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Scunnered

Guardian: Google commits to massive new London HQ

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Google has confirmed plans to build a new £1bn headquarters in London and create 3,000 jobs, in a move that will be seen as a vote of confidence in Britain’s prospects after Brexit.

The project, which involves building a vast headquarters next to Google’s existing base in King’s Cross, central London, was thrown into doubt by the EU referendum and disagreement about its design.

But Google’s chief executive, Sundar Pichai, said that while the firm has reservations about Brexit, it will not be dissuaded from building an office capable of housing 7,000 staff.
[more...]

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/nov/15/google-commits-to-massive-new-london-hq

All very nice, but another 3,000 people working in the very centre of London?  I can see their point: if you're a youthful demon programmer from the Czech Republic or somewhere, a highly-paid job in the very centre of London might well seem extremely attractive, unlike if it was sited in Nottingham or somewhere.  But once again, it's just going to contribute to London becoming still more economically dominant and still more expensive...

Edited by Scunnered
"Guardian", dammit.

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Labour's Barry Gardiner on Google Brexit deal claims

Labour's shadow international trade secretary wants to see publication of the letters between the government and Google over the American company committing to continued investment in its London HQ.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-378080

BBC coverage of fake news stories is not groundless...

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1 minute ago, hotairmail said:

I think the HO agreement was a part of an earlier controversial trade off re Google's low taxation. Re FOM, clearly they've been told that in any event skilled workers will not be affected. As long as they are adding to our common pot rather than taking from it, that's the only sensible path. I just hope this isn't just special dispensation for London as was touted in the FT last week because that will make the country's imbalances even greater.

Merkel today said that in her view freedom of movement meant you had to support yourself, not be able to make instant claims on the welfare system.  I think we'll end up not with a concession as such but just a reinterpretation of what should happen in practice.

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8 minutes ago, thecrashingisles said:

Well if we're staying in the Single Market then we're staying in the EU in all but name.

No.

Unfettered FoM is dead.

 

We will have Single Market access. We will restrict immigration to the skilled workers we need, not every Tomasz, Ricardo and Henri in the EU.

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10 minutes ago, thecrashingisles said:

Merkel today said that in her view freedom of movement meant you had to support yourself, not be able to make instant claims on the welfare system.  I think we'll end up not with a concession as such but just a reinterpretation of what should happen in practice.

We are not staying in the EU. We are leaving. The EU will change it's rules to allow a non-member access to the single market.

 

The vote to Leave was to Leave, not some kind of negotiation tactic to reform our membership of the EU. We are out. Out.

Edited by the gardener

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7 minutes ago, the gardener said:

We are not staying in the EU. We are leaving. The EU will change it's rules to allow a non-member access to the single market.

 

The vote to Leave was to Leave, not some kind of negotiation tactic to reform our membership of the EU. We are out. Out.

You are contradicting yourself from post to post.  If we are leaving then the EU doesn't need to 'cave in on FoM' - we can do what we like if we're outside.  And so far we're not out of anything.

The Single Market by definition means the 4 freedoms - goods, labour, services and capital.  Either we're in it or we're not, but being outside it doesn't mean having no 'access' to it as loads of countries outside the EU either have free trade agreements or trade on WTO terms.

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7 minutes ago, thecrashingisles said:

You are contradicting yourself from post to post.  If we are leaving then the EU doesn't need to 'cave in on FoM' - we can do what we like if we're outside.  And so far we're not out of anything.

The Single Market by definition means the 4 freedoms - goods, labour, services and capital.  Either we're in it or we're not, but being outside it doesn't mean having no 'access' to it as loads of countries outside the EU either have free trade agreements or trade on WTO terms.

No.

We will be out of the EU but retain tariff-free access.

The 4 'freedoms' you mention are not integral parts of the single market. Even now the services part is not fully implemented. The FoM part for all citizens didn't exist until after the Maastricht Treaty.

The single market can exist without all of the four 'freedoms'. The EU will come to understand this and alter their stance.

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Just now, the gardener said:

No.

We will be out of the EU but retain tariff-free access.

The 4 'freedoms' you mention are not integral parts of the single market. Even now the services part is not fully implemented. The FoM part for all citizens didn't exist until after the Maastricht Treaty.

The single market can exist without all of the four 'freedoms'. The EU will come to understand this and alter their stance.

Again you're going in circles.  If we're leaving it they why are you hoping the EU will alter their stance?  Why is it relevant what their stance is?

And you're still confusing the common market of old with the single market.  The single market is the 4 freedoms by definition.

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1 minute ago, thecrashingisles said:

Again you're going in circles.  If we're leaving it they why are you hoping the EU will alter their stance?  Why is it relevant what their stance is?

And you're still confusing the common market of old with the single market.  The single market is the 4 freedoms by definition.

I'm not 'hoping' they will alter their stance, they just will since it is in their own interest.

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10 minutes ago, thecrashingisles said:

Alter their stance so that we stay in?  Otherwise your point makes no sense.

No. The Remoaners wet dream is that the UK takes WTO terms with the EU upon leaving. I am saying this won't happen. We will have free access to the single market without the supposed necessity of FoM.

Your comment about the single market/common market confusion is just semantics. I call it the single market as that is it's current name. It was called the internal market and the common market, it's the same thing in essence - tariff free trade within the bloc. To suggest that we can't have that is nonsense as other non-EU nations have zero tariffs in some areas.

Saying it can't happen because EU rules are inviolate is just the same old tired, discredited, Project Fear propaganda.

Edited by the gardener

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Just now, the gardener said:

No. The Remoaners wet area is that the UK takes WTO terms with the EU upon leaving. I am saying this won't happen. We will have free access to the single market without the supposed necessity of FoM.

Your comment about the single market/common market confusion is just semantics. I call it the single market as that is it's current name. It was called the internal market and the common market, it's the same thing in essence - tariff free trade within the bloc. To suggest that we can't have that is nonsense as other non-EU nations have zero tariffs in some areas.

Saying it can't happen because EU rules are inviolate is just the same old tired, discredited, Project Fear propaganda.

Saying that it's all the same thing is the same as saying that the EU hasn't evolved since 1973 which I'm sure you don't agree with.

Nobody thinks there are going to be tariffs, but that alone is not sufficient to prevent massive economic disruption and added costs on business.

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2 minutes ago, thecrashingisles said:

Saying that it's all the same thing is the same as saying that the EU hasn't evolved since 1973 which I'm sure you don't agree with.

Nobody thinks there are going to be tariffs, but that alone is not sufficient to prevent massive economic disruption and added costs on business.

What do you mean nobody thinks there are going to be tariffs. Just about every flipping Remoaner had been saying that for the past year. They've been literally masturbating themselves silly over scenarios where the UK is hit with punitive tariffs but can't respond in kind.

Reality. Have you ever been there?

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47 minutes ago, the gardener said:

No.

Unfettered FoM is dead.

 

We will have Single Market access. We will restrict immigration to the skilled workers we need, not every Tomasz, Ricardo and Henri in the EU.

You stated yesterday (or the day before perhaps) that your line in the sand was sovereignity and  you  claimed immigration had nothing to do with your intransigence?  :rolleyes:

You really need to work out your issues.

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55 minutes ago, thecrashingisles said:

You are contradicting yourself from post to post.  If we are leaving then the EU doesn't need to 'cave in on FoM' - we can do what we like if we're outside.  And so far we're not out of anything.

The Single Market by definition means the 4 freedoms - goods, labour, services and capital.  Either we're in it or we're not, but being outside it doesn't mean having no 'access' to it as loads of countries outside the EU either have free trade agreements or trade on WTO terms.

The UK will not entertain FOM in any shape or form in negotiations to leave the EU.  It's been a disaster for the UK.  May has already intimated that she wants a better quality of immigrant on her Indian trip, and eradicating FOM will enable the UK to do this.  It can benefits the UK in at least a couple of ways:-

  • getting rid of FOM while also completely cutting off benefits to non UK residents will drain the UK of a large number of unskilled workers from the EU - watch them leave.  These immigrants are actually a drain on the UK's finances, albeit they benefit their gangmasters employers.  Anyone who can't support themselves without welfare will leave the UK.
  • this in turn allows the UK to open up to the whole world in terms of immigration - getting the brightest and best from all over the planet (including Eastern Europe by the way) without punitively restricting this drive as the UK is now.  Right now, this would-be quota is being used up by unskilled, welfare-dependent workers from the EE.  These can be replaced by skilled, self-sufficient workers.  It would be good for the UK to increase - yes, a racist, xenophobic, narrow-minded, knuckle-dragging leaver like me is saying this - yes, increase this kind of immigration to the UK.  This is of course controlled immigration, and with highly skilled and needed immigrants who are completely self-sufficient (no recourse to public funds), it will truly benefit the UK, rather than what we have now - basically gangmasters employers taking advantage of Eastern Europeans who are paid below the living wage and being topped up with benefits (don't underestimate the number of EEs with children in the UK - my kids' school in Northampton had around 30% to 40% kids from the EE, WTC bonanza....). 
Edited by canbuywontbuy

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6 minutes ago, canbuywontbuy said:

The UK will not entertain FOM in any shape or form in negotiations to leave the EU.  It's been a disaster for the UK.

It was purely a UK decision to have FoM with the new eastern European members between 2004 and 2011.  We have a cheek blaming the EU for our own bad decisions.

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