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Turned Out Nice Again

911 15 Years On, Whodunnit?

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OBL was a boss of AQ. And the 19 hijackers were mostly middle class Saudi college boys. So, several of the above. The memeplex called Islam and jihad was the root cause (and has been active for 1400 years).

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The interesting question isn't whodunnit, but who was involved in pulling their strings.

There were quite a few countries who stood to benefit in some way, and who have highly sophisticated spy networks. Obvious candidates like Israel and Russia, looking for the US to be more supportive of their own agendas. The UK gained a lot with peace in Northern Ireland, as the 'merkins suddenly lost their appetite for funding Irish terrorists.

It's possible that any of those countries' intelligence services may have had some idea of what might happen. Can't rule it out completely, but I don't believe any of them were pulling the strings.

The main suspects must be forces close to the US government of the day. They had multiple motivations, and their actions in the hours immediately after the event showed that they had something to hide.

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i dont believe an aircraft struck the pentagon, i dont think it was possible to skim the ground so low in a commercial airliner with an amateur pilot.

Also no wreckage not even a tail fin or piece of wing or engine.

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Which conspiracy theory are you backing?

I've given a lot of thought to most of them over the years Nicey - but ultimately I'm only backing the ones that involve Keith Chegwin or The Wombles..!

;)

XYY

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To be honest, great uncle Bulgaria looks the part :blink:

15594.jpg

P

Exactly okesy.

Uncle Bulgaria is definitely the Kim Il-Jon of the recycling community..!

And what with being French - that Madame Cholet needs an eye keeping on her make no mistake...!

;)

XYY

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i dont believe an aircraft struck the pentagon, i dont think it was possible to skim the ground so low in a commercial airliner with an amateur pilot.

Also no wreckage not even a tail fin or piece of wing or engine.

Oh come on, people still believe that?

http://www.popularmechanics.com/military/a5659/debunking-911-myths-pentagon/

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Terrorist attack made easier by the incompetence of the US intelligence services and the poor state of the aerial defence capability.

Conspiracy theories ate entertaining material for novels and films; you're not meant to believe them.

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I can never decide between MIHOP or LIHOP.

I shall probably never know.

But clearly the official explanation is b*ll*cks.

Also, I was on the yank side of the Atlantic that day and watched the whole thing as it unfolded on American television right from baffled reports of a fire in one of the twin towers and claims a plane had hit one.

I've got an excellent long term memory and I vividly remember lots of it and the reporting that followed over the next few days including the dancing Israelis etc.

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I have the instinct that some people knew such a thing might happen, and so it can be used for an excuse for some "military intervention".

But hey, what do I know?

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911 was carried out by Saudis and funded by Saudi princes so in retaliation America decided to invade... Iraq.

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Three skyscrapers on the same day all falling as good as any professional demolition firm could do.

I doubt an architect's design has ever been rejected because the structural metal would be unable to withstand the heat from an airliner crashing into it.

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I have the instinct that some people knew such a thing might happen, and so it can be used for an excuse for some "military intervention".

But hey, what do I know?

Bigger picture, Pinny. Bush needed it for multiple reasons. Distract the world's wrath from Bad Things he was doing, like taking the US out of international treaties the rest of the world respected. Treaties ranging from pollution limitation to international oversight of its biological weapons programme.

And then there was "Read my lips, no new taxes". Needed an excuse to drop that. On top of which, he was haunted by his dad having had only the one term as president. War abroad (Iraq/Kuwait) wasn't enough: he needed an attack on US soil.

The need-an-armaments-industry-trade-show motivation was there but pretty secondary. After all, we could have picked a 1990s-style war somewhere completely different.

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Thinking about it, 9/11 was one of the most, probably THE most jarring non-personal experience of my entire life. It completely altered my world view and in particular any trust I had in mainstream media and elites, and clearly I am far from alone in this.

Was 9/11 a desperate thing to MIHOP or LIHOP and does that tell us something about geopolitics or something?

Or has it always been the case that there will be a sceptic minority who will see the man behind the curtain and the powerful know this and know these sceptics are powerless and their noticing does not matter?

I have a letter from my dad recalling his experiences when he was evacuated at the start of WWII, and apparently my grandad had written "********" on my dad and his brothers gas mask boxes as he didn't believe anything the government or the press said about tensions (and then war) with Germany and he thought the issuing of gas masks was just to frighten the public - to help fire up war fever.

My maternal grandfather knocked a tray of white feathers in the air in the early years of WWI and its a seemingly ignored fact that conscription had to be introduced because the majority of military aged men in Britain were uninterested in fighting WWI and were apparently unaffected by the extensive propaganda about German soldiers raping nuns bayoneting babies and crucifying POWs.

So, maybe its always been like this.

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Terrorist attack made easier by the incompetence of the US intelligence services and the poor state of the aerial defence capability.

Conspiracy theories ate entertaining material for novels and films; you're not meant to believe them.

Noone doubts it was terrorist attack from islamist nutjobs. Any more than anyone doubts 5/11 (aka the gunpowder plot) was a Catholic job.

The latter is now far enough back in history for historians to have investigated and found traces of the Establishment's hand up the terrorists' cassocks.

The 2001 job? Evidence for a conspiracy starts from the extraordinarily bizarre suppression of satellite image data some hours after the event, when images that were published automatically every day were not merely removed after a few hours but actively written out of history, only to reappear on the Friday (presumably having been duly vetted). Original source for that was John Pike of the Federation of American Scientists, posting on the evening of 9/11 itself to note the disappearance.

The second suggestion of conspiracy was a simple follow the money.

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Osama bin Laden probably died of kidney failure in Afghanistan in 2001. The idea that the US military was desperate to bury "his" body within 24 hours of the Abbottabad killing in order to respect Muslim funerary customs is completely absurd. They really should have come up with a better lie.

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I have the instinct that some people knew such a thing might happen, and so it can be used for an excuse for some "military intervention".

But hey, what do I know?

I suspect that you know much more than you let on, Pinny.

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4 planes were lost that day,

4 fusealage

4 tails

8 wings

Hundreds of passengers

Hundreds of pieces of luggage

Not very much of any of the above was ever recovered.

All very different to airplane crashes before or after.

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If the whole thing was a conspiracy it is worrying what else they have planned in future.

They don't care much for human life, the various wars since 911 are proof of that.

My guess is they are after Russia's resources. China must be eyeing them up too.

It always amazes me when I look at the map how big Russia is, stretching from western Europe to Alaska, it must be full of oil, gas, coal and minerals etc.

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If the whole thing was a conspiracy it is worrying what else they have planned in future.

They don't care much for human life, the various wars since 911 are proof of that.

My guess is they are after Russia's resources. China must be eyeing them up too.

It always amazes me when I look at the map how big Russia is, stretching from western Europe to Alaska, it must be full of oil, gas, coal and minerals etc.

It's full of Vodka! :unsure:

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I voted: Israel/ Mossad + Bush Family + Neocons + US banking/ military-industrial complex.


Things that make you go "Hmmm ...":


- PNAC's 1997 founding document anticipating a "New Pearl Harbour", nearly half of whose signatories went on to serve in the Bush administration, including Dick Cheney, Donald Rumsfeld, Paul Wolfowitz and numerous dual citizens with strong links to Israel/ Likud.


- Warren Buffet's 9/11 breakfast meeting at Offutt Air Force base in Omaha, guests including Ann Tatlock, the CEO of Fiduciary Trust Co. International housed in the WTC; "coincidentally" the same Air Force base that AF-1 carrying GW Bush landed at later that day. Larry Silverstein's "doctor's appointment" that prevented him taking his usual breakfast in the "Windows on the world" restaurant atop WTC1. Many more such fortuitous (and fortunate) absences that morning. And conversely, the "unlucky" inclusion of other connected individuals in the WTC, Pentagon and aboard the "hijacked" planes.


- Dutch Demolition Expert Danny Jowenko's independent assessment of the WT7 collapse (without knowing it happened on 9/11) quickly followed by his death in a bizarre Jörg Haider-style car crash.


- The stock-market Put options on airline stocks etc. placed just pre-911 - beneficiaries still undisclosed.


- The fate of nearly $1 billion worth of gold, silver and other precious metals stored beneath the WTC before 9-11. To this day, only $230 million has officially been accounted for.


- The number of malfeasance investigations terminated by the destruction of offices/ files conveniently located in WT7 and the exact section of the Pentagon destroyed on 9/11


- The number of anti-terror drills scheduled to take place on the morning of 9/11, eg. FEMA arrived in NY the day before.


- The Israeli "Moving Company" and "Art Student" activities immediately prior to 9/11.


- The inexplicable stand-down of air defences on 9/11 and subsequent suppression of Air traffic control transcripts.


- The cover-up and hasty disposal of evidence from ground-zero.


In short, the whole thing stinks of Elite foreknowledge at minimum; more likely, it was a psy-op long in the planning and designed to solve a whole bag of social, economic and geo-political problems in one go.

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Define they.

This isn't a smart answer but I struggle to see beyond various individuals doing things at various times because it suits them to do so. Like Soros trying to derail UKIP / leave.

The only consistent voice that I can see is the pro-Israel lobby but I don't see them as having any aim beyond the preservation of Israel.

Now this may take many forms including the demonising then destruction of nearby hostile regimes (Iraq, Syria) but I don't see a wider global conspiracy either sitting behind that or elsewhere with plans to weaken Russian power.

The US wants to weaken Russian power for its own reasons, but we know that.

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