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brainclamp

Pensions And Council Tax

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you beat me to it.

Holly Sh1t! A quarter of our income tax goes to pay the public sector pensions.

And 26% of your council tax goes towards public sector pensions.

Edited by Sine270

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Guest magnoliawalls

you beat me to it.

Holly Sh1t! A quarter of our income tax goes to pay the public sector pensions.

And 26% of your council tax goes towards public sector pensions.

:o !!!!

I hear that when public sector workers who enjoy their jobs reach retirement age but want to stay on, they have an interview every year to decide whether they get to keep their jobs.

I heard this from a geezer who works for a museum, lots of folk there work for peanuts because they love what they do. He claimed the whole process was designed to pressure them to retire.

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That was one of the most one sided programs I've ever seen.

I loved how the presenter harped on about the govt. breaking promises regarding changing the age of retirement for exising public sector workers.

However, he failed to mention than in doing the u-turn the govt. kept their word to 3 million people, who had been promised (from the day they started working in the public sector), that they would retire at 60.

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What I hate most about this is some Labourite saying "no, no... everything is fine!"

He seemed like the sort of bloke who would loudly declare that black is white if he was told to.

His claim that caving in on the retirement age for 3m public sector workers wouldn't cost any more money was laughable.

The presenter's reply was good though.

"Everything I know about economics, and even common sense tell me that's rubbish."

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:o !!!!

I hear that when public sector workers who enjoy their jobs reach retirement age but want to stay on, they have an interview every year to decide whether they get to keep their jobs.

I heard this from a geezer who works for a museum, lots of folk there work for peanuts because they love what they do. He claimed the whole process was designed to pressure them to retire.

they do that because older/more experienced workers are usually at the top of their salary scale and if they can get rid of them it means they can bring someone in at the bottom of the salary scale.

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That guy from Standard and Poor said that British debt could be reduced to junk if this continues.

It was stated that pension costs are to rise considerably and this will probably be done by raising council tax further.

Edited by Sine270

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"Our findings suggest that millions of UK homeowners will find it difficult to fund retirement in the traditional manner with a pension," said Ali Crossley, director of lifetime mortgages at Prudential.

"It will prove especially difficult for first-time buyers who are pushing thirty who have not yet started saving into a pension. They are likely to find that the burden of debt from education and the impact of large mortgages will take up a lot of their income and prevent them from saving."

The average age of a first-time buyer has now risen to 34. Almost one in four of these will not have cleared their mortgage before they are 60, Prudential points out.

Currently close to six million UK mortgage holders do not have a pension.

ccecag31big.jpg

One issue: The public sector.

It has been calculated that the wages of the public sector are already 17% higher than that of private sector workers, and thats without the generoius pensions factored in.

Currently, the national debt is offically 40% of GDP without public sector pensions.

When they are added, as they should be, you get a figure of about 90%-100% of GDP! That is a figure in the trillions. These are reasonable projections, not alarmist, and are real future payments - In todays money that means £11,000 for every man woman and child to provide this burden, or about £26,000 from each worker in the workforce.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml.../18/ntaxx18.xml

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/main.jhtm.../01/ixcoms.html

Most people do not have any reasonable chance of meaningfully saving for a pension and trying to service a mortgage or rent what is now, overall, the most expensive valued living accomodation on the planet. Since the pension tax raids by Mr Brown, the savings ratio has fallen by half

Any lending slowdown will slow the rate of GDP growth or make it go negative. This will mean government will have to raise taxes immediately to meet these and other government liabilities, and this will further compound the slowdown in the private sector.

The Skipton Building Soceity estimates that we could easily see lending/debt reach 1.6 trillion within a decade.

http://www.skipton.co.uk/publicity_campaig...in_a_decade.asp

This would mean houseprices rising higher as more tax breaks and government policy kicks in - roughly the rate of HPI would rise at about a 5% per year rate.

I believe in what I see around me, and the massive rise in immigration has been largely unskilled, with chaining and importation of family memebers, with plenty of people unable to speak english, or who have any level of education, forming thier own mini-communties and claiming the full benifits from the state, this is obvoiusly been great for BTLers, however I just cannot see how it is not a large liability to be met through tax!

Such is the burden of taxation, I firmly believe that ID cards will be introduced by fair means or fowl as thier capacity for imposing inescapable taxes and implementing a centrally controlled society is total and inescapable.

The prospects from the rating agency on government debt was very alarming - even with gradual reform its very probable that UK government debt will be downgraded to junk. We will then be in a simalar situation to countries like Egypt, Ukrane etc...

The pitiful state pension - you have to work till 67 to be granted that 'gruel'. Money from these collapsed private pension schemes didn't just vanish - it went into the hands of telewest bosses and inept greedy managers who pumped up thier share prices with falsehoods from economic reality.

I see that thanks to the houseprice boom much of the inempt management in these companies is still there!

Edited by brainclamp

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they do that because older/more experienced workers are usually at the top of their salary scale and if they can get rid of them it means they can bring someone in at the bottom of the salary scale.

Surely that is a false economy - if they bring someone new new in, they also have to pay a pension to the retiree! No doubt some other area of govt. pays the pension, so they don't care about this.

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1. The Country cannot keep paying for all these Public Sector workers let alone their pensions.

2. Private Sector workers are now realising that they are mugs as, effectively, they are not only being taxed to pay for the 'luxury' of Public Sector workers but also their pensions, sick pay, etc, etc, whilst their own pensions have disappeared and their salaries are being taxed to the hilt.

Nothing against Doctors and Nurses, good Teachers, Social Workers but am totally opposed to the millions of paper shufflers and Medics, Dentists, etc, who make a fortune from private practice.

3. You may as well go get a job in the Public Sector these days.

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Guest Cletus VanDamme

3. You may as well go get a job in the Public Sector these days.

I'm just about to leave working in the public sector. It's a cushy job, but I could no longer stand the tedium.

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1. The Country cannot keep paying for all these Public Sector workers let alone their pensions.

Don't worry, more and more of it's being privatised.

2. Private Sector workers are now realising that they are mugs as, effectively, they are not only being taxed to pay for the 'luxury' of Public Sector workers but also their pensions, sick pay, etc, etc, whilst their own pensions have disappeared and their salaries are being taxed to the hilt.

Oh that's right, luxuries like company cars, private medical schemes, annual bonuses and share options. Oh right, you mean luxuries like a pension, for foregoing the opportunity to have all of these by working in the public sector.

Nothing against Doctors and Nurses, good Teachers, Social Workers but am totally opposed to the millions of paper shufflers and Medics, Dentists, etc, who make a fortune from private practice.

Agreed

3. You may as well go get a job in the Public Sector these days.

I often hear people bitching about the public sector. If its so great why don't more people go and work there?

I graduated over ten years ago and work in the public sector because I want to. All my mates who graduated with me, work in the private sector on far higher (some as much as multiples of 5) salaries than me. I don't begrudge them their salaries or their perks. But i would like to keep the one perk that i do have, which is a final salary pension scheme which lets me retire at 60, which was part of the contract of employment i was offered and accepted ten years ago.

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Nothing against Doctors and Nurses, good Teachers, Social Workers but am totally opposed to the millions of paper shufflers and Medics, Dentists, etc, who make a fortune from private practice.

Would you care to explain why you are opposed to Doctors earning money from private practice? They do it in their own time, on top of their NHS hours.

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1. The Country cannot keep paying for all these Public Sector workers let alone their pensions.

2. Private Sector workers are now realising that they are mugs as, effectively, they are not only being taxed to pay for the 'luxury' of Public Sector workers but also their pensions, sick pay, etc, etc, whilst their own pensions have disappeared and their salaries are being taxed to the hilt.

Nothing against Doctors and Nurses, good Teachers, Social Workers but am totally opposed to the millions of paper shufflers and Medics, Dentists, etc, who make a fortune from private practice.

3. You may as well go get a job in the Public Sector these days.

A slowdown ahead? The UK yield curve has inverted - not to a great degree but enough to signal a slowdown in some credit channels with reasonable probabiltity.

Hmmm... What happens to the private sector, if real inflation (including council, stealth taxes) reduces real disposable income, and unemployment carries on rising?

Taxes will rise FURTHER.

What if private people are also increasingly hit by all the funny money bring printed by the BOE?

I have noticed how well my shares have been doing in line with all the funny money, and, with one eye on the inverted UK yield curve, I intend to wait about 6 more weeks and then start cashing in the gains and spending them on more stuff not made in the UK.

This time in impressive looking capital goods. I have not bothered with upgrading my car in years. My new motto is to never buy British while this HPI situation continues (I forecast HPI will rise by 8% this year).

Edited by brainclamp

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That was one of the most one sided programs I've ever seen.

Exactly what I thought.

What everyone fails to mention is the massive obscene profits of these corporations who didnt honour the pension deals that they encouraged private sector workers into and the workers who did nothing to stop

themselves being mugged. And who now want to pass on the cost of their complacency to workers in the public sector. This programme was one big PR exercise to take the heat away from the people who took the private sector pension money and onto the public sector scapegoats.

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you beat me to it.

Holly Sh1t! A quarter of our income tax goes to pay the public sector pensions.

And 26% of your council tax goes towards public sector pensions.

So. A quarter of my income tax goes to pay the public sector pensions. However I can only afford to save a fifth of my salary to my pension. I am therefore contributing more to someone else’s pension than my own.

I am beginning to think a pension is a con. The next big "mis-selling". Why you ask? A: I have no control over what happens to the pension pot in the >30 years left before I retire. Meanwhile Gordon Brown, all the governments and public sector workers are one way or another going to rob it until it becomes worthless.

I know what you are about Gordon Brown. :ph34r:

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A grim future by 2024? Under Brown, its already happened!

NEW FINANCIAL ERA CAUSES BRITONS TO PUT THE BRAKES ON TRADITION

By 2024, first time buyers will be in their mid-thirties, middle-aged parents with young children will be the norm and most of us will work until we are 70 as education debt, pension under-funding and the savings shortfall totally redefines our financial lives.

According to analysis by Skipton Building Society in its ‘Financing Your Future’ report, in 10 years time, the average student will need to save around £70,000 to pay off debts and put down a deposit on a home. For those who pursue longer courses, such as medical students, the ‘debt-deposit mountain’1 could possibly reach £100,000 or more.

This in turn will have an impact on the average age of first time buyers, which is set to rise well above 35 over the next 20 years, compared to the current average age of just above 33.

The report states that the ages at which fundamental life experiences currently take place, such as giving birth and stopping work, will shift dramatically. Most notably, over the next 10 years the average age that women will have their first child will continue to rise to well above 30 years of age, alongside a gradual decline in birth rates.

As a consequence, many 21st century adults will have dependent children at an age when previous generations of parents would have been enjoying an empty nest. This will have a knock on effect on savings, with middle-aged mums and dads only freed from the financial shackles of their offspring once they reach their 50s. This in turn will trigger a frantic savings dash as they try to put by enough savings for a healthy retirement.

A triple whammy for late-starting parents will be the cost of having dependent children, plus the substantial financing of their children’s education – as top-up fees and increased living costs will force parental contributions higher than their current estimate of £500 million per annum – followed by the cost of helping them onto the housing ladder.

Pension under-funding will also have an impact. Recent figures identify that around three million people are seriously under-providing for their later years, leaving many Britons with no choice other than to work, either full or part-time, well beyond the current retirement age.

The next two decades will see a rise in people buying bigger and better houses than they can afford, exploiting long term growth in the housing market to build up substantial tax-free housing equity, then trading down on retirement to release money for pension income.

Jennifer Holloway, head of media relations at Skipton Building Society, said: “The diary of a financial life paints a very graphic picture of a changing society over the next 20 years. No longer will we leave home in our teens, marry and have children in our twenties, empty-nest in our forties and retire in our early sixties like previous generations. Instead we will witness huge shifts in traditional life cycles. The clear message coming out of the report is the need to plan now for the radically different financial world around the corner.”

Ends

Editor’s Notes

1 ‘The debt-deposit-mountain refers to future first time buyers needing to climb a financial mountain if they wish to pay off their student debts and put down a deposit for a property.

Methodology: The research was undertaken by worldtocom.com futures network on behalf of Skipton Building Society in March/April 2004.

The Skipton Building Society report maps the diary of a financial life in two decades time, highlighting its fiscal risks and dangers, in which we can see

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I forecast HPI will rise by 8% this year.

Why aren't you buying property then? You should be cashing in your shares and buying a house, whatever you can afford. You stand to make a lot of money if your beliefs are correct.

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However, he failed to mention than in doing the u-turn the govt. kept their word to 3 million people, who had been promised (from the day they started working in the public sector), that they would retire at 60.

Who makes these promises? I thought we were supposed to be democracy. I never agreed to work till 80 so that some feckless public servant can retire on an index linked salary at 55.

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Who makes these promises? I thought we were supposed to be democracy. I never agreed to work till 80 so that some feckless public servant can retire on an index linked salary at 55.

In the private sector there are plenty of companies with final salary pension schemes - but its seen as part of the contract of employment that you accrue, say, 1/60 final salary each year. Therefore the employer may change terms of employment (eg Rentokil) to amend the pension entitlement. No reason why the same shouldn't be done with the public sector.

As Elizabeth has stated it would be wrong to remove benefits already earned, but I cant see any reason not to reduce the value of benefits being earned going forwards. My belief is that ther public sector should not give defined retirement benefits at all given the uncertain nature of the costs, but offer employer contributions to employees own pension schemes.

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Who makes these promises? I thought we were supposed to be democracy. I never agreed to work till 80 so that some feckless public servant can retire on an index linked salary at 55.

My employer, the state made the promise to me. Its called a contract of employment.

The fact that you might work until your 80, has little to do with whether a public sector worker will retire at 60 (not 55), and more to do with the greed of the private sector Directors who are unwilling to meet their commitments to their workers.

Of course you could always get a job in the public sector and then you wouldn't have to worry.

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My employer, the state made the promise to me. Its called a contract of employment.

The fact that you might work until your 80, has little to do with whether a public sector worker will retire at 60 (not 55), and more to do with the greed of the private sector Directors who are unwilling to meet their commitments to their workers.

Of course you could always get a job in the public sector and then you wouldn't have to worry.

This is like a passenger on the Titanic demanding that the ship continues the journey after it has hit the ice berg. The reality is that the nation cannot afford these gold plated pensions to public servants. It is undermining the economy.

On the subject of retirement age, a very large proportion of public employees retire before 60.

This whole pensions scandal is a nasty little business where public servants have been making lavish promises to each other using other people's money.

This is corruption and it has to be stopped.

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Why aren't you buying property then? You should be cashing in your shares and buying a house, whatever you can afford. You stand to make a lot of money if your beliefs are correct.

Yeah, 8% on a £250K property - I'm in there... ;)

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  • 302 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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