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Orsino

Living Standards 'the worst since the last war'

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A report from the Institute of Fiscal Studies makes pretty grim reading:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-38090977

Quote

The Institute for Fiscal Studies (IFS) said workers would earn less in real wages in 2021 than they did in 2008. Other analysis shows the biggest losers between now and 2020 will be lower income families, with the poorest third likely to see incomes drop. 

Hammond's response is that millions of jobs have been created. Yes, but these are often insecure, low-pay, part-time, low-skill jobs that provide a lousy standard of living. That's the damn point! I wonder just how many Trumps and Brexits there need to be before the Establishment actually admit the problem.

Edited by Orsino

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Or another interpretation.

Low and middle income families have left full-time paid work to get on the magic Gorddy Tax credit bus.

 

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Whenever my living standards start to look like decreasing, I just bang the rents up. Why should I suffer at the expense of MY tennants? What does a farmer do when his profit margins get squeezed? He chops his big cowshed up and crams a load more high yielding, eastern euro pigs down the other end, simple supply and demand innit.

 

Edited by thewig

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8 minutes ago, thewig said:

Whenever my living standards start to look like decreasing ...

Yep, and everyone else will just cut back and stop buying stuff.

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What metric is being quoted?

Life is much better than post war in so so many ways.

NHS with ultrasound, dialysis, heart transplant and major corrective surgeries, medical lasers, IVF, MRI, stem cells, birth control, DNA testing, blah blah blah.

Eradication of smallpox.

Cheap travel. Get somewhere nice or different for a week for perhaps less than a weeks wages if savvy. Jet engines. Cheap fuel for cheap cars.

Internet. Fast internet. Information sharing, collaboration, blah blah blah.

Lasers, led's, optics, transistors, silicon revolution, digital revolution.

Communications, ie telephone, tv, mobiles, satellites. GPS

Computing...everything.

Super-computing...FE simulation on planetary scales.

Nuclear power.

Space travel.

Composite, polymers.

A world of food choices, cheap, and available 24/7 most larger population centres.

Women's rights. Minority's rights. End of major wars.

So many more.

What is all the animosity for living in the modern age? Feck sakes. Families aren't sharing houses...or rooms....en masse.

Is it because we can now see the people who have money and power, and are not strictly fed heavily censored and redacted, or even false information.??? I think so.

Edited by cashinmattress

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of course it isn't...

Quote

"This has, for sure, been the worst decade for living standards certainly since the last war and probably since the 1920s," said Paul Johnson, director of the IFS.

completely different meaning

Most of the downgrade of course is due to 'Brexit'. All part of the drip drip drip ahead of the 'next' vote, whatever form that may take

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1 hour ago, Errol said:

Yep, and everyone else will just cut back and stop buying stuff.

Yes they will..and the rent collectors will squirrel it away in another place, spend it elsewhere overseas or leverage up buying another growing income and growth asset piece of land with or without bricks.....how is that going to benefit anyone? ;)

 

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Hammond's response is that millions of jobs have been created. Yes, but these are often insecure, low-pay, part-time, low-skill jobs that provide a lousy standard of living. That's the damn point! I wonder just how many Trumps and Brexits there need to be before the Establishment actually admit the problem.

The entire point of globalisation, free movement of labour and the deregulation of finance was to create a pool of low paid 'flexible' workers in the west in order to compete with China et al.

So those insecure, low-pay, part-time, low-skill jobs are not a bug- they're a feature. What the Establishment does seem to have got wrong however is to overestimate their abiliy to manipulate the outcome of important votes like Brexit and the US election-both represent failures of the elite propaganda machine to deliver the 'right' outcome.

This is why we have the creation of a new meme in the form of 'fake news'- a catch all concept that is being groomed as the raison d'être for taking out any internet site that fails to conform to the establishment line- the morons in charge actually seem to believe that their failure to be unversally loved by the people they are screwing over can be entirely blamed on a handfull of websites.

In reality their problem is something else- instead of the passive one way mass communication of the past we now have a public that mass commuicates among themselves- the phenomena of the 'viral' web post in which a single person's idea or viewpoint can spread exponentially throughout the web means that the ability of any censoring authority to control that idea is severly limited.

The only way to control this kind of exponential mindshare is to take out every site that allows the posting of any kind of opinion- ie take down virtulaly the entire Internet. Good luck with that.:lol:

 

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14 minutes ago, cashinmattress said:

What metric is being quoted?

Life is much better than post war in so so many ways.

NHS with ultrasound, dialysis, heart transplant and major corrective surgeries, medical lasers, IVF, MRI, stem cells, birth control, DNA testing, blah blah blah.

Eradication of smallpox.

Cheap travel. Get somewhere nice or different for a week for perhaps less than a weeks wages if savvy. Jet engines. Cheap fuel for cheap cars.

Internet. Fast internet. Information sharing, collaboration, blah blah blah.

Lasers, led's, optics, transistors, silicon revolution, digital revolution.

Communications, ie telephone, tv, mobiles, satellites. GPS

Computing...everything.

Super-computing...FE simulation on planetary scales.

Nuclear power.

Space travel.

Composite, polymers.

A world of food choices, cheap, and available 24/7 most larger population centres.

Women's rights. Minority's rights. End of major wars.

So many more.

What is all the animosity for living in the modern age? Feck sakes. Families aren't sharing houses...or rooms....en masse.

Is it because we can now see the people who have money and power, and are not strictly fed heavily censored and redacted, or even false information.??? I think so.

12 steps forward 6 back.

  • Food is less nutritious than it used to be.
  • Womens choice to work has made working now manditory to have a reasonable quality of life.
  • Nuclear power is storing up problems for future generations
  • More people are suffering miserable last few years of their life with degenerate conditions.
  • Isn't the melting of the ice caps going to bring back small pox?

I think its because everyone has seen how well the boomers had it, and no once else in living memory will have it as good as they did.

Edited by stuckin2up2down
boomers

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21 minutes ago, cashinmattress said:

What metric is being quoted?

Life is much better than post war in so so many ways.

NHS with ultrasound, dialysis, heart transplant and major corrective surgeries, medical lasers, IVF, MRI, stem cells, birth control, DNA testing, blah blah blah.

Eradication of smallpox.

Cheap travel. Get somewhere nice or different for a week for perhaps less than a weeks wages if savvy. Jet engines. Cheap fuel for cheap cars.

Internet. Fast internet. Information sharing, collaboration, blah blah blah.

Lasers, led's, optics, transistors, silicon revolution, digital revolution.

Communications, ie telephone, tv, mobiles, satellites. GPS

Computing...everything.

Super-computing...FE simulation on planetary scales.

Nuclear power.

Space travel.

Composite, polymers.

A world of food choices, cheap, and available 24/7 most larger population centres.

Women's rights. Minority's rights. End of major wars.

So many more.

What is all the animosity for living in the modern age? Feck sakes. Families aren't sharing houses...or rooms....en masse.

Is it because we can now see the people who have money and power, and are not strictly fed heavily censored and redacted, or even false information.??? I think so.

And to that lot I say I largely say - so what? Except for the medical advances (which most people won't need, but they're still useful) and the social improvements the rest of those are really rather superficial, icing on the cake perhaps if things are good anyway but no substitute for good quality basics and belong in the "could live without happily enough if I had to" category. The animosity with modern life comes from getting annoyed with people who view the trivial as making things wonderfully better, whilst ignoring all the rest of the crap.

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Quote

What metric is being quoted?

Life is much better than post war in so so many ways.

NHS with ultrasound, dialysis, heart transplant and major corrective surgeries, medical lasers, IVF, MRI, stem cells, birth control, DNA testing, blah blah blah.

Eradication of smallpox.

Cheap travel. Get somewhere nice or different for a week for perhaps less than a weeks wages if savvy. Jet engines. Cheap fuel for cheap cars.

Internet. Fast internet. Information sharing, collaboration, blah blah blah.

Lasers, led's, optics, transistors, silicon revolution, digital revolution.

Communications, ie telephone, tv, mobiles, satellites. GPS

Computing...everything.

Super-computing...FE simulation on planetary scales.

Nuclear power.

Space travel.

Composite, polymers.

A world of food choices, cheap, and available 24/7 most larger population centres.

Women's rights. Minority's rights. End of major wars.

So many more.

What is all the animosity for living in the modern age? Feck sakes. Families aren't sharing houses...or rooms....en masse.

Is it because we can now see the people who have money and power, and are not strictly fed heavily censored and redacted, or even false information.??? I think so.

You left out the nearly 700% rise in the use of food banks in the UK since 2010. And ironically-given which site we are on- you also left out the increasing scarcity of affordable housing.

It's great that we have all the innovations you list above- but if despite all that we still have rising food poverty and a lack of affordable shelter in the fifth or sixth wealthiest country on the planet then clearly something is not right here- the system that produces all those technical marvels can't seem to meet people's basic needs for food or  shelter- how is this even possible?

 

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stuckin2up2down, Riedquat, wonderpup,

Been to 11-erife lately? Or is it 9-erife in this instance?

The goods far outweigh the bads.

FFS. You gloomy b@st@rds.

Bring on the plague rats already!

Edited by cashinmattress

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23 minutes ago, bricor mortis said:

I remember a time when every high st. had 2 shops whose sole purpose was renting out television sets to the millions who could not afford one.

Ah but......if you had given them a credit card they would have bought one or two.....on the never,never......the huge amount of debt today will Never Never be repaid. ;)

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If I became homeless tomorrow and lived on the streets there would still be medical advances, space travel and women's rights. I might still own a mobile phone and I wouldn't die of smallpox... but it would be pretty clear that my standard of living had fallen significantly. For those with a spare hour I strongly recommend this video of Elizabeth Warren and the Collapse of the US Middle Class (she would have been a far better candidate than Hillary). She crunches the numbers and reveals that spending has been broadly stable in all categories except housing, childcare and healthcare (in the US). Housing is THE number one cause for falling living standards and an iPhone is no substitute for affordable housing.

 

 

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What it boils down to is this......there are many capable, intelligence, reliable, honest, passionate energised people that could push mountains, add value....but not for what many companies can or will pay them, treated as comodities and cash cows....so they sit back, relax and think of England...... when not valued or rewarded can easily live on less with the people that matter who care supporting each other..... ;)

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16 minutes ago, nightowl said:

I doubt the 50s were actually better, but the sense of optimism must have been 1000% higher than now.

There was the potential to grow 1000% more than there is now......;)

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3 hours ago, TheCountOfNowhere said:

How can that be...house prices highest ever....

for how long though? wish I knew!

Edited by 999house

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1 hour ago, wonderpup said:

The entire point of globalisation, free movement of labour and the deregulation of finance was to create a pool of low paid 'flexible' workers in the west in order to compete with China et al.

So those insecure, low-pay, part-time, low-skill jobs are not a bug- they're a feature. What the Establishment does seem to have got wrong however is to overestimate their abiliy to manipulate the outcome of important votes like Brexit and the US election-both represent failures of the elite propaganda machine to deliver the 'right' outcome.

This is why we have the creation of a new meme in the form of 'fake news'- a catch all concept that is being groomed as the raison d'être for taking out any internet site that fails to conform to the establishment line- the morons in charge actually seem to believe that their failure to be unversally loved by the people they are screwing over can be entirely blamed on a handfull of websites.

In reality their problem is something else- instead of the passive one way mass communication of the past we now have a public that mass commuicates among themselves- the phenomena of the 'viral' web post in which a single person's idea or viewpoint can spread exponentially throughout the web means that the ability of any censoring authority to control that idea is severly limited.

The only way to control this kind of exponential mindshare is to take out every site that allows the posting of any kind of opinion- ie take down virtulaly the entire Internet. Good luck with that.

 

Its already being done. 1st with porn, then it will move to offensive sites and so on...

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