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Si1

State pension to run out of money in 2035. Current under 50s will have to pay much more tax soon if they want it when they retire.

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This is pro-cyclical for house prices, of course. If taxes go up for the current under 50s then they will even less be able to pay obscene prices to buy boomers million pound London houses off them. And the housing market bottom will be that much deeper and longer.

Edited by Si1

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Oh FFS, please don't get me started about pensions. I keep trying to tell my parents that the state pension retirement age will be close to 80 by the time I can claim whatever miserable pittance of a pension I am then entitled to.  And then there are all those furking gold-plated final salary public sector pensions that we are all paying for. 

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Seems like an obvious attempt to frame the discussion. Why should the burden fall only on the current under-50s? There are plenty of ways to raise taxes on current over-50s that seem perfectly fair e.g. merging national insurance into income tax so that a pensioner on £25k and a 20something worker on £25k both pay the same amount of tax.

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Why did no one see this coming !!!!

 

:lol: 

Mark my words...privitisation of taxation in the form of enforced private pensions is coming.

When it is announced, it is time to leave the UK, forget owning a house, GTFO.

Pay more for eduction, houses, pensions, food....it's like the people profiting are running a cartel.

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8 hours ago, Tulip_mania said:

Where is this mythical fund? Obviously a reducing number of working aged people to pensioners would cause problems, that's why the State Pension age is increasing.

This. Pensions are paid out of tax, not out of a mythical fund which yelds 7% per annum. 

The issue is as stated above. Aging, low incomes, high costs. Good ingredient for a ****** up cake

 

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10 minutes ago, Futuroid said:

Well, would you just look at that - how unexpected!

Time to tax the living crap out of wealthy pensioners now, while we still can!

It's funny how that prospect isn't even considered. The over 50s on average are loaded, and made unaffordable promises to themselves of ongoing state spending. And yet there is no question that the under 50s will have to pay for it.

 

As I said elsewhere, Jeremy Corbyn makes his own jam. What's not to like.

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Right - I am early/mid thirties earn almost £60k whilst living and working in the East Midlands - which I consider pretty decent. For some reason I get out of in the morning and do the right thing despite being denied a home for a fair value. If this happens I REFUSE to play the game anymore and will change my behaviour, most likely emigrate.

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5 hours ago, Fletcher said:

I keep trying to tell my parents that the state pension retirement age will be close to 80 by the time I can claim whatever miserable pittance of a pension I am then entitled to.  

No government is going to let people in their 70s starve to death in 21st century Britain, so I doubt state pension age will ever rise above 70.  However, it seems likely to become partially or completely means-tested.  

So rather than a pittance at 80, you may get either the same pension as today at 70, or nothing at all.

Or (which i think would be better) the state pension becomes like jobseekers' allowance and has both a contributions based AND income based element.  That way everyone gets at least something even if smaller - which may be more what you envisage too.

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1 hour ago, TheCountOfNowhere said:

Why did no one see this coming !!!!

 

:lol: 

Mark my words...privitisation of taxation in the form of enforced private pensions is coming.

When it is announced, it is time to leave the UK, forget owning a house, GTFO.

Pay more for eduction, houses, pensions, food....it's like the people profiting are running a cartel.

Yep.  I don't know why anyone under 40 is exercised by their entitlement to the state pension.  it'll be means tested to the point of obsolescence by the time they reach an age at which they might expect to receive it.

What people should be concentrating on is arranging their private pension arrangements in a way that stops future governments getting their thieving hands on it to buy the votes of those who haven't made such arrangements.

 

 

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1 minute ago, Simon Taylor said:

Yep.  I don't know why anyone under 40 is exercised by their entitlement to the state pension.  it'll be means tested to the point of obsolescence by the time they reach an age at which they might expect to receive it.

What people should be concentrating on is arranging their private pension arrangements in a way that stops future governments getting their thieving hands on it to buy the votes of those who haven't made such arrangements.

 

 

This. but it's inevitable that politics will leverage this like hell. 

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3 hours ago, Noallegiance said:

Cut benefits

Better off getting a time machine and going back to 1997 and shooting Brown.

It really is all down to him.

Until Brown got going in 2002ish, the UK's private sector pensions were OK, the banking system needed somework and the pensions and benefits needed vast reform.

From 2000-2009ish Brown spent about 20 years money.

He took ~50% of families with kids out of work and put them on very expensive beneits.

He took pensioners and stuffed them with gold - dont beleive the ****** on lowest pension. There are so many supplementary benefits that UK pensioners do very well.

And then he blew up the UK ifnaincial sector, which he allowed to get to about 5 x the size of the economy.

And he did that all on your everyone under 50s future benefits. Jus to get himself elected in 2010 ...

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50 minutes ago, Pitchfork said:

Yes, lets cut the biggest benefit which is, errr, pensions...

Nope. ax credits/inwork benefits very high.

Another big benefit is unfunded public sector pensions.

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8 minutes ago, spyguy said:

Better off getting a time machine and going back to 1997 and shooting Brown.

It really is all down to him.

Until Brown got going in 2002ish, the UK's private sector pensions were OK, the banking system needed somework and the pensions and benefits needed vast reform.

From 2000-2009ish Brown spent about 20 years money.

He took ~50% of families with kids out of work and put them on very expensive beneits.

He took pensioners and stuffed them with gold - dont beleive the ****** on lowest pension. There are so many supplementary benefits that UK pensioners do very well.

And then he blew up the UK ifnaincial sector, which he allowed to get to about 5 x the size of the economy.

And he did that all on your everyone under 50s future benefits. Jus to get himself elected in 2010 ...

While it's easy to blame the most recent history and the one you know,  the establishment have ensured certain parts of the economy have done very well (City of London, banks, developers etc) at the expense of the rest of us.

It's easy to blame politicians but the issues we have are systemic due to the nature of our debt based financial system. 

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2 hours ago, stoobs said:

There is no state pension fund in the UK is there? I thought all outgoings were paid from current tax receipts plus bond sales.

Yes, quite. There is no fund, so there are no funds to run out.

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I shall be today's contrarian. When I was a pension rep at work the actuaries used to tell me that pensions are the industry with the second longest lifecycle, after timber. Basically you are telling young people that if you do x and y for the rest of your life then when you can no longer work we will give you z. If someone takes this deal (and it's not like you have a choice) then it's just unreasonable to show up at five minutes to midnight and shout Surprise You Ain't Havin It. Any significant changes to pensions really must be done with years (decades even) of notice and at a glacial pace.

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7 minutes ago, Funn3r said:

I shall be today's contrarian. When I was a pension rep at work the actuaries used to tell me that pensions are the industry with the second longest lifecycle, after timber. Basically you are telling young people that if you do x and y for the rest of your life then when you can no longer work we will give you z. If someone takes this deal (and it's not like you have a choice) then it's just unreasonable to show up at five minutes to midnight and shout Surprise You Ain't Havin It. Any significant changes to pensions really must be done with years (decades even) of notice and at a glacial pace.

But experience contradicts this.

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  • 407 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

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