The greatest thread of all...The BTL running for the exit thread

[spyguy]

5 hours ago, disenfranchised said:

Why should Basel III affect lending rates to that extent in future when most banks in the UK were at or near their tier 1 capital adequacy target in 2015? 2% fixed for 2 years is a typical BTL deal, what makes it 3%?

Do you think Basel III will increase wider demand for credit that cheap liquidity no longer exists to meet?

Wouldn't that depend who has the keys to Merv's printer? 

Bank capital levles are down to regulation.

Basel 3 is about pricing risk too.

80% LTV OOO mortgage, less than 4 times income - relatively low risk.

BTL lending - commercial lending. Much more riskier. Its a commercial loan. Most commercial loan are priced much high and amortise over 10 years.

IO BTL lending - fcking insane. A non amortising commercial loan FFS.

At the mo, banks are reporting according to base l3 classifications. They have started increasing captialor charging more per type of loan yet. They will.

And as BTLer start defaulting and struggling, the risk wighting will go up.

 

[AvoidDebt]

Sell everything you daft c*nts. 

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/s6p/47068038

 

[Bhoy]

Father-in-Law is a BTL landlord, I believe he owns 15 properties. I'm not sure if he makes a profit from it, I avoid asking questions about the subject..... however:

I know he is looking to unload the portfolio this year. Now, he has mentioned moving to the cost (he's retired). I've not asked whether he's selling because of the changes to the law, or because he wants to cash in and have an easy life.

It got me thinking, I wonder if the spate of BTL portfolios coming to the market is a combination or both age of the Landlord (let's assume boomers who have retired) and the legislation changes? For instance, they want to sell at some point in the future due to their age, and now seems like a good time because of the changes? Might be a bit of a perfect storm.

Anyway off-topic. He was asking me about what deposit I have, lol. He made out like he was suprised I had one (I'm 34 with a well paying job so shouldn't be suprised). This struck me as odd as only days before my gf offered me the opportunity (thanks) to pay off a chunk of her mortgage with my deposit..... she has two kids from a previous relationship, so obviously if we ever split I'd never see that money again as it would be tied up in the house. I did wonder whether he had advised her to ask me to do this and that's why he played dumb. I did ask her if she expected to value my equity at the purchase price (2009) or today's value, she pondered, ha ha. It's a brilliant play really by her because either she gets a huge part of her mortgage paid off risk free or gets to question my long term intentions with her..... I said "no" to her suggestion btw.

[TheCountOfNowhere]

40 minutes ago, AvoidDebt said:

Sell everything you daft c*nts. 

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/s6p/47068038

 

Typo, surely ?

[TheCountOfNowhere]

10 minutes ago, Bhoy said:

I know he is looking to unload the portfolio this year. 

 

To whom ?

 

[AvoidDebt]

7 minutes ago, TheCountOfNowhere said:

Typo, surely ?

Baker Pearce are delighted to offer this fantastic investment opportunity, comprising of six three bedroom houses in Harrow. The portfolio is being sold with statutory tenancies in situ under the Rent Act 1977 and would suit a cash buyer. The combined current rental income of the portfolio is £55,476.04 per annum, rents are reviewed by the fair rents officer every two years. 

• CURRENT TOTAL RENTAL INCOME £55,476.64 PA
• OFFERS IN EXCESS OF £2.1M

 

We expect these properties to be sold to the highest cash bidder, and invite offers in excess of £2.1 million.

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-47068038.html

 

How crap is this 'investment'? This country is nuts. 

[Bhoy]

6 minutes ago, TheCountOfNowhere said:

To whom ?

 

I've no idea - I've seen the properties he owns in my home town and wouldn't touch them with a barge pole at 50% of what he'll ask.

To be fair though Count, the amount of sh#t that sells in my home town for stupid money.... I wouldn't be suprised if he sold them. Anecdotally,  he had a squatter in one for 9 months and made no money on that property, lol. Still had to pay the mortgage!

[This time]

13 minutes ago, AvoidDebt said:

Baker Pearce are delighted to offer this fantastic investment opportunity, comprising of six three bedroom houses in Harrow. The portfolio is being sold with statutory tenancies in situ under the Rent Act 1977 and would suit a cash buyer. The combined current rental income of the portfolio is £55,476.04 per annum, rents are reviewed by the fair rents officer every two years. 

• CURRENT TOTAL RENTAL INCOME £55,476.64 PA
• OFFERS IN EXCESS OF £2.1M

 

We expect these properties to be sold to the highest cash bidder, and invite offers in excess of £2.1 million.

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-47068038.html

 

How crap is this 'investment'? This country is nuts. 

All but one of them are on regulated tenancies too.

[TheCountOfNowhere]

14 minutes ago, Bhoy said:

I've no idea - I've seen the properties he owns in my home town and wouldn't touch them with a barge pole at 50% of what he'll ask.

To be fair though Count, the amount of sh#t that sells in my home town for stupid money.... I wouldn't be suprised if he sold them. Anecdotally,  he had a squatter in one for 9 months and made no money on that property, lol. Still had to pay the mortgage!

Well, keep us posted thanks.

 

He might get another BTLer late entrant snapping them up, but if he's waiting for FTBers or OOs then the not making any money will move up a level.

 

Edited March 1, 2017 by TheCountOfNowhere

[Shea VanHaven]

1 hour ago, AvoidDebt said:

Sell everything you daft c*nts. 

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/s6p/47068038

 

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

[Shea VanHaven]

1 hour ago, Bhoy said:

Father-in-Law is a BTL landlord, I believe he owns 15 properties. I'm not sure if he makes a profit from it, I avoid asking questions about the subject..... however:

I know he is looking to unload the portfolio this year. Now, he has mentioned moving to the cost (he's retired). I've not asked whether he's selling because of the changes to the law, or because he wants to cash in and have an easy life.

It got me thinking, I wonder if the spate of BTL portfolios coming to the market is a combination or both age of the Landlord (let's assume boomers who have retired) and the legislation changes? For instance, they want to sell at some point in the future due to their age, and now seems like a good time because of the changes? Might be a bit of a perfect storm.

Anyway off-topic. He was asking me about what deposit I have, lol. He made out like he was suprised I had one (I'm 34 with a well paying job so shouldn't be suprised). This struck me as odd as only days before my gf offered me the opportunity (thanks) to pay off a chunk of her mortgage with my deposit..... she has two kids from a previous relationship, so obviously if we ever split I'd never see that money again as it would be tied up in the house. I did wonder whether he had advised her to ask me to do this and that's why he played dumb. I did ask her if she expected to value my equity at the purchase price (2009) or today's value, she pondered, ha ha. It's a brilliant play really by her because either she gets a huge part of her mortgage paid off risk free or gets to question my long term intentions with her..... I said "no" to her suggestion btw.

WTF.     You are attractive because you hold the coins- sorry Bhoy, but you really need to allow them to sort their own shit out while you sort yours out.   I had all this crap with my ex, powerful father figures are very difficult to navigate in a relationship. 

But WhyTF doesn't he pay her mortgage off if he is loaded?

[Dyson Fury]

4 hours ago, AvoidDebt said:

Baker Pearce are delighted to offer this fantastic investment opportunity, comprising of six three bedroom houses in Harrow. The portfolio is being sold with statutory tenancies in situ under the Rent Act 1977 and would suit a cash buyer. The combined current rental income of the portfolio is £55,476.04 per annum, rents are reviewed by the fair rents officer every two years. 

• CURRENT TOTAL RENTAL INCOME £55,476.64 PA
• OFFERS IN EXCESS OF £2.1M

 

We expect these properties to be sold to the highest cash bidder, and invite offers in excess of £2.1 million.

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-47068038.html

 

How crap is this 'investment'? This country is nuts. 

I enjoyed the "bedroom 3" on the floor plans.  The one in Kingsley Road is only 6 ft 7 by 5 ft 7 - hardly big enough to fit in a bed, let alone any wardrobe or other furniture.  A good job the door opens outwards....  The "3rd bedrooms" in the other houses are not much bigger.  Still, invest 2.1 million pounds, enjoy a 2.5% yield while you wait for those 90-year old regulated tenants to pass away, and convert these 3-bedroom houses into 6-bedroom HMOs for students at the University of Westminster (which is in Harrow).  Innit.

[Cosmic Apple]

5 hours ago, Bhoy said:

Anyway off-topic. He was asking me about what deposit I have, lol. He made out like he was suprised I had one (I'm 34 with a well paying job so shouldn't be suprised). This struck me as odd as only days before my gf offered me the opportunity (thanks) to pay off a chunk of her mortgage with my deposit..... she has two kids from a previous relationship, so obviously if we ever split I'd never see that money again as it would be tied up in the house. I did wonder whether he had advised her to ask me to do this and that's why he played dumb. I did ask her if she expected to value my equity at the purchase price (2009) or today's value, she pondered, ha ha. It's a brilliant play really by her because either she gets a huge part of her mortgage paid off risk free or gets to question my long term intentions with her..... I said "no" to her suggestion btw.

Well I guess from the way you've put that you've already been red pilled and are well on top of this ********. I'd be planning my run to the hills...

[disenfranchised]

32 minutes ago, Northern Welsh Midlander said:

Well I guess from the way you've put that you've already been red pilled and are well on top of this ********. I'd be planning my run to the hills...

Most HPCers are red pilled whether they know it or not.

[crazypabs]

Allsop have a few early auction lots...

http://www.auction.co.uk/residential/LotDetails.asp?A=1026&MP=24&ID=1026000051&S=L&O=A

Block of 16 homes, guide price £+1.6m

 

[crazypabs]

then allsop have an investment block in E2 for Offers in excess of £9,500,000

http://www.allsop.co.uk/properties/hoxton-prime-residential-investment-opportunity/?status[]=marketing&price-max=999999999999&by=date&o=desc&limit=500

current rent of £391,640.

[crazypabs]

and another for Allsop...this time Hackney, Offers in excess of £10,750,000.

http://www.allsop.co.uk/properties/hackney-london-e9-predominately-residential-mixed-use-investment-development-opportunity/?status[]=marketing&price-max=999999999999&by=date&o=desc&limit=500

A Freehold substantial former warehouse building comprising:

• 18 self-contained flats let on ASTs
• Nursery Day Centre (3 units)
• Two retail warehouse units
• Additional storage units
• Three telephone masts

any takers? lol

[steve99]

On 02/03/2017 at 7:10 AM, Dyson Fury said:

I enjoyed the "bedroom 3" on the floor plans.  The one in Kingsley Road is only 6 ft 7 by 5 ft 7 - hardly big enough to fit in a bed, let alone any wardrobe or other furniture.  A good job the door opens outwards....  The "3rd bedrooms" in the other houses are not much bigger.  Still, invest 2.1 million pounds, enjoy a 2.5% yield while you wait for those 90-year old regulated tenants to pass away, and convert these 3-bedroom houses into 6-bedroom HMOs for students at the University of Westminster (which is in Harrow).  Innit.

Strange thing is, these places are a long way from Harrow as such, ie Harrow itself has a lot of amenity in terms of services, transport and shops, Northolt on the other hand is a long way from nowhere or in fact, anywhere, dog rough too.

[TheCountOfNowhere]

21 hours ago, crazypabs said:

then allsop have an investment block in E2 for Offers in excess of £9,500,000

http://www.allsop.co.uk/properties/hoxton-prime-residential-investment-opportunity/?status[]=marketing&price-max=999999999999&by=date&o=desc&limit=500

current rent of £391,640.

4%.

You can make 10% a month on the stock market at the moment

[disenfranchised]

On Wed Mar 01 2017 at 6:26 AM, spyguy said:

Bank capital levles are down to regulation.

Basel 3 is about pricing risk too.

80% LTV OOO mortgage, less than 4 times income - relatively low risk.

BTL lending - commercial lending. Much more riskier. Its a commercial loan. Most commercial loan are priced much high and amortise over 10 years.

IO BTL lending - fcking insane. A non amortising commercial loan FFS.

At the mo, banks are reporting according to base l3 classifications. They have started increasing captialor charging more per type of loan yet. They will.

And as BTLer start defaulting and struggling, the risk wighting will go up.

 

I have worked very briefly in mortgages for one of the big 4, and noticed the BTL book is entirely seperate, not just in terms of where it reports on the balance sheet, but on a completely segregated system - so assumed the risk weighting on the asset was different - but didn't realise B3 was causing that to change in a way that wasn't already priced in.

I have been wondering if S24 is a ploy - get a load of highly leveraged BTLers to incorporate to avoid it... and then the banks can shove their new "company loans" onto the un-ringfenced side of the balance sheets, moving a load of shit loans outside the ringfenced banks where the governbankment will not come to the rescue in a bust probably suits the Treasury very much.

Perception in the industry seems to be that all else being equal,  credit outside the ringfenced banks is going to be cheaper because they won't have additional reserve requirements above B3 shoved on them by the BoE. Be interesting to see what the SVR difference is for private BTL mortgages vs Ltd company ones in future.

[renting til I die]

On 01/03/2017 at 3:46 PM, AvoidDebt said:

Baker Pearce are delighted to offer this fantastic investment opportunity, comprising of six three bedroom houses in Harrow. The portfolio is being sold with statutory tenancies in situ under the Rent Act 1977 and would suit a cash buyer. The combined current rental income of the portfolio is £55,476.04 per annum, rents are reviewed by the fair rents officer every two years. 

• CURRENT TOTAL RENTAL INCOME £55,476.64 PA
• OFFERS IN EXCESS OF £2.1M

 

We expect these properties to be sold to the highest cash bidder, and invite offers in excess of £2.1 million.

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-47068038.html

 

How crap is this 'investment'? This country is nuts. 

Agree, what a joke! 2.6% gross yield and no chance of increasing that by converting any to HMO's!

But, just think of all those Mad HPI Gainz! ROFL

[renting til I die]

11 hours ago, TheCountOfNowhere said:

4%.

You can make 10% a month on the stock market at the moment

I think you are a much better trader than me if you are achieving that return!

[spyguy]

54 minutes ago, disenfranchised said:

 

I have worked very briefly in mortgages for one of the big 4, and noticed the BTL book is entirely seperate, not just in terms of where it reports on the balance sheet, but on a completely segregated system - so assumed the risk weighting on the asset was different - but didn't realise B3 was causing that to change in a way that wasn't already priced in.

I have been wondering if S24 is a ploy - get a load of highly leveraged BTLers to incorporate to avoid it... and then the banks can shove their new "company loans" onto the un-ringfenced side of the balance sheets, moving a load of shit loans outside the ringfenced banks where the governbankment will not come to the rescue in a bust probably suits the Treasury very much.

Perception in the industry seems to be that all else being equal,  credit outside the ringfenced banks is going to be cheaper because they won't have additional reserve requirements above B3 shoved on them by the BoE. Be interesting to see what the SVR difference is for private BTL mortgages vs Ltd company ones in future.

Incoporating get arounds S24 but increases the cost of the loans - a lot.

Credit outside of regulated banks is not cheaper FFS. It much more expensive.

[999house]

On 3/1/2017 at 2:55 PM, AvoidDebt said:

Sell everything you daft c*nts. 

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/s6p/47068038

 

Portfolio of crap houses, I mean properties

[thisisthisitmaybe]

On 3/1/2017 at 3:27 PM, Bhoy said:

Father-in-Law is a BTL landlord, I believe he owns 15 properties. I'm not sure if he makes a profit from it, I avoid asking questions about the subject..... however:

I know he is looking to unload the portfolio this year. Now, he has mentioned moving to the cost (he's retired). I've not asked whether he's selling because of the changes to the law, or because he wants to cash in and have an easy life.

It got me thinking, I wonder if the spate of BTL portfolios coming to the market is a combination or both age of the Landlord (let's assume boomers who have retired) and the legislation changes? For instance, they want to sell at some point in the future due to their age, and now seems like a good time because of the changes? Might be a bit of a perfect storm.

Anyway off-topic. He was asking me about what deposit I have, lol. He made out like he was suprised I had one (I'm 34 with a well paying job so shouldn't be suprised). This struck me as odd as only days before my gf offered me the opportunity (thanks) to pay off a chunk of her mortgage with my deposit..... she has two kids from a previous relationship, so obviously if we ever split I'd never see that money again as it would be tied up in the house. I did wonder whether he had advised her to ask me to do this and that's why he played dumb. I did ask her if she expected to value my equity at the purchase price (2009) or today's value, she pondered, ha ha. It's a brilliant play really by her because either she gets a huge part of her mortgage paid off risk free or gets to question my long term intentions with her..... I said "no" to her suggestion btw.

Glad you said no. That's a massive red flag with the gf. I'd run.