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Society of fools

The London-only work visa- a way to preserve the housing bubble ?

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Apologies if this has been posted elsewhere but this article on Bloomberg piqued my interest today

https://www.bloomberg.com/gadfly/articles/2017-03-29/london-property-market-after-brexit

It posits that there has been an idea floated that Britain may have "regional visas", one of which could be for Greater London, and that by this means the London property bubble might be preserved.

I don't live in the UK anymore, but is this for real ? I have a distinct fear that somebody in power may actually take this idea seriously and thereby preserve one of the greatest capital mis-allocations in the history of human capitalism.

 I know some people who tried to migrate to both Canada and Australia in recent years, and they experienced something of the opposite pressure, in that both the Ottawa and Canberra immigration authorities wanted them to seriously commit to living in Manitoba and South Australia ( two of the areas in both countries hardest hit by the local population picking up and leaving as fast as they can), so the opposite argument has certainly been tried in other places.....

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It sounds like they are grieving the possible passing of the ponzi.

Monaco has the most expensive home in the world closely followed by London and Monaco only has a population of about 38,000.

Edited by billybong

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15 hours ago, billybong said:

It sounds like they are grieving the possible passing of the Ponzi.

Grieving ? The national governmental/policy-maker effort in terms of will power, political power and brain power to keep the London Ponzi inflated is positively extraordinary.

You only have to look at the amount of high-level attention this garners in both the financial and popular press to simply stand back and look in awe. Its like a new Manhattan atom-bomb project or something.

All this national brainpower and cash would be far better placed if directed elsewhere.

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2 hours ago, Society of fools said:

Grieving ? The national governmental/policy-maker effort in terms of will power, political power and brain power to keep the London Ponzi inflated is positively extraordinary.

You only have to look at the amount of high-level attention this garners in both the financial and popular press to simply stand back and look in awe. Its like a new Manhattan atom-bomb project or something.

All this national brainpower and cash would be far better placed if directed elsewhere.

They are airing such extraordinary ideas that it sounds like they think it's over but are desperate to try to revive it.

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2 hours ago, billybong said:

They are airing such extraordinary ideas that it sounds like they think it's over but are desperate to try to revive it.

Hey, there was a time when the Brits thought their empire would be forever too, but eventually the winds of change blew it all away.

This too shall pass.

There are better fields for British willpower to be deployed...

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Mind you, I recall a history of the American Civil War a few years back, and the author actually pointed out that as concerns motivations, many southern slave owners were motivated not by racism, tribalism, state-rights politics or suchlike notions, but simple money.

There was, by 1860, simply far too much capital invested in slaves for their owners to give them up. To emancipate them- obviously without compensation, since slave owning was held to be such a moral wrong-would have meant slipping from the heights of American wealth and power into utter abject poverty.

So for many, to fight on the Confederate side was  a case of simple economic and societal survival. Having put a huge amount of money into slaves, the die was effectively cast and it was moral to go to war to protect one's wealth and standing.

I know the parallel is not exact, but sometimes when you see the lengths that the British, Australian, Canadian, New Zealand governments are going to protect the housing bubble, the irrationality and utter pig-headedness to defend an utterly indefensible cause resonates in a similar way.

 

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On 29 March 2017 at 11:36 AM, Society of fools said:

Apologies if this has been posted elsewhere but this article on Bloomberg piqued my interest today

https://www.bloomberg.com/gadfly/articles/2017-03-29/london-property-market-after-brexit

It posits that there has been an idea floated that Britain may have "regional visas", one of which could be for Greater London, and that by this means the London property bubble might be preserved.

I don't live in the UK anymore, but is this for real ? I have a distinct fear that somebody in power may actually take this idea seriously and thereby preserve one of the greatest capital mis-allocations in the history of human capitalism.

 I know some people who tried to migrate to both Canada and Australia in recent years, and they experienced something of the opposite pressure, in that both the Ottawa and Canberra immigration authorities wanted them to seriously commit to living in Manitoba and South Australia ( two of the areas in both countries hardest hit by the local population picking up and leaving as fast as they can), so the opposite argument has certainly been tried in other places.....

Australia also has a retirement investor visa scheme. If you choose to locate outside the big cities the sum you need to invest to get the visa is halved.

We should make it harder to locate to London not easier - and encourage visas for the north, Wales and Scotland.

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5 hours ago, MARTINX9 said:

Australia also has a retirement investor visa scheme. If you choose to locate outside the big cities the sum you need to invest to get the visa is halved.

We should make it harder to locate to London not easier - and encourage visas for the north, Wales and Scotland.

But that wouldn't help prop up the London ponzi.

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42 minutes ago, Blod said:

But that wouldn't help prop up the London ponzi.

And that is precisely the point here.

Having a London-only work visa is not something that is planned/engineered for the benefit of the United Kingdom.

As has been pointed out, and as is practiced in Canadian/Australian immigration policy, the benefit for the entire country lies in having skilled, wealthy migrants populating places like Winnipeg and Port Pirie.

Places like Toronto and Sydney ( and London) will never have a problem attracting prospective immigrants.

There is only ONE reason why a London-only work visa would be posited, and that is to keep the Property Ponzi floating. I couldn't think of a worse reason on which to hang a major policy of government.

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2 hours ago, Society of fools said:

And that is precisely the point here.

Having a London-only work visa is not something that is planned/engineered for the benefit of the United Kingdom.

As has been pointed out, and as is practiced in Canadian/Australian immigration policy, the benefit for the entire country lies in having skilled, wealthy migrants populating places like Winnipeg and Port Pirie.

Places like Toronto and Sydney ( and London) will never have a problem attracting prospective immigrants.

There is only ONE reason why a London-only work visa would be posited, and that is to keep the Property Ponzi floating. I couldn't think of a worse reason on which to hang a major policy of government.

Putting like that makes me fear they'll do this even more.

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If any of you have visited the properties economic migrants at the bottom of the income scale live in, you'll understand why London is shitting itself. Who else will pay £500 a month for a room in a rough ex council flat in zone 1-3?

If you turn the migrant tap off, the Brits won't flood in to plug the gap.

Never met anybody with an English accent cleaning a London office.

I met a chap from South America who was working in a bar in zone 2. Been here 12 years with partner. Late 30s. Both worked 2 jobs. Lived in one double room in a shared house. £60k saved. Dreams of buying own property in London. 

Equally determined & mental. 

I told him he was crazy and their savings would set them up back home or easily get them a cheap mortgage in a vibrant city up north, or take them somewhere sunny. They could pretty much go to Spain, buy a flat outright and do casual work of the type they are doing in London in the sunshine, and less of it.

What is it about London that suckers these people in?

I think it's like that American dream ******** - don't tax the rich hard as we're all gonna be them one day.

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13 hours ago, disenfranchised said:

I told him he was crazy and their savings would set them up back home or easily get them a cheap mortgage in a vibrant city up north, or take them somewhere sunny. They could pretty much go to Spain, buy a flat outright and do casual work of the type they are doing in London in the sunshine, and less of it.

What is it about London that suckers these people in?

Nail on head.

I lived in London for the best part of a decade and its attraction to ordinary people simply escapes me.

The general quality of life there seems extraordinarily low: its stressful, because the daily commute is a killer, good schools and childcare are very expensive, the central areas are unpleasantly crowded with tourists and therefore have the necessary corollary of lousy and over-priced food being offered in nearby restaurants. Real estate is ridiculously expensive and getting someone to repair say, a boiler breakdown probably means taking a day off work as it takes so long.

I could add to that some personal intangibles, such as that the general level of rudeness encountered is high and I have never lived in a city where it was so hard to make new friends.

And yet, still they come, in their tens and hundreds of thousands.

 Is there some kind of "prestige" factor I am not understanding here ? You get social kudos somewhere through displaying a London postcode ? Weird.

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