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Sneaker

Is a globally open housing market a good thing?

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Seriously,  I do wonder.

i am very persuaded by free market arguments.  But I rink they're best applied to financial assets and to things where there isn't a basic need for them.

housing is a necessarily - it's shelter.  Is it right that "ordinary working people" should have to compete with oligarchs, sheikhs and money launderers globally to buy a flat or house?

Immigration doesn't really seem to have an effect on house prices.  It doesn't matter how many people here - if none of them has money, house prices aren't going up.  But all it takes is a few oligarchs to pay exorbitant prices and the whole market can move.

Is it really fair to let every rich person in the world but UK property when Brits don't have the reciprocal opposrintify to do the same in their countries?

and there are competing arguments - if you can't afford to buy a property where you grew up, you'll just have to move out.  But all this does is disrupt society and immunities.  Surely it should be a privilege to grow old where you grew up.

im thnnjfn aloud a bit here.  Probably people here will have lots of different views and maybe tell me why I'm wrong.  Interested to see what the forum comes up with 

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1 hour ago, Sneaker said:

Seriously,  I do wonder.

 

Howe often do you commute to work in Sydney from Cardiff ?

The housing bubble is a scam, a speculative bubble.

Houses are not investments, they are a vehicle for robbing people of their money.

The sooner this global ******** is ended the better for 99%ers all round the world.

 

 

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2 hours ago, Sneaker said:

Seriously,  I do wonder.

i am very persuaded by free market arguments.  But I rink they're best applied to financial assets and to things where there isn't a basic need for them.

housing is a necessarily - it's shelter.  Is it right that "ordinary working people" should have to compete with oligarchs, sheikhs and money launderers globally to buy a flat or house?

Immigration doesn't really seem to have an effect on house prices.  It doesn't matter how many people here - if none of them has money, house prices aren't going up.  But all it takes is a few oligarchs to pay exorbitant prices and the whole market can move.

Is it really fair to let every rich person in the world but UK property when Brits don't have the reciprocal opposrintify to do the same in their countries?

and there are competing arguments - if you can't afford to buy a property where you grew up, you'll just have to move out.  But all this does is disrupt society and immunities.  Surely it should be a privilege to grow old where you grew up.

im thnnjfn aloud a bit here.  Probably people here will have lots of different views and maybe tell me why I'm wrong.  Interested to see what the forum comes up with 

No. Land isn't a free market, there's no free market argument. 

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2 hours ago, Sneaker said:

Seriously,  I do wonder.

i am very persuaded by free market arguments.  But I rink they're best applied to financial assets and to things where there isn't a basic need for them.

housing is a necessarily - it's shelter.  Is it right that "ordinary working people" should have to compete with oligarchs, sheikhs and money launderers globally to buy a flat or house?

Immigration doesn't really seem to have an effect on house prices.  It doesn't matter how many people here - if none of them has money, house prices aren't going up.  But all it takes is a few oligarchs to pay exorbitant prices and the whole market can move.

Is it really fair to let every rich person in the world but UK property when Brits don't have the reciprocal opposrintify to do the same in their countries?

and there are competing arguments - if you can't afford to buy a property where you grew up, you'll just have to move out.  But all this does is disrupt society and immunities.  Surely it should be a privilege to grow old where you grew up.

im thnnjfn aloud a bit here.  Probably people here will have lots of different views and maybe tell me why I'm wrong.  Interested to see what the forum comes up with 

Its fine telling people to move if they cant afford to live in an area, but you still need the low paid, the bin men, road sweepers, shop workers.. Do the rich think the magic F**k fairies empty there bins and the roads are self cleaning.. Kick out the poor and they will have no one to tend to their useless rich waste of space ****.. 

Also with ever stretched social services family cohesion is more important than ever, if families move away due to housing cost this will end up increasing state dependency and cost.

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1 hour ago, TheCountOfNowhere said:

Howe often do you commute to work in Sydney from Cardiff ?

The housing bubble is a scam, a speculative bubble.

Houses are not investments, they are a vehicle for robbing people of their money.

The sooner this global ******** is ended the better for 99%ers all round the world.

 

 

This country's living on mass indebted credit boom. If the political parties actually were in touch with public sentiment, they would hear percentages published paint a mirage over the true extent of affordability  - Example

The average salary in the U.K. will rise by 2% this year.

The average salary in the UK is £27,600.

The average salary's yearly increased was £552.

The average salary's monthly increase was £46

The average salary's weekly increase was £11.50p

its a shambles.. all I see is more people selling up attempting to cash in and downsizing, but they will come up lack lustre of people nutty enough to buy.

 

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18 minutes ago, macca13 said:

Its fine telling people to move if they cant afford to live in an area, but you still need the low paid, the bin men, road sweepers, shop workers.. Do the rich think the magic F**k fairies empty there bins and the roads are self cleaning.. Kick out the poor and they will have no one to tend to their useless rich waste of space ****.. 

Also with ever stretched social services family cohesion is more important than ever, if families move away due to housing cost this will end up increasing state dependency and cost.

State dependency has been with the country since the 50's. The government told the local inhabitants of that era, they don't need to low paid, the bin men, road sweepers, shop / factory workers etc... they brought in people from other countries to undertake hard manual labour. The cookie jar is running on vapours.. and those ink jet printers, churning out new money has run dry B)

If they can't afford make it cheaper, then its time for a change at the helm.

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3 hours ago, Sneaker said:

Seriously,  I do wonder.

i am very persuaded by free market arguments.  But I rink they're best applied to financial assets and to things where there isn't a basic need for them.

housing is a necessarily - it's shelter.  Is it right that "ordinary working people" should have to compete with oligarchs, sheikhs and money launderers globally to buy a flat or house?

Immigration doesn't really seem to have an effect on house prices.  It doesn't matter how many people here - if none of them has money, house prices aren't going up.  But all it takes is a few oligarchs to pay exorbitant prices and the whole market can move.

Is it really fair to let every rich person in the world but UK property when Brits don't have the reciprocal opposrintify to do the same in their countries?

and there are competing arguments - if you can't afford to buy a property where you grew up, you'll just have to move out.  But all this does is disrupt society and immunities.  Surely it should be a privilege to grow old where you grew up.

im thnnjfn aloud a bit here.  Probably people here will have lots of different views and maybe tell me why I'm wrong.  Interested to see what the forum comes up with 

What aspect of the free market argument do you find persuasive? The smoothly intersecting supply and demand curves in the economics textbooks? The bit about consumers blessed with infinite foresight collectively maximising the 'utility' of the individual in an unknown and uncomputable future? The idea of money as a veil over barter? The analogy of a thermodynamic equilibrium where there are no conservative variables? Sounds more like medieval sorcery to me. Even Adam Smith understood that markets have to be regulated by moral sentiments to prevent '...a conspiracy against the public, or some contrivance to raise prices.'

Edited by zugzwang

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When I was a high-school student in Australia back in the 1980's, we studied the First World War and the performance of Australia's Prime Minister Billy Hughes, at the Versaille Peace Conference, banging the table, yelling " I speak for 60,000 dead" and, most tellingly, demanding huge cash reparations from the Germany.

As it turned out, Australia got sweet f**k all from the Germans as reparations.

But was an interesting aspect of the history lesson is one snippet our teacher snuck in at the end for the genuinely intellectually curious amongst the students, and that is:

What would have happened to the Australian economy and its then 5+ million inhabitants if the Australian government had in fact received the cash  from Germanyin the full quantum it demanded ?

An official economic study by the Australian federal government of the time indicated that the results on the Aussie economy would have been catastrophic, masses of imported money, a small population, and all that money chasing a limited number of goods. The result would have been utterly raging inflation that would have wrecked the economy and impoverished hundreds of thousands. Australia dodged a bullet by not getting the money.

This present flood of dirty money coming from China/Russia/India and washing into the property markets of Vancouver, Sydney, Melbourne, London, San Francisco, Auckland and so-on is seen as simple manna from heaven by the political/economic establishments of the various countries concerned. A gift from God that is victimless

In reality, this flood of cash is utterly toxic, creating massive distortions and destabilizing entire country's political establishments.

The Powers that be need to be careful what they wish for.........

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3 minutes ago, spyguy said:

Its not a housing market.

Its a dodgy cash/credit bubble.

 

Actually, its worse than that, its best described as a racket. An organized conspiracy.

 A bubble/Ponzi scheme will collapse of its own accord, all it needs is policy makers to keep their hands in their pockets.

Rackets- especially large rackets- are different. They require constant intervention to maintain, the injection of large financial support, and a political fix, alongside a loudspeaker that screams out that what seems like a racket to the general population is nothing more than a supply and demand challenge.

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