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Anybody just watch it on channel 4?

As somebody who is FI at age 44 and will soon FIRE I thought it was absolute tripe.  It seemed almost as though they were trying to discourage people from going for it.

Of course they had to get pwoperty investing in there.  Apparently if you partner up with a mate and buy a sh*t flat in London you'll be retiring before you know it.  So clearly that's one mistake I made by being a dirty renter in the South East.  Sheesh...

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13 minutes ago, wish I could afford one said:

Promising it was not.  That's half an hour of my life I'll never get back.

Thanks for taking one for the team :)

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Hi Wicao...how much do you judge you need to be fi ? I assume you mean in the UK and not India or rural Thailand??? Also I assume you own assets such as shares...what if they fall considerably in value, you might have to return to jobs market?? (sorry I might have asked this question before but not sure if you .)

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12 minutes ago, wish I could afford one said:

When they were making the programme I was contacted by one of their researchers.  I opted out but I did give them a copy of my book.  They clearly didn't read any of it.

you would of been good to do a program. i'm surprised no-one else has contacted you yet for your own prog. But i guess if everyone tried to be FI then it would be harder for everyone, we need everyone to spunk money on cars and credit cards really.

i might have to catch it just to see what you dont like about it? what goes against what you said?

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Just now, Wayward said:

Hi Wicao...how much do you judge you need to be fi ? I assume you mean in the UK and not India or rural Thailand??? Also I assume you own assets such as shares...what if they fall considerably in value, you might have to return to jobs market?? (sorry I might have asked this question before but not sure if you .)

I came to the conclusion that for a balanced portfolio of shares, bonds, property, gold, cash and NS&I ILSC's that I could 'safely' draw down from my portfolio at 2.5% plus investment expenses of 0.22%.  Backtesting at a 3.2% drawdown for a UK based 50:50 global stock/bonds portfolio would have seen off the all worst case sequence of returns (high inflation/wars/depression/...) for a 30 year retirement.  So I think I'm pretty safe and if it gets any worse than what we've seen in history I'm probably going to need guns and ammo rather than stocks and shares.  I called myself FI when I hit £1,014,000.  That would have given me enough to buy a nice home in the Med and to live happily ever after.

In the end I've worked on a little longer.  Today I'm at £1,223,000 so life is very very good financially. 

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1 minute ago, wish I could afford one said:

I came to the conclusion that for a balanced portfolio of shares, bonds, property, gold, cash and NS&I ILSC's that I could 'safely' draw down from my portfolio at 2.5% plus investment expenses of 0.22%.  Backtesting at a 3.2% drawdown for a UK based 50:50 global stock/bonds portfolio would have seen off the all worst case sequence of returns (high inflation/wars/depression/...) for a 30 year retirement.  So I think I'm pretty safe and if it gets any worse than what we've seen in history I'm probably going to need guns and ammo rather than stocks and shares.  I called myself FI when I hit £1,014,000.  That would have given me enough to buy a nice home in the Med and to live happily ever after.

In the end I've worked on a little longer.  Today I'm at £1,223,000 so life is very very good financially. 

thanks...i have some way to go!!! Depends how you value my company pension and my brother s business that I have a share in but its nowhere near £1.2m but then I can live simply....

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6 minutes ago, jiltedjen said:

you would of been good to do a program. i'm surprised no-one else has contacted you yet for your own prog. But i guess if everyone tried to be FI then it would be harder for everyone, we need everyone to spunk money on cars and credit cards really.

i might have to catch it just to see what you dont like about it? what goes against what you said?

Thanks for the hat-tip JJ.  I do find it a bit hypocritical that my journey of focusing on quality of life is dependent on most others chasing standard of living but hey ho.

About the only thing remotely useful was that if you save 25x your annual spending you're FI.  What they didn't point out is that at that level (which needs to include investment expenses) of spending a UK based 50:50 global stock/bond portfolio would fail 18% of the time when backtesting over historic 30 year periods.

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1 minute ago, Wayward said:

thanks...i have some way to go!!! Depends how you value my company pension and my brother s business that I have a share in but its nowhere near £1.2m but then I can live simply....

Simple example.  If you own a home and want £12k a year then something like £12k/2.72%=£442k should just about be enough.  It really is all about how much you spend.  Low spending also helps during the accrual phase as saving accelerates progress to the goal but also brings the goal posts closer.

I have £689k outside of pensions which also needs to buy a Med home and £534k in pensions.  I'm also assuming no State Pension and that I can't get access to my private pension until age 60.

I'm really now just being profligate and making excuses for why I'm doing my One More Year. 

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12 minutes ago, wish I could afford one said:

I came to the conclusion that for a balanced portfolio of shares, bonds, property, gold, cash and NS&I ILSC's that I could 'safely' draw down from my portfolio at 2.5% plus investment expenses of 0.22%.  Backtesting at a 3.2% drawdown for a UK based 50:50 global stock/bonds portfolio would have seen off the all worst case sequence of returns (high inflation/wars/depression/...) for a 30 year retirement.  So I think I'm pretty safe and if it gets any worse than what we've seen in history I'm probably going to need guns and ammo rather than stocks and shares.  I called myself FI when I hit £1,014,000.  That would have given me enough to buy a nice home in the Med and to live happily ever after.

In the end I've worked on a little longer.  Today I'm at £1,223,000 so life is very very good financially. 

Thank you, very informative and good to see someone put real numbers to the equation

Could I ask one question when you say property do you mean the house you live in, investment like BTL ( boo hiss and I suspect not ) or a commercial property you or someone else rents out ?

if you feel unable to comment thanks for the great post anyway 

 

Edited by Greg Bowman

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Just now, wish I could afford one said:

Thanks for the hat-tip JJ.  I do find it a bit hypocritical that my journey of focusing on quality of life is dependent on most others chasing standard of living but hey ho.

About the only thing remotely useful was that if you save 25x your annual spending you're FI.  What they didn't point out is that at that level (which needs to include investment expenses) of spending a UK based 50:50 global stock/bond portfolio would fail 18% of the time when backtesting over historic 30 year periods.

So how much a month do you think your household will require to live now today.....the minimum amount required to live comfortably that covers all daily living costs, a) living in UK b)living in say Spain or Cyprus your chosen retirement countries.....only asking because different people have different wants,needs, costs and lifestyles.;)

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5 minutes ago, Greg Bowman said:

Thank you, very informative and good to see someone put real numbers to the equation

Could I ask one question when you say property do you mean the house you live in, investment like BTL ( boo hiss and I suspect not ) or a commercial property you or someone else rents out ?

if you feel unable to comment thanks for the great post anyway 

 

For me property is listed commercial/industrial/retail stuff.  In the UK it's REIT's like SGRO, BLND, HMSO, PHP, HSTN and in Europe it's the ETF IPRP.

I am currently a dirty renter but my plan includes a paid for home in the Med.  I won't include that as an asset class as it's just a place to live and not an investment.

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3 minutes ago, winkie said:

So how much a month do you think your household will require to live now today.....the minimum amount required to live comfortably that covers all daily living costs, a) living in UK b)living in say Spain or Cyprus your chosen retirement countries.....only asking because different people have different wants,needs, costs and lifestyles.;)

Ok from a personal perspective, £2.5 -£3k a month would be a grand old lifestyle with house paid for and no debts that's UK cheaper elsewhere 

That would include in my case a reasonable car and bike and weekend trips and a good holiday every year 

I am assuming the money is in your paws with no tax obviously 

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1 hour ago, wish I could afford one said:

absolute tripe.

There's nothing educational or instructional on telly any more. I suppose it classed as infotainment, but was pretty low on both

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6 minutes ago, winkie said:

So how much a month do you think your household will require to live now today.....the minimum amount required to live comfortably that covers all daily living costs, a) living in UK b)living in say Spain or Cyprus your chosen retirement countries.....only asking because different people have different wants,needs, costs and lifestyles.;)

Minimum amount I think I need for Cyprus is EUR12,639 including a car replaced every 10 years, private health insurance, 1% home maintenance and 2 x Class 3 NI contributions.  On top of that I have allocated EUR14,595 for 'fun' of which we spend nowhere near that currently.

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I watched it, and thought it was absolute tripe. Was feeling hopeful that it could be even a slightly serious treatment of it, but it just dressed it up as entertainment. I suppose I should have known really!

The whole take a risk or commit to saving thing showed to me they didn't really get it. It's quite simple, as you've boiled it down to WICAO: earn more, spend less, invest well.

The people who'd "taken a risk" like the nut butter woman weren't retired, she'd just swapped her job for being a businesswoman!
Potato man? WTF?
No idea how the two guys buying the flat in London was supposed to fit into the equation either. Still the same old property drivel trotted out.

The couple saving £14k a year seemed to be on the right path though, with realistic expectations too.

I don't feel this has done much for FIRE awareness, but I guess as previously mentioned FIREes rely on people living it large to keep the stock market going...

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4 minutes ago, Greg Bowman said:

Ok from a personal perspective, £2.5 -£3k a month would be a grand old lifestyle with house paid for and no debts that's UK cheaper elsewhere 

That would include in my case a reasonable car and bike and weekend trips and a good holiday every year 

I am assuming the money is in your paws with no tax obviously 

An important point.  As a non-domicile in Cyprus dividends/interest will see no tax for the first 17 years of residency.  Two choices for pensions tax also - one of which includes only taxed at 5%.  So I could get most of my pension out before I risk hitting the LTA in my dotage.

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3 minutes ago, Greg Bowman said:

Ok from a personal perspective, £2.5 -£3k a month would be a grand old lifestyle with house paid for and no debts that's UK cheaper elsewhere 

That would include in my case a reasonable car and bike and weekend trips and a good holiday every year 

I am assuming the money is in your paws with no tax obviously 

That is a fair wedge of money, more than what many earn net monthly.....I can see why some will never have the guts to retire if they need to save such a big pension pot that would provide that kind of index linked income for 30 years or more ........so the options are a) retire early and learn to live on less if not already learned it because are now living it...less money for more time  or b)keep working and it may never happen, but it just might but won't last as long...more money for less time.;)

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12 minutes ago, wish I could afford one said:

For me property is listed commercial/industrial/retail stuff.  In the UK it's REIT's like SGRO, BLND, HMSO, PHP, HSTN and in Europe it's the ETF IPRP.

I am currently a dirty renter but my plan includes a paid for home in the Med.  I won't include that as an asset class as it's just a place to live and not an investment.

Thank you and the Cyprus info ?

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7 minutes ago, wish I could afford one said:

Minimum amount I think I need for Cyprus is EUR12,639 including a car replaced every 10 years, private health insurance, 1% home maintenance and 2 x Class 3 NI contributions.  On top of that I have allocated EUR14,595 for 'fun' of which we spend nowhere near that currently.

I take it that is per year not month.....so about £1000 a month plus a small rainy day pot.;)

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4 minutes ago, Inoperational Bumblebee said:

I watched it, and thought it was absolute tripe. Was feeling hopeful that it could be even a slightly serious treatment of it, but it just dressed it up as entertainment. I suppose I should have known really!

The whole take a risk or commit to saving thing showed to me they didn't really get it. It's quite simple, as you've boiled it down to WICAO: earn more, spend less, invest well.

The people who'd "taken a risk" like the nut butter woman weren't retired, she'd just swapped her job for being a businesswoman!
Potato man? WTF?
No idea how the two guys buying the flat in London was supposed to fit into the equation either. Still the same old property drivel trotted out.

The couple saving £14k a year seemed to be on the right path though, with realistic expectations too.

I don't feel this has done much for FIRE awareness, but I guess as previously mentioned FIREes rely on people living it large to keep the stock market going...

It felt a bit as though they were taking the p*ss and trying to discourage people TBH.

As you say the 2 and 5 financial diet (or whatever it was called) couple certainly got it.  If they can stay determined I would back them to do it much earlier than 50 as they'll end up earning more than they think.

The couple in the motorhome are from a blog I read.  They own 3 BTL's (plus some ETF's and solar panels) but actually come across as very genuine and grounded.

The rest - meh!

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2 minutes ago, winkie said:

That is a fair wedge of money, more than what many earn net monthly.....I can see why some will never have the guts to retire if they need to save such a big pension pot that would provide that kind of index linked income for 30 years or more ........so the options are a) retire early and learn to live on less if not already learned it because are now living it...less money for more time  or b)keep working and it may never happen, but it just might but won't last as long...more money for less time.;)

It is but sort of falls in line with IWICAO investment scenarios for a seven figure sum. I am still full on earning at the moment but easily living within that and could probably  live on half. 

I am not sure it needs to be gold plated index linked - my needs at 85 will be very different from now 

I am also sure I will dabble in business can't see myself not,  having run a business for 25 years which will supplement any draw down etc

 

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