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On 19/08/2017 at 9:58 AM, spyguy said:

Have you been to the North? Or East Anglia? Or Wiltshire? Or anywhere outsuse of London SE?

Vast tracts of land are used fir farming, which require vast tax payer subs to be viable.

Kick out the farmers, remove subs.

Where do you mean by "the North"? There's very little of England that isn't how wotsthat described it. Some of Northumberland is about the only exception I can think of, and very welcome it is too if I'm travelling that way. In any case what do you mean to do with it if it's not getting covered in trees? Sure, it might be a bit better not being covered in dark, gloomy, regimented forest but stopping that won't mean it gets filled with houses (thankfully).

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On 19/08/2017 at 10:14 AM, wotsthat said:

Just got back from the far North West highlands, I know Suffolk very well have friends in Lavenham and Hadleigh and relative to the rest of the UK it is pretty under populated, I could take you to places only 45 miles from the hell that is the Mile end road into south cambs and you would not believe vast difference in how peacefull it is . But the fact is the UK does not even get any near to close to the size of the wilderness and land that you can still find in the States

Admittedly I've only been to Suffolk a couple of times but I can't say it felt particularly remote, empty, and unde populated (although you did say "reltative to the rest of the UK"). Average ordinary rural density which should be the norm for most of the country IMO. But then I've spent a lot of time in Cumbria, which I've never felt was remote and particularly sparse either.

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2 hours ago, Riedquat said:

Admittedly I've only been to Suffolk a couple of times but I can't say it felt particularly remote, empty, and unde populated (although you did say "reltative to the rest of the UK"). Average ordinary rural density which should be the norm for most of the country IMO. But then I've spent a lot of time in Cumbria, which I've never felt was remote and particularly sparse either.

If you head towards the north part of Suffolk then it feels very remote. The crap roads make it so, as anyone who has driven on the A12 or A140 will attest.

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7 hours ago, ExiledMatty said:

If you head towards the north part of Suffolk then it feels very remote. The crap roads make it so, as anyone who has driven on the A12 or A140 will attest.

When you say "crap" do you simply mean not deathly dull (the only time I've headed that way was along the A14, which fits the "deathly dull" label)? Sounds good. On the other hand if it means nose to tail with cars and full of potholes, not so much. I'm quite happy with slow but not dull journeys, much prefer them to fast and boring and quite often pick slower non-motorway routes these days, they're rather less tiring even if they take longer (still need to avoid cities though, slogging through miles of traffic lights isn't any fun).

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10 minutes ago, Riedquat said:

When you say "crap" do you simply mean not deathly dull (the only time I've headed that way was along the A14, which fits the "deathly dull" label)? Sounds good. On the other hand if it means nose to tail with cars and full of potholes, not so much. I'm quite happy with slow but not dull journeys, much prefer them to fast and boring and quite often pick slower non-motorway routes these days, they're rather less tiring even if they take longer (still need to avoid cities though, slogging through miles of traffic lights isn't any fun).

You are like me Riedquat, I am never in a rush to get anywhere, I still love driving. I usually have  a few hours driving most days in the Cambridge area, I take the back/slow roads armed with a coffee and put the radio,  I see it as a good start to the day mostly. I remember when I used to drive into the Highlands after pssing Glasgow, the journey was as long as the trip up North in itself, I am actually p****ed off that it is now far easier to get into the heart of the Highlands, I preferd it being more difficult.

A lot of people talk about the "crap" links such as rail and road  into Suffolk once you go past Newmarket, which in my view makes it more attractive. You are right, the A14 goes though the centre and the A12 is the link to London on the east side, but that's it, and once you get past Newmarket the A14 is quite a good road.

A lot of people regard Suffolk as an unspoken little gem, people I know would actually be quite annoyed with me for talking about it on here. I once considered moving to the long Melford/ Lavenham area, countryside is so nice and quite, for the UK anyway.  A few years back I remember driving home from the east side of Sudbury and Boxford area on the back roads, it felt like there was nothing about, no light pollution and large distances between villages and hamlets, it was just hard to believe you was only 70 ish miles from London.

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12 minutes ago, wotsthat said:

You are like me Riedquat, I am never in a rush to get anywhere, I still love driving. I usually have  a few hours driving most days in the Cambridge area, I take the back/slow roads armed with a coffee and put the radio,  I see it as a good start to the day mostly. I remember when I used to drive into the Highlands after pssing Glasgow, the journey was as long as the trip up North in itself, I am actually p****ed off that it is now far easier to get into the heart of the Highlands, I preferd it being more difficult.

I know what you mean. I've just got back from there, and made the mistake of going via the motorways (since I was doing the whole journey in one go). On the way up I stopped overnight with relatives in Edinbugh, and had stuck "no motorways" in my satnav. Although it's a bit out of date and didn't realise some of the A1 is now motorway, not that the dual carriageway was much fun either, it was great, slogging around Bradford aside. Darlington to Edinburgh via 100-odd miles of single carriageway road, not much around, and not much traffic, and the road being neither too straight and dull (like the A9 was the next day) or fiddly and windy, wasn't anywhere near as tiring and left me feeling I'd actually travelled somewhere. There are some more regular (albeit shorter) journeys where I do something similar far more often than not.

Edited by Riedquat

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23 hours ago, Arpeggio said:

Here's 2 of several answers to your question if asked 10 years ago:

Click on "Charts & Performance". https://www.charles-stanley-direct.co.uk/ViewFund?Sedol=0745088

Click on "Charts & Performance". https://www.charles-stanley-direct.co.uk/ViewFund?Sedol=B4TZHH9&Isin=GB00B4TZHH95

Sold instantly in a few clicks and you're done.

vs Selling a house, finding a buyer, haggling, advertising, fees, etc.

This asset class would be classed as part of your net wealth from a government/benefits perspective - I assume housing is not (providing you declare rental income)?

Additionally, if it goes belly up (and some on this forum are saying it will) the housing asset class provides you will a tangible roof over you head?

Also assume bank/governments lend via the well trodden path of mortgages for property assets - but don't do the same for funds or other investments - for a reason.

Am not pro-housing investment, just curious why if the QE money has indirectly found its way into property as opposed to those funds - or have they ballooned equally?

 

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9 minutes ago, wotsthat said:

You are like me Riedquat, I am never in a rush to get anywhere, I still love driving. I usually have  a few hours driving most days in the Cambridge area, I take the back/slow roads armed with a coffee and put the radio,  I see it as a good start to the day mostly. I remember when I used to drive into the Highlands after pssing Glasgow, the journey was as long as the trip up North in itself, I am actually p****ed off that it is now far easier to get into the heart of the Highlands, I preferd it being more difficult.

A lot of people talk about the "crap" links such as rail and road  into Suffolk once you go past Newmarket, which in my view makes it more attractive. You are right, the A14 goes though the centre and the A12 is the link to London on the east side, but that's it, and once you get past Newmarket the A14 is quite a good road.

A lot of people regard Suffolk as an unspoken little gem, people I know would actually be quite annoyed with me for talking about it on here. I once considered moving to the long Melford/ Lavenham area, countryside is so nice and quite, for the UK anyway.  A few years back I remember driving home from the east side of Sudbury and Boxford area on the back roads, it felt like there was nothing about, no light pollution and large distances between villages and hamlets, it was just hard to believe you was only 70 ish miles from London.

First visited Suffolk about 10 yrs ago, partly on the trail of great grandparents who came from near Lavenham. 

It was like going back decades, quiet roads, unspoilt, and the Lavenham I'd only seen in 1920s B&W photos of my father's looked much the same. 

After hunting for old graves in a churchyard near Lavenham I wanted to look inside the church.  A local woman who'd been doing the flowers or some such, said she was just locking up but gave us a colossal  old iron key and pointed out her house nearby - 'Just leave it in the porch when you've finished.'  

It was like going back to some long-gone era - I half expected to see Miss Marple pottering about before the sleepy place was thrown into turmoil after old Major Blenkinsop was found in his study, skewered with one of his own antique Indian swords. 

 

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8 minutes ago, Mrs Bear said:

First visited Suffolk about 10 yrs ago, partly on the trail of great grandparents who came from near Lavenham. 

It was like going back decades, quiet roads, unspoilt, and the Lavenham I'd only seen in 1920s B&W photos of my father's looked much the same. 

After hunting for old graves in a churchyard near Lavenham I wanted to look inside the church.  A local woman who'd been doing the flowers or some such, said she was just locking up but gave us a colossal  old iron key and pointed out her house nearby - 'Just leave it in the porch when you've finished.'  

It was like going back to some long-gone era - I half expected to see Miss Marple pottering about before the sleepy place was thrown into turmoil after old Major Blenkinsop was found in his study, skewered with one of his own antique Indian swords. 

 

I will also suggest the coast around Southwold, it's how a seaside town should look without all the tacky amusement arcades, it's like something out of Dads Army, there are a few other seaside reorts close by as well that are  quite charming, then you have Framlingham slightly inland.

You will find that a lot of famous people live in Suffolk and keep it quite, there is somehing of the Olde England about it.. Gawd! I am starting to have second thoughts about moving there again :)

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42 minutes ago, advicewelcome said:

This asset class would be classed as part of your net wealth from a government/benefits perspective - I assume housing is not (providing you declare rental income)?

Additionally, if it goes belly up (and some on this forum are saying it will) the housing asset class provides you will a tangible roof over you head?

Also assume bank/governments lend via the well trodden path of mortgages for property assets - but don't do the same for funds or other investments - for a reason.

Am not pro-housing investment, just curious why if the QE money has indirectly found its way into property as opposed to those funds - or have they ballooned equally?

I'm not pro-housing investment either. IMHO a large the reason for such enthusiasm for HPI is that it's the adult version of a school where the average kids want good grades too. It's such an easy sell. Not many want to dip their toe into all that scary Stocks and Shares stuff.

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On 19/08/2017 at 6:37 PM, nnails said:

Yep. If you think you going to lose you job. Make sure you don't have more than 6k in the bank. As they can see that. I knew my job was in danger for six months before so I saved for rainy day just not in the bank. 

If you do have more than 6k in bank make sure each month you take a sum out each month to live on. Just pretend you spent it. After six months you go on means tested. No money means you can claim.

If you want to claim council tax make sure you have empty bank account and you claim 75 reduction on council tax straight away.

what if your entitled to substantial redundancy though? Then they will know and get your money anyway!

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On 8/19/2017 at 9:20 AM, Venger said:

That's your point of view, as a house-buyer of about 2 years ago.

I disagree about money not being safe in banks, and not going to listen to any homeowner about that, for it often seems their REAL VI is to try and worry renter-savers, to ry and get everyone else to buy into the bubble, and support the value of their own home.

HPC.

There are other assets which are not in the bank, are not fiat, and are easily hidden and movable ;)

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18 minutes ago, Arpeggio said:

I'm not pro-housing investment either. IMHO a large the reason for such enthusiasm for HPI is that it's the adult version of a school where the average kids want good grades too. It's such an easy sell. Not many want to dip their toe into all that scary Stocks and Shares stuff.

I don't get why people like HPI.

I bought my house two years ago, and its worth more than I paid (I think). But how does that help me? I have no plans to sell and realise any profit because I bought it so I would have somewhere of my own to live. I have heard of "equity release", but it seems pretty risky to me so I would never consider it. I don't know of any home owners who have so is it even common? In fact I would welcome it dropping in value, because as long as the whole ladder does so it will be cheaper to upgrade to a large house later on in life!

 

 

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1 hour ago, wotsthat said:

I will also suggest the coast around Southwold, it's how a seaside town should look without all the tacky amusement arcades, it's like something out of Dads Army, there are a few other seaside reorts close by as well that are  quite charming, then you have Framlingham slightly inland.

You will find that a lot of famous people live in Suffolk and keep it quite, there is somehing of the Olde England about it.. Gawd! I am starting to have second thoughts about moving there again :)

We did in fact go to Southwold - very attractive - and had thoughts about staying overnight, but it was a spring bank hol and everywhere was booked solid.  Tried several other places nearby, same story, nearly decided to head for home instead but finally found a pub with rooms  at Walberswick.   Not the first time we've just taken off without booking anything - prefer to see where we fancy - not a good idea during bank hols though!  

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30 minutes ago, Locke said:

There are other assets which are not in the bank, are not fiat, and are easily hidden and movable ;)

Subject to value change.  Have to be sold/exchanged back to fiat.  

And if it's to hide assets so one can claim the sweet SMI.../benefits in event of job loss etc... well that's up to you.   I don't think that way, no matter if it costs me.   Although I can understand it... and it has given some people the advantage (vs renting).

That's one of the reasons things are so bad IMO... people putting self above everything, willing to play the system to the max, imo (including those who do award themselves too much pay for their work... in cushy positions... like that woman on salary of £350,000  + £100K spent on improving a free home given by her employer).

I take my position with what little money I have saved over the years (which is substantial vs general income) but doesn't go that far toward buying a house at these prices.

It's the homeowners/BTLers who should be doing the worrying about the hyperinflated values of the houses they glory are worth £fortunes to the penny (also expecting more HPI) - savers are safe imo.   Savers supposed to be stressed out for a few £10Ks in the bank vs these house prices?  Not me.

Banks are flooded with money vs previous years (although recent reports of new US fines/lawsuits, in the $multi-billions.. something about Libor... against UK banks have concerned me a little).

Quote

 

Daily Mail

Average UK house price to hit £780,000 by 2040, says leading think tank

Kilo Charlie, My World, 9 hours ago

We purchased a property in 1983 for £72,000.........today it's worth £650,000 plus. It's certainly possible and quite likely.

Sam, Bucks, 3 hours ago

Bought house in ,74 for 16k added extention about £8k now valued at £480k you do the maths?

 

 

Quote

He already has £38,000 a year from a final salary National Grid pension he's been drawing since he was 50. He has an annuity worth £5,600 a year, paid by Canada Life, plus his basic state pension, giving him pension income of £52,000 a year.  John is in a very comfortable position. But like many others who have not been super-high earners in the past, but who have very generous pension arrangements, he probably has not worried about the pension lifetime allowance (LTA).  The good news is that John is probably just under this year's and next year's allowance of £1.25m.

His wife, Valerie, is named as the surviving spouse on his final-salary scheme, and she has a modest pension from her previous job at Santander.
The couple would like to go on long-haul trips to Australia and China. They own a home worth £650,000 and are mortgage-free.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/special-reports/11524230/Tax-bombshell-for-66-year-old-about-to-retire-with-a-50000-a-year-pension.html

--

Quote

Bernard is a semi-retired financial adviser who lives in Hatch End, Middlesex, with wife, Mary. At 69, he sees the pot he has built up as an important part of his family’s future and plans to pass on as much as he can.

His home is worth around £1.6m, his pension pot £1.8m and he has put aside around £750,000 in other savings and investments.

“ I want my grandchildren, and my great grand-children, to have the best chance.”

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/investing/shares/12138512/We-put-500000-into-Aim-shares-to-avoid-inheritance-tax.html

 

May your AIM IHT tax-planning fail and crash, and you regret not selling up/cashing in on the £1.6m value of house in this bubble in future... although they're not too bad looking after an even older relative I suppose.   It's just the BOMAD/Long wave HPI / what your parents did/can do for you economy that I push back against. 

Edited by Venger

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2 hours ago, Mrs Bear said:

First visited Suffolk about 10 yrs ago, partly on the trail of great grandparents who came from near Lavenham. 

It was like going back decades, quiet roads, unspoilt, and the Lavenham I'd only seen in 1920s B&W photos of my father's looked much the same. 

After hunting for old graves in a churchyard near Lavenham I wanted to look inside the church.  A local woman who'd been doing the flowers or some such, said she was just locking up but gave us a colossal  old iron key and pointed out her house nearby - 'Just leave it in the porch when you've finished.'  

It was like going back to some long-gone era - I half expected to see Miss Marple pottering about before the sleepy place was thrown into turmoil after old Major Blenkinsop was found in his study, skewered with one of his own antique Indian swords. 

Sounds terrible, quick, it needs modernising now - as it is it sounds like it's suffering horribly from having terrible things like "character" and "identity" and "people who actually talk to each other", can't have that old-fashioned nonsense, it needs to move into the 21st century. Slap up wind turbines all over it, a load of identikit housing estates and a lot of large tin sheds, bulldoze some motorways and electric railways through it so people can whizz around faster in depressing ugliness and monotony, and thus "enjoy" proper 21st century England. It'll all then be fast and efficient and who cares if it no longer becomes worth living in? We should all be too busy to notice anyway, taking pleasure in your surroundings and not wanting to run around all the time like a headless chicken is something for luddites.

Edited by Riedquat

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45 minutes ago, Venger said:

Subject to value change.  Have to be sold/exchanged back to fiat.  

Well, so is housing. Paper gains are just that, until you them for something of actual value.

MY point being that housing is far from the only option your average pleb has to protect their wealth from the govern-bank.

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48 minutes ago, Venger said:

 

That's one of the reasons things are so bad IMO... people putting self above everything, willing to play the system to the max, imo

 

--

 

May your AIM IHT tax-planning fail and crash, and you regret not selling up/cashing in on the £1.6m value of house in this bubble in future... although they're not too bad looking after an even older relative I suppose.   It's just the BOMAD/Long wave HPI / what your parents did/can do for you economy that I push back against. 

 

I read that post about gaming the system so you can get benefits despite clearly having your own money to survive on. 

I am pretty disgusted at such people/posts and are indicative of the real problem with the UK.

The only fair system is no system at all.

 

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3 hours ago, MancTom said:

I don't get why people like HPI.

I bought my house two years ago, and its worth more than I paid (I think). But how does that help me? I have no plans to sell and realise any profit because I bought it so I would have somewhere of my own to live. I have heard of "equity release", but it seems pretty risky to me so I would never consider it. I don't know of any home owners who have so is it even common? In fact I would welcome it dropping in value, because as long as the whole ladder does so it will be cheaper to upgrade to a large house later on in life!

 

 

You don't have to sell or go for equity release to realise gains from HPI, though, depending on your situation

 

I live in an area of ridiculous HPI in recent years, and bought 3 years ago. When I remortgaged last September, the mortgage provider revalued our house due to HPI, and we went from 10% equity to 35%, with a decent drop in interest rate due to the lower LTV. We now overpay by £350 a month just by paying the same monthly payment we always have, and by the time our 2 year fix is up we'll have shaved a year of the time it takes to pay off the mortgage, and probably gone up to over 40% equity, lowering our interest rate band down again.

Obviously you can't rely on interest rates being as low as they currently are, and as always with mortgage rates, there's a certain amount of hedging in how long you fix for/whether you go for a tracker when it comes to interest rates and moving down the LTV bands, but the fact is that our house going up in value will save us £8k over 2 years in interest payments. I'll also carry on saving money in the long run, theoretically until my standard repayment would have taken me down to 60% LTV if HPI was flat.

 

 

There's the argument that I would have saved more money than that if I'd have just paid £100k less for my house in the first place, but this is where we are and there's not really much use in gnashing your teeth over it.

There is also the fact that the level of HPI around here means that, 3 years later, I wouldn't be able to afford my house now. On the one hand I'll get to pay my mortgage off 6-7 years earlier than planned, on the other, it's increasingly difficult to afford to buy. But although I'm benefitting from that, I'm not contributing to the problem, either.

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4 hours ago, Mrs Bear said:

We did in fact go to Southwold - very attractive - and had thoughts about staying overnight, but it was a spring bank hol and everywhere was booked solid.  Tried several other places nearby, same story, nearly decided to head for home instead but finally found a pub with rooms  at Walberswick.   Not the first time we've just taken off without booking anything - prefer to see where we fancy - not a good idea during bank hols though!  

Do what I am doing, have a small camper built :), you will be amazed how cosy you can get them. There are loads of places to pitch for £10 to £15 or sometimes even less, shower on site and electricity and quite often quite scenic. And if you get really stuck and cannot find anywhere, just stop driving and get in the back and live off grid slightly. And I am not a great lover of so many hotels, even expensive 4 star. plus ones, I just find so many of them money grabbing and souless.

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3 minutes ago, wotsthat said:

Do what I am doing, have a small camper built :), you will be amazed how cosy you can get them. There are loads of places to pitch for £10 to £15 or sometimes even less, shower on site and electricity and quite often quite scenic. And if you get really stuck and cannot find anywhere, just stop driving and get in the back and live off grid slightly. And I am not a great lover of so many hotels, even expensive 4 star. plus ones, I just find so many of them money grabbing and souless.

Alas, we'd have nowhere to park it.  Parking around here is always tight, and getting worse. 

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2 hours ago, MuTron1 said:

You don't have to sell or go for equity release to realise gains from HPI, though, depending on your situation

 

I live in an area of ridiculous HPI in recent years, and bought 3 years ago. When I remortgaged last September, the mortgage provider revalued our house due to HPI, and we went from 10% equity to 35%, with a decent drop in interest rate due to the lower LTV. We now overpay by £350 a month just by paying the same monthly payment we always have, and by the time our 2 year fix is up we'll have shaved a year of the time it takes to pay off the mortgage, and probably gone up to over 40% equity, lowering our interest rate band down again.

Obviously you can't rely on interest rates being as low as they currently are, and as always with mortgage rates, there's a certain amount of hedging in how long you fix for/whether you go for a tracker when it comes to interest rates and moving down the LTV bands, but the fact is that our house going up in value will save us £8k over 2 years in interest payments. I'll also carry on saving money in the long run, theoretically until my standard repayment would have taken me down to 60% LTV if HPI was flat.

 

 

There's the argument that I would have saved more money than that if I'd have just paid £100k less for my house in the first place, but this is where we are and there's not really much use in gnashing your teeth over it.

There is also the fact that the level of HPI around here means that, 3 years later, I wouldn't be able to afford my house now. On the one hand I'll get to pay my mortgage off 6-7 years earlier than planned, on the other, it's increasingly difficult to afford to buy. But although I'm benefitting from that, I'm not contributing to the problem, either.

It is crazy. Owning house for two years. Means two years no rent and house price gone up to. 

We sort of had no choice but to look after our family and it was best way

Maybe the government should make it illegal to own two homes. Only non profit housing associations are allowed 

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19 hours ago, Riedquat said:

Where do you mean by "the North"? There's very little of England that isn't how wotsthat described it. Some of Northumberland is about the only exception I can think of, and very welcome it is too if I'm travelling that way. In any case what do you mean to do with it if it's not getting covered in trees? Sure, it might be a bit better not being covered in dark, gloomy, regimented forest but stopping that won't mean it gets filled with houses (thankfully).

S Yorks and North.

Nothing wrong with forest and scrub. Bring back wolves.

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5 hours ago, MuTron1 said:

but the fact is that our house going up in value will save us £8k over 2 years in interest payments. I'll also carry on saving money in the long run, theoretically until my standard repayment would have taken me down to 60% LTV if HPI was flat.

If it goes up in value and if HPI is flat as opposed to HPC

 

5 hours ago, MuTron1 said:

There is also the fact that the level of HPI around here means that, 3 years later, I wouldn't be able to afford my house now.

I wonder what your employer would do in such a situation when looking to hire? Increase wages so they are paying more than average for the same skills, look out of town and supplement travel costs, employ someone to work over internet (if possible), or just move elsewhere?

Edited by Arpeggio

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  • 276 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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