the end of Animal Farm, completely alike, comfortably enjoying the fruits of society they have delivered to themselves, whilst the rest of us look on through the window and wonder what the ****** just happened. 

We've had no real political leaders of any vision for decades, just a sort of political management class who resemble civil servants with a constituency office and merely tinker with things and concentrate on winning swing voters.

That just won't cut the mustard forever. The fact that a think tank comprising not the leading social and ecomomic thinkers of the political parties, but the Archbishop of Canterbury and the head of a Trade Union body can produce a paper which at least tackles the issues we face that the aforementioned politicians choose to ignore shows just how ******ing useless they are.

The Tories brains run on Reaganomics and so did nu Labour, new old Labour run on juvenile socialist worker placard sound bites. Neither has had a genuine idea since about 1950.

Edited September 8, 2018 by disenfranchised

[anonguest]

On 06/09/2018 at 08:40, inbruges said:

I am amazed we have not had some of repeat of the 2012 UK riots,......

Have patience Grasshopper......

Edited September 8, 2018 by anonguest

[jonb2]

5 hours ago, disenfranchised said:

We were locked in an internationalist socialism -vs- nationalist capitalism ideological war from the 1920s until Labour gave up in about 1992.

We settled down into a kind of puny compromise of "socially liberal global capitalism with a pretence of social democracy". People often talk of the modern world being Orwellian, and mean a kind of 1984 dystopia - but it can be applied in another respect - the Blairites and Tory "moderates" are about as far apart ideologically as Orwell's pigs & men at the end of Animal Farm, completely alike, comfortably enjoying the fruits of society they have delivered to themselves, whilst the rest of us look on through the window and wonder what the ****** just happened. 

We've had no real political leaders of any vision for decades, just a sort of political management class who resemble civil servants with a constituency office and merely tinker with things and concentrate on winning swing voters.

That just won't cut the mustard forever. The fact that a think tank comprising not the leading social and ecomomic thinkers of the political parties, but the Archbishop of Canterbury and the head of a Trade Union body can produce a paper which at least tackles the issues we face that the aforementioned politicians choose to ignore shows just how ******ing useless they are.

The Tories brains run on Reaganomics and so did nu Labour, new old Labour run on juvenile socialist worker placard sound bites. Neither has had a genuine idea since about 1950.

I could have written this myself - but you beat me to it and put it better than I could.

Thank you.

[winkie]

5 hours ago, disenfranchised said:

 

We've had no real political leaders of any vision for decades, just a sort of political management class who resemble civil servants with a constituency office and merely tinker with things and concentrate on winning swing voters.

 

Agree with the less of leading more of managing.?

[Bear Goggles]

On 06/09/2018 at 11:03, zugzwang said:

There's an epidemic of shooting, stabbing and carjacking on our streets which even the heavily manipulated crime stats can no longer disguise.

The luxury gangster lifestyle of father-of-nine gun dealer Carlington 'Mad Dog' Grant

I appreciate this is going to make me sound like the poncy southern middle class w@nker that I have become, but when driving a base model Landrover Discovery is considered living a life of luxury, you know something is wrong in this country. 

[spyguy]

9 hours ago, Bear Goggles said:

I appreciate this is going to make me sound like the poncy southern middle class w@nker that I have become, but when driving a base model Landrover Discovery is considered living a life of luxury, you know something is wrong in this country. 

Nah, its being over 14 and wearing 'fashion' shorts.

 

[anonguest]

On 06/09/2018 at 21:16, Lenelby said:

Or is it just a perception. Maybe I'm lucky as in my life I don't come across people who are struggling like that. 

Good for you - seriously.  BUT you are not alone. You sound (from your reply) very much like one of several people middle class people I have known since my teens.  People who grew up in suburbia, worked reasonably at school, went on to a degree (of some sort of value that played  a part in shaping their eventual careers), entered the work force, slowly but steadily climbed a career ladder of sorts taking on pregressively more senior roles at different companies (as opposed to being content with staying in the same role for 30+ years), got married in late 20's, saved, bought a house, did it up over the years, benefitted from HPI, had a child or two, moved out of suburbia to a MUCH bigger house in a very nice/desirable location (in part based on calculations assuming HPI forever and eventual inheritances coming their way - some already realised). And so on.

The thing that I have had to explicitly point out/draw their attention to, whenever they comment in surprise/shock at events such as 2012 riots etc, is just how little they know/see of how majority actually live - which is of course much worse/harder than they do.  How did they become so ingnorant/unaware?  Quite easily actually. I, and others, could see how but not them.  The closest they came to seeing a genuine diversity of living standards was when, for 20+ years, they commuted to work and back and looked outside the window as the train passed through evidently more run down areas. And when they weren't on a train they would drive everywhere from A to B.

And so they have likely never wandered off their narrow routine paths and seen real 'back street' Britain. I asked one such when was the last time they took a bus or a non-commuting/work related train journey (e.g to go to the local supermarket, etc). Not for at least 20 years.  I pointed out that probably less than 5 streets walk away from their near central London offices they would easily come across graffiti, urban decay, homeless people and people you wouldn't want to come across alone on  dark night - a whole world they simply have never seen or truly realise exists.

It was evident how easily, over time, large numbers of  people can become completely ignorant/unaware of the true state of their own country and have any real comprehension of the day-to-day hardship of a growing underclass.

 

Edited September 9, 2018 by anonguest

[dryrot]

All good stuff, though I noted:

"Its members include Justin Welby, the archbishop of Canterbury

[...]

It calls for a “serious debate” about the level of taxes as a share of GDP, without recommending its own target, but it does say income and wealth should be “taxed in the same way”."

It is intensely irritating to be lectured on taxes by the head of a church that has and continues to benefit from large-scale tax-free privileges. When is Welby going to volunteer that the CoE pays taxes?