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Bruce Banner

Driving licence - More red tape and cost

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http://www.1stdrive.com/new-driving-test/

Completely over the top, jobs for the boys.

I feel so sorry for the youth of today. I passed my motorbike test two weeks after my 16th birthday and my car test a month after my 17th.

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In October 2013 it was suggested that learners should take a minimum of 120 hours of driving lessons spread over at least 1 year before they are allowed to take a driving test. 100 hours would be done during daylight and 20 hours would have to be done in the dark.

Only lessons taken with a professional driving instructor would count towards your 120 hours and we will have to sign off the hours. Any driving you do with parents, friends etc. would not count.

The main problem with this is of course the cost. If the minimum time of 120 hours comes in then it would triple the amount you have to spend on driving lessons from the current average of £800 to £2400. It will also mean that instructors are booked for a year ahead so finding anyone that is available to teach would be difficult and lesson prices could rocket.

 

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Unsure.

There's a shocking number of kids killed in cars, normally killing other kids too.

Maybe instructors need more training too?

Maybe there needs to be limitations on when people under 21 can drive - probation period.

At the other end, there's a lod of accidents casued by over 75s. Most of the the crashes in the local paper under 25 or over 75.

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2 minutes ago, spyguy said:

Unsure.

There's a shocking number of kids killed in cars, normally killing other kids too.

Maybe instructors need more training too?

Maybe there needs to be limitations on when people under 21 can drive - probation period.

At the other end, there's a lod of accidents casued by over 75s. Most of the the crashes in the local paper under 25 or over 75.

How much of those are down to attitudes rather than abilities? More rules and expense probably won't change attitudes.

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Just now, Riedquat said:

How much of those are down to attitudes rather than abilities? More rules and expense probably won't change attitudes.

I know.

The UK car deaths are great compared to other EU countries.

But there does appear to be a stubborn. predicable deaths.

 

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F8ck me! It's a money making scam. I had to buy my very first car with my money. That meant I was very careful with it.

Some are not, but boys are boys, and women can't park.

 

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Just now, spyguy said:

I know.

The UK car deaths are great compared to other EU countries.

But there does appear to be a stubborn. predicable deaths.

Which is partially why I get p1ssed off at people screaming for more affects-everyone restrictions and regulations etc., when the majority of problems do not involve close to everyone (personally I wouldn't even include those who are victims of their own stupidity in the numbers). Even of those high-risk groups there are plenty who aren't. Change the idiots to fit the world, not the world to fit the idiots. And if you can't manage that, well, putting up with the idiots is the lesser evil IMO.

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16 minutes ago, spyguy said:

Unsure.

There's a shocking number of kids killed in cars, normally killing other kids too.

Maybe instructors need more training too?

Maybe there needs to be limitations on when people under 21 can drive - probation period.

At the other end, there's a lod of accidents casued by over 75s. Most of the the crashes in the local paper under 25 or over 75.

Ban all motorised vehicles and build flats on the roads leaving the pavements for cyclists (wearing mandatory full body armour, of course).... Job jobbed! 

To me, some risk is acceptable but excessive regulation is not!

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15 minutes ago, MrPin said:

F8ck me! It's a money making scam. I had to buy my very first car with my money. That meant I was very careful with it.

Some are not, but boys are boys, and women can't park.

 

On that basis, the a quick improvment would be to force people to have their own insurance rather than being on their parents.

There is something amiss with car insurance for under 25. By my reckoning it should the price for drivers over 75. Its not.

 

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1 minute ago, spyguy said:

On that basis, the a quick improvment would be to force people to have their own insurance rather than being on their parents.

There is something amiss with car insurance for under 25. By my reckoning it should the price for drivers over 75. Its not.

 

Are you suggesting that prohibitive insurance costs should be introduced to force poor people of certain ages off the road?

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3 minutes ago, Bruce Banner said:

Are you suggesting that prohibitive insurance costs should be introduced to force poor people of certain ages off the road?

No.

Insurance should be priced on level of risk.

Round me, high risk drivers tend to be under 25s in small fast cars, and over 75s is large, automatic ones.

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1 minute ago, spyguy said:

No.

Insurance should be priced on level of risk.

Round me, high risk drivers tend to be under 25s in small fast cars, and over 75s is large, automatic ones.

But high insurance cost only reduces risk by forcing the people that you would like to see off the road, off the road!

I had a 150MPH car at age 18 because I could afford it and the insurance, others couldn't.

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31 minutes ago, Riedquat said:

Which is partially why I get p1ssed off at people screaming for more affects-everyone restrictions and regulations etc., when the majority of problems do not involve close to everyone (personally I wouldn't even include those who are victims of their own stupidity in the numbers). Even of those high-risk groups there are plenty who aren't. Change the idiots to fit the world, not the world to fit the idiots. And if you can't manage that, well, putting up with the idiots is the lesser evil IMO.

I really do despair. So every new learner driver now needs to jump through a dozen more hoops because of a handful of idiots? This is not progress at all. Should they also have to undertake a personality questionnaire like I did when applying for two jobs this last year? We'll all be doing 50MPH on the motorways when a civil service boffin concludes in a report accidents could drop 90%...

We have safe roads in this country, we don't need any more barriers to getting on the road and driving on it to make reasonable progress. The level of risk should be a balance and I think we have it right at present.

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7 minutes ago, Bruce Banner said:

But high insurance cost only reduces risk by forcing the people that you would like to see off the road, off the road!

I had a 150MPH car at age 18 because I could afford it and the insurance, others couldn't.

You are a bigger arsehole than I!:D

Mine would only do 110.

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11 minutes ago, MrPin said:

You are a bigger arsehole than I!:D

Mine would only do 110.

My brother was into fast cars and hotrodding. I learnt to drive in a MK1 Cortina in which he'd fitted a 1600 Cosworth engine. It was ok exceptin the wet when the crossply tires would skid under any acceleration, probably quite a good learner vehicle.

He also had a Triumph 2.5 Pi with "overdrive" (e.g. 5th gear). Now that was a nice car, big fat tires as well.

About the only time I've had an accident was the other day - when I spun the car on black ice at very low speed coming round a bend.

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11 minutes ago, MrPin said:

You are a bigger arsehole than I!:D

Mine would only do 110.

The funny thing, in this context, is that my car was a bucket of rust and I couldn't afford to maintain it properly due to the high insurance cost.... never mind, I could get it up to 150 (on the clock) and just about keep it on the road by holding on tight, real white knuckle stuff :D. A modern high performance car will do 150 all day with only one finger on the wheel.

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You really have to hope that this doesn't come in; unless I'm reading that incorrectly it's only a proposal.

It's wildly over the top and would have the effect of preventing kids from poor families from being able to drive; and in a rural area that means they will be unemployed.  Public transport, which means buses, are inadequate unless you're very lucky and you'd need a death wish to cycle fast rural A roads in the dark.

I wasn't a good driver and took 20 hours of lessons which was unusally high.  Then I took another course of half a dozen when I returned to driving hvaing not been behind a wheel for a dozen years.

The rules about not being allowed to carry passengers when young are eminently sensible however; two young ladies presumably chattering away sped past me a few months ago to get to the roundabout ahead of me.  Didn't stop, didn't look properly, T-boned a motorcyclist.

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Thirty years of no claims and we are fully comp at £200. Trouble is the wife is going to take a refresher course, currently I do all the driving even though she is on the policy. i wouldn't like to insure us then, it's going to be one hell of a prangathon and the mint car will be a dint car.

Older folk still have relatively few accidents, men's safety skills peaks at about 65, women about ten years earlier.

 

http://www.timegoesby.net/.a/6a00d8341c85cd53ef011572099ca3970b-pi

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Frank, I am a shit driver. Took me three goes. But when  I took my mates wife and kid out for a trip, wifey says I drive like a chauffeur.

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1 hour ago, ThePiltdownMan said:

If it works out like that I can imagine a lot of younger people just driving illegally or putting it off altogether in the hopes of self driving cars taking over in a few years time.

Hahaha - Bit like Amazon drone delivery!

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-4073250/Amazon-s-flying-factories-Patent-suggests-firm-use-self-driving-AIRSHIPS-launch-delivery-drones.html

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A limit could be placed on the size of the engine of the that a teenager are legally allowed to drive, or a two tier licence whereby to drive anything over a 1.3 needs a licence upgrade...that's what they've done with bikes..

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1 hour ago, SillyBilly said:

I really do despair. So every new learner driver now needs to jump through a dozen more hoops because of a handful of idiots? This is not progress at all. Should they also have to undertake a personality questionnaire like I did when applying for two jobs this last year? We'll all be doing 50MPH on the motorways when a civil service boffin concludes in a report accidents could drop 90%...

We have safe roads in this country, we don't need any more barriers to getting on the road and driving on it to make reasonable progress. The level of risk should be a balance and I think we have it right at present.

Not quite, although there is a greater proportion of idiots amongst new drivers. The non-idiots getting lumped in with them is unfair, but everyone else being affected by measures supposed to target them is worse still.

We've got safe roads, certainly safe enough that I have no tolerance for further generalised regulation or calls for more safety systems to replace brains. That doesn't mean that some more measures aren't a bad thing - as long as they only target those who need targetting (or almost only those, alas perfection there is impossible).

Some sort of personality assessment might not be a bad thing to be honest, although it is probably only acceptable to direct it at those who have already demonstrated some flaw (and a real one, not just having broken some arbitrary limit).

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We're getting closer to the point where driverless cars do all the work, and having a license will only be for specialists (farmers, builders, etc).

[I'm rather hoping that child #1 won't need to learn (as I'll bear the cost) -- that'll be in about 5 years -- not sure if that's enough time.]

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