Help to "Buy" (Sell) to be pumped up

[keeprenting]

https://www.ft.com/content/38549050-a52c-11e7-9e4f-7f5e6a7c98a2

Developers were already eyeing up some more HTB cash to boost their profits.

This shows exactly who the Tories are and it shows why more and more people are now willing to vote for a radical like Corbyn.

It's not just the Tories. Gordon Brown was worse. Any self-described "centrist" party would be doing the same or similar.

I could just about take HTB if it were restricted to FTB and combined with additional BTL taxes. Let's say 0.25% land value tax on BTL property, the proceeds of which go to fund HTB.

 

 

[Rhaegal]

2 hours ago, spyguy said:

Maybe Labour are toast too.

I still side with the people who thought that Corbyn would ruin the Labour party. He wiill.

He's popular as hes promising everything. He';s no offering anything novel - his playbook is pure Venezuela but without the Oil.

If I was a centrist Labour MP then Id walk. Not sure were Id walk to though.

I think Corbyn will say whatever he thinks the electorate will consider is 'nice' and is probably likely to act on some of these with a more of an accomodating perspective than any prime minister before him. However, overall I don't think this is a good thing. I don't think he's the man to make full-time work pay (versus the perverse situation where benefits / working tax-credits can make an unemployed person or part-time worker better off than a full time employee). It goes without saying that he will be weak on immigration, so we will get an accelerated version of what we have now where there is a race to the bottom for UK citizens that are non-skilled/semi-skilled. This further incentivises UK citizens and new arrivals to promptly seek out how to maximise their enrollment onto the benefits system, which rather than acting as a safety net (as it should be) rachets up as the best payer in town.

As I person I like him and he would be good to have a chat with him in the pub, but as the leader of the country he fills me with dread. Quality of life is the measure we should all be interested in and his outlook isn't going to be good for the country.

As for the conservatives, they wasted an opportunity to sort out the mess. With this latest reinforcement of help to buy they have lost the plot. At least pleased that they are not back-tracking on s24 and reducing the incentives for BTL.

Time to hit my head against a brick wall.

 

 

 

 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, spyguy said:

The BoE rules on mortgage lending.

Basically they stress test for 6% and ensure that the mortgage will not take more than ~30% of household income - after reapting expenses have been removed - cars, utils, travel cost etc.

I didnt realise it was max 30% after repeating bills taken off ... i thought it was 30% of take home. Do you have a link to the rules ... i tried googling to no avail.

[scb]

10 hours ago, UnconventionalWisdom said:

I agree with you to a certain extent- but a lot of people see the policy for what it is- direct funding for property developers. Surely it's the job of opposition MPs to educate the masses in the shortfalls of Government policy. Surely labour MPs can use facts and figures to show how help to buy has done the opposite of helping?!

You would hope but Labour want to extend Help to buy. It was in their latest manifesto and my local Labour MP supports it too. In short we're stuck with it, both parties want it and most people seem to think it's a good policy as it helps people buy houses. Just proving most people are a bit thick and can't see past it's name!

[Democorruptcy]

11 hours ago, Tempus said:

They're only freezing university fees so that they can throw debt on young people to prop up the teetering housing market.

Truly sickening.

The only answer is to vote Corbyn.

 

 

Why is Corbyn the answer? Their manifesto included an extension
 

Quote

 

The Labour Party has pledged to maintain the Help to Buy equity loan scheme until 2027 if it gets elected next month.

The Labour manifesto reads: “We will guarantee Help to Buy funding until 2027 to give long-term certainty to both first-time buyers and the housebuilding industry.”

https://www.mortgageintroducer.com/labour-guarantees-help-buy-2027/

 

 

[keeprenting]

Just now, Rhaegal said:

I think Corbyn will say whatever he thinks the electorate will consider is 'nice' and is probably likely to act on some of these with a more of an accomodating perspective than any prime minister before him. However, overall I don't think this is a good thing. I don't think he's the man to make full-time work pay (versus the perverse situation where benefits / working tax-credits can make an unemployed person or part-time worker better off than a full time employee). It goes without saying that he will be weak on immigration, so we will get an accelerated version of what we have now where there is a race to the bottom for UK citizens that are non-skilled/semi-skilled. This further incentivises UK citizens and new arrivals to promptly seek out how to maximise their enrollment onto the benefits system, which rather than acting as a safety net (as it should be) rachets up as the best payer in town.

As I person I like him and he would be good to have a chat with him in the pub, but as the leader of the country he fills me with dread. Quality of life is the measure we should all be interested in and his outlook isn't going to be good for the country.

As for the conservatives, they wasted an opportunity to sort out the mess. With this latest reinforcement of help to buy they have lost the plot. At least pleased that they are not back-tracking on s24 and reducing the incentives for BTL.

Time to hit my head against a brick wall.

 

I don't think Jezza would be good for the country either but if I were 21 I would vote for him out of self-interest. It is massively in the interests of the young for someone to do something radical to smash house prices. McDonnell's land value tax would do it. God knows, there have been enough policies doing the opposite. Voting Jezza could save them a fortune, paid for by the greedy boomers having their unearned, undeserved property gains confiscated.

May is delusional if she thinks that something like Help to Buy will win her votes from young people. Why would any young person vote for her (or for that matter any "centrist") when a radical Labour party will do so much more for them?

[Si1]

4 minutes ago, keeprenting said:

I don't think Jezza would be good for the country either but if I were 21 I would vote for him out of self-interest. It is massively in the interests of the young for someone to do something radical to smash house prices. McDonnell's land value tax would do it. God knows, there have been enough policies doing the opposite. Voting Jezza could save them a fortune, paid for by the greedy boomers having their unearned, undeserved property gains confiscated.

May is delusional if she thinks that something like Help to Buy will win her votes from young people. Why would any young person vote for her (or for that matter any "centrist") when a radical Labour party will do so much more for them?

It's the lvt part of the Labour manifesto?

[keeprenting]

1 minute ago, Si1 said:

It's the lvt part of the Labour manifesto?

I know McDonnell is a fan of LVT even if he didn't get it into the manifesto.

It's not just LVT, though. A Jezza/ McDonnell government would in my opinion cause house prices to tank horribly (even more than they're currently doing in London).

If you're a young person looking to buy a house, and your job would be secure under Jezza/ McDonnell, not voting for them would be a pretty stupid financial decision.

 

[“Nasty Piece of work”]

8 minutes ago, keeprenting said:

May is delusional if she thinks that something like Help to Buy will win her votes from young people. 

Her grasp on reality is only fleeting.  She is pretty hopeless, and makes Rees-Mogg look dynamic.

[MattW]

Come on, April Foolsday isn't for another 6 months. This is a joke. Isn't it??

B0ll0cks! Just as housing asking prices were gradually coming down as well.

What utter gits the Tories are.

[Rhaegal]

9 minutes ago, keeprenting said:

I know McDonnell is a fan of LVT even if he didn't get it into the manifesto.

It's not just LVT, though. A Jezza/ McDonnell government would in my opinion cause house prices to tank horribly (even more than they're currently doing in London).

If you're a young person looking to buy a house, and your job would be secure under Jezza/ McDonnell, not voting for them would be a pretty stupid financial decision.

 

I understand where you are coming from and from a 21-year olds standpoint Corbyn might look like a saviour. However, if he's going to be weak on benefits and immigration then any working young person is going to be competing with a larger pool of people that have been given an artificial leg up on them. Houses won't crash massively with this philosophy, albeit BTLs will probably get smashed hard (so just a faster path to doom than currently).

 

[Tempus]

 

[spyguy]

31 minutes ago, Grab_Some_Popcorn said:

I didnt realise it was max 30% after repeating bills taken off ... i thought it was 30% of take home. Do you have a link to the rules ... i tried googling to no avail.

I dont think theres hard rules. More a set of guidelines.

One is a bank cannot lend more than 15% of its mortgage book for LTI >4.5.

Some banks intret the rules stricter than others. Unsurpringly smaller banks are more lenient on rules. Ive heard but not seen that defsults are monitired by the BoE. If Coventry BS suddenly recorded that 5% of its high LTI had gone bad then it will BoE crawling all over ut.

I use hsbc as a benchmark. They are big, have money and are owned by ukgov.

To get a good, cheap mortgage you need 20%down, LTI under 3 times income. And they go through all bank and loan statements.

Jump those hoops and just can get a cheap mortgage.

[RomfordDon]

So what's the plan now? Wait and see how this plays out? I am not far of 40 ?

[frederico]

21 minutes ago, Freezer? Best place for it said:

Her grasp on reality is only fleeting.  She is pretty hopeless, and makes Rees-Mogg look dynamic.

Agreed , our politicians are way out of their depth on most issues now. Rees-Mogg is not the answer, Boris is not the answer, Corbyn is not the answer.

Eventually people are going to get upset, maybe. Just look at what is going on in Spain.

 

[spyguy]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4937076/PM-gambles-tuition-fee-U-turn-head-Tory-coup.html

Comments nail it - 250y Wow!

[frederico]

3 minutes ago, RomfordDon said:

So what's the plan now? Wait and see how this plays out? I am not far of 40 ?

I think this is terrible, I really cannot suggest anything really.

Maybe buy at auction if you can.

[BorrowToLeech]

3 hours ago, spyguy said:

Cons are slightly ahead of Lab in being in power.

The Cons run from 79-97 was cancelled out by Labs run 97-2010.

It is utterly astounding that the British Conservative party survived the transition to democracy at all, never mind holding actual power.  

That's the Tory genius - getting the masses to vote for the interests of the plutocratic aristocracy that had been keeping them impoverished and oppressed for centuries.

The homeowning democracy was a large part of that survival strategy.

Edited October 1, 2017 by DrBuyToLeech

[BorrowToLeech]

2 hours ago, nothernsoul said:

Unfortunately  the policy is popular, people see it as helping them get something they couldn't otherwise afford(which should be Britain's motto really).  It's a win win for the government, passiffying first time buyers, keeping the market moving while artificially propping up prices at the same time. 

Again, this isn't the point, it doesn't matter if the policy is popular.

It will still cost them votes.  It will stop people from becoming homeowners, even if people don't realise that, and non-homeowners don't, on average, vote Tory.

[longgone]

6 minutes ago, DrBuyToLeech said:

Again, this isn't the point, it doesn't matter if the policy is popular.

It will still cost them votes.  It will stop people from becoming homeowners, even if people don't realise that, and non-homeowners don't, on average, vote Tory.

10b is not that much though is it. is it really going to keep the dodgy system going.

[london_thirtythree]

Its pretty sickening listening to Tories boast how Help-to-Buy is one of their policies designed to help the housing crisis - almost anyone in the know is aware that this was drawn up to help the housing market post-crash in 2012 ('nice little housing boom' and all that), and as a handy backhander to the developers who have benefited massively from the scheme, and have in turn funded the Tory Party.

As an aspiring first time buyer, I know full well that it has hindered rather than helped me.

The Tories must be mad to think this is a vote winner when compared to Corbyn's populism.

[BorrowToLeech]

26 minutes ago, frederico said:

Agreed , our politicians are way out of their depth on most issues now. Rees-Mogg is not the answer, Boris is not the answer, Corbyn is not the answer.

Eventually people are going to get upset, maybe. Just look at what is going on in Spain.

 

I think Theresa May is determined to turn Britain into Venezuela.

It's classic Tory market manipulation and debt. 

And what happens if oil prices tank?

Sorry houses prices, I meant house prices.

 

[Guest]

41 minutes ago, RomfordDon said:

So what's the plan now? Wait and see how this plays out? I am not far of 40 ?

Stick with it... I'm 40... I don't think HTB will prevent the crash that is started. I won't buy until a house for life is available with mtg reps at 30% of our household take home. 

[mathschoc]

[nothernsoul]

A family on tax credits who utilised help to  buy will have the tax payer directly subsidising them going to work and buying a house. The rest of the house is subsidised by artificially cheap abundant debt, as is the car in the driveway. The conservatives did waste an opportunity to sort this out and doubled down instead, although to be honest I don't think Cameron would have won his second term if they had. 

10 billion is a lot because it removes the barrier for the banks ( the fact the new build is at least 20 percent overpriced and the borrower has insufficient deposit) to lend a further 45 billion cheaply into the system.