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Noallegiance

UK Unemployment Falls Again

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31 minutes ago, Noallegiance said:

Can anyone please explain how this makes sense? Or highlight how it doesn't!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-41996505

Easy.I know hundreds of unemployed people.None sign on as unemployed.Most are partners of people who work 21 hours for tax credits.Others claim ESA/DLA.Some retired at 55 when they got their final salary pension and inherited from the parents.I also have friends who have a business.They employ 3 people on 16 hours instead of one full time.The 3 all get full tax credits,avoid paying National Insurance or tax,and if needed will work extra hours for cash in hand.Also if its needed to sack one its not a disaster for the business.

If i go out right now down my local high street il see more people unemployed than at any time in my life.Most of them will have an income much much higher than the Minimum wage.Very few will sign on JSA.

Nobody with a partner working 21 hours for tax credits wants a job.

Edited by durhamborn

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As it became increasingly difficult to get unemployment benefit, claimants were actively encouraged to become self employed (wink, wink) because they could then claim tax credits to top up their income.

Trends_in_self-employment_in_the_UK_-_Office_for_National_Statistics.png.fa18d3a3e6ef6cea3bd55adda89a280f.png

 

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10 minutes ago, durhamborn said:

Easy.I know hundreds of unemployed people.None sign on as unemployed.Most are partners of people who work 21 hours for tax credits.Others claim ESA/DLA.Some retired at 55 when they got their final salary pension and inherited from the parents.I also have friends who have a business.They employ 3 people on 16 hours instead of one full time.The 3 all get full tax credits,avoid paying National Insurance or tax,and if needed will work extra hours for cash in hand.Also if its needed to sack one its not a disaster for the business.

If i go out right now down my local high street il see more people unemployed than at any time in my life.Most of them will have an income much much higher than the Minimum wage.Very few will sign on JSA.

Nobody with a partner working 21 hours for tax credits wants a job.

Some of us dropped out of the workforce after saving cash,  it's not a trendy route but was my escape.

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17 minutes ago, durhamborn said:

Easy.I know hundreds of unemployed people.None sign on as unemployed.Most are partners of people who work 21 hours for tax credits.Others claim ESA/DLA.Some retired at 55 when they got their final salary pension and inherited from the parents.I also have friends who have a business.They employ 3 people on 16 hours instead of one full time.The 3 all get full tax credits,avoid paying National Insurance or tax,and if needed will work extra hours for cash in hand.Also if its needed to sack one its not a disaster for the business.

If i go out right now down my local high street il see more people unemployed than at any time in my life.Most of them will have an income much much higher than the Minimum wage.Very few will sign on JSA.

Nobody with a partner working 21 hours for tax credits wants a job.

It often occurs to me that the entire country retired circa 2004 and we've been living on benefits ever since.

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13 minutes ago, zugzwang said:

It often occurs to me that the entire country retired circa 2004 and we've been living on benefits ever since.

It does feel like that.  Instead of the meaningless unemployment figure being quoted every month, I would like to see a percentage of the population that is economically active.

 

 

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26 minutes ago, reddog said:

It does feel like that.  Instead of the meaningless unemployment figure being quoted every month, I would like to see a percentage of the population that is economically active.

 

 

Economically inactive now highest in eight years. A lot of people simply dropped out of the workforce, mainly self funded. Work's crap, so I get it. 

Edited by crashmonitor

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How many hours a week does someone need to work to be classified as employed......wouldn't it be better to total all the hours worked per week and divide it between all working people.....still many left who do not work, carers, house wives and husbands, retired of all ages, students, self supporting, long-term sick and disabled.......would it not be better to have a better breakdown of what employment means and who exactly is employed doing what for how long?....... otherwise it makes little sense.;)

Edited by winkie

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20 minutes ago, winkie said:

How many hours a week does someone need to work to be classified as employed......wouldn't it be better to total all the hours worked per week and divide it between all working people.....still many left who do not work, carers, house wives and husbands, retired of all ages, students, self supporting.......would it not be better to have a better breakdown of what employment means and who exactly is employed doing what for how long?....... otherwise it makes little sense.;)

After working full time36 years I think housekeeping is a bit of a cop out tbh. Indeed with my wife working I do that and don't consider it work, it's more of a leisure activity. Do have to do my elderly father's cleaning and meals...though do the shopping, cleaning and meals for freezer all in the same afternoon to save messing about. Take the same attitude to our own housework...this morning made a quiche, four large blackberry and apple crumbles for the freezer and have a curry on the slow cooker. It's autopilot  whilst listening to radio 4.  Paid work by contrast is a chore. Housewifes have been lying to you chaps for decades.

Edited by crashmonitor

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Thousands of people work hard every day but not for money.....are they unemployed?

Thousands are self-employed but earn little or show they earn nothing.....are they employed or unemployed or neither?;)

 

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30 minutes ago, crashmonitor said:

Economically inactive now highest in eight years. A lot of people simply dropped out of the workforce, mainly self funded. Work's crap, so I get it. 

+1

The 'Unemployment' statistics are a pretty useless gauge of what is happening economically these days.  Governments have been stroking them for years, anyone remember Youth Opportunities, YTS etc?  Today the difference is that they have had over 30 years practice in being creative with their figures and as we know 'practice makes perfect'.

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I finished working this year , I started at 16 and stopped at 54. 

I have enough cash to get me through to my company pension at 55 ( I worked for a blue chip for 20 years until 43) do I thank my lucky stars. The last 11 years since that job finished has been semi employed , short term , not that good pay. I traded down to free up the money to subsidise my living . I know plenty of people that are doing similar , none of us show up on the unemployment figures.

I am so pleased to be in this position , the thought of scrapping around for work for another 11 years until my state pension at 66 is something I think would tip me over the edge. As for the young joining the work force now and having to wait until 68 for a state pension . I do not envy them at all. 

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Many have recently been laid off in the financial sector, their jobs not been replaced, firms downsizing and cost cutting......if found to be unemployed later in life, not easy to get permanent work, in fact not easy to get a job for life now at any age......and they call it progress.....life now has more ups and downs than ever before....just a case of when and what will be the next one....guaranteed.;)

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27 minutes ago, winkie said:

Thousands of people work hard every day but not for money.....are they unemployed?

Thousands are self-employed but earn little or show they earn nothing.....are they employed or unemployed or neither?;)

 

I do make a distinction between paid and unpaid work .  For me the former is stressful and serfdom and the latter is done under your own volition and has an element of freedom. Even work as an unpaid carer is preferable to paid work imo.

Everybody is different and some people probably relish paid work and consider anything else beneath them. I note Jezza Corbyn doesn't do his front postage stamp garden and appears to walk past litter in front of his house..something I couldn't do ever but seems married to his career.  

Edited by crashmonitor

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2 minutes ago, crashmonitor said:

I do make a distinction between paid and unpaid work .  For me the former is stressful and serfdom and the latter is done under your own volition and has an element of freedom. Even work as an unpaid carer is preferable to paid work imo.

Everybody is different and some people probably relish paid work and consider anything else beneath them. I note Jezza Corbyn doesn't do his front postage stamp garden and appears to walk past litter in front of his house..something I couldn't do ever.  Have dedication to the unpaid stuff but not the drive for paid work.

....most people want to feel valued and have a purpose, for some their value is measured by how much they are paid, a purpose is having a job to do.;)

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28 minutes ago, winkie said:

Thousands of people work hard every day but not for money.....are they unemployed?

Well I would say they are economically unemployed. 

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The figures are so manipulated you may as well ignore them. That goes for many 'official' data sets now.  

Regarding employment and unemployment, a good review here but it's a few months old. 

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1 minute ago, Insane said:

Well I would say they are economically unemployed. 

It should be acceptable to finish work early under self funding. Some people buy experiences and stuff with their wages, some people prefer to buy time. Probably not good for the Exchequer though.

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14 minutes ago, Giraffe said:

The figures are so manipulated you may as well ignore them. That goes for many 'official' data sets now.  

Regarding employment and unemployment, a good review here but it's a few months old. 

That article makes better sense....21.5% of all working people 16 to 64 are without jobs.....so out of the rest are they part-time or full-time?

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20 minutes ago, crashmonitor said:

It should be acceptable to finish work early under self funding. Some people buy experiences and stuff with their wages, some people prefer to buy time. Probably not good for the Exchequer though.

When I was younger I remember being told we will  be in the leisure age soon. Well that never happened . I also remember a lot of talk about bringing men's retirement and state pension down and in line with woman's at 60 . We all know what happened to that one.

At my last job there were 3 women born in 1955 who now have to work until they are 66 and work out that they have lost £48,000 in state pension . I don't need to add that they are not happy. 

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2 hours ago, zugzwang said:

It often occurs to me that the entire country retired circa 2004 and we've been living on benefits ever since.

You joke. I often say, when I pick up my kids, that it feels like Im the only only parent working full-time in the  private sector.

~50% of parents are PT/16h tax credits.

~30% are working in the publc sector.

I feel I need to go in and talk about being a minority - you know my dress and custom and stuff.

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13 minutes ago, rantnrave said:

That was my initial thought.

Yes. Employment down - EU Nationals leaving and not coming either.

Unemployment down - The same manipulated weasel figures proved to be a complete lie by the worst wage performance in hundreds of years.

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Do you want time or money.

Since work and money doesn't pay( it hasn't four the last 20years) then you might as well take the time.

Bear in mind this will change as genX age will be forced to work for rent or mortgage for 30\40 years to get a house 2,4kids and a paultry pension at 79.

In the 80s you could work hard for a few years own your own home for 30k.

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