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Stephen Lawrence "witness" Footage Released.

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It seems some new information has come to light, in the form of a CCTV video showing a man in a distint "V" emblem jacket, that witnesses at the time reported seeing at the scene of the murder:

Stephen Lawrence 'Witness' Footage Released

http://news.sky.com/story/stephen-lawrence-witness-footage-released-10527867

witness-footage-released

Man was filmed buying beer in an offlicence and later on buying more beer in the same offlicence later that night.

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Fixed,

Note the artists E-fit impression released at the time and then then the man in the video.

Also

Back at the time (1993) this CCTV would likely have been on VHS or other cassette recording format?

Which would mean it would have been obtained within a day or so of the crime?

And released 23 years later?

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So, police seeking man who bought beer from offie 20 years ago.

Two years after they first obtained the video. So it took them 18 years to get the video and then 2 years to release it.

I wonder how many shops still have surveillance video from 20 years ago.

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Two years after they first obtained the video. So it took them 18 years to get the video and then 2 years to release it.

I wonder how many shops still have surveillance video from 20 years ago.

Ones visited by large breasted women who dont wear bras Id guess.

Must be Victoria Corens local.

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It was the lizards wot did it.

As you can see in unreleased video from later that night, it was the zombies wot done it...

Oi1P7O7.png

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One of my best mates worked in that off licence, I suspect around that time, although he doesn't appear to be working there in the video.

Mentioned on here before, went to school with most of the main players in the murder, they were not in my circle of friends but knew them well enough.

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One of my best mates worked in that off licence, I suspect around that time, although he doesn't appear to be working there in the video.

Mentioned on here before, went to school with most of the main players in the murder, they were not in my circle of friends but knew them well enough.

What were his thoughts on the blokes implicated ? If you can say of course. Don't see why not.

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What were his thoughts on the blokes implicated ? If you can say of course. Don't see why not.

My cousin has lived in Charlton all his life (next to Eltham) and has been of the view that SL was a low level drug dealer and this was a turf war. He knows people on the edge of these circles.

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What were his thoughts on the blokes implicated ? If you can say of course. Don't see why not.

Sorry, can see how my post was ambiguous. I meant I went to school with them.

They were generally just normal people, certainly wouldn't have said they were any more or less racist than anybody else in the world. The notion they were all knife wielding racist maniacs is well wide of the mark. Of the five or six implicated in the murder I would have said one was a clear ring leader, the rest pretty much completely normal (relatively given the area we are talking about, London council estate).

I know no more than anybody else, other than the character of the people involved, however with that knowledge I think I have a reasonable idea of what possibly went on.

I'd say talk of a drug turf war is well off, but equally so is the canonization of the victim.

I've got a sort of chip on my shoulder about the whole affair to be completely honest for personal reasons.

Edit : to be clear it was a terrible event and any lose of life is tragic.

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My cousin has lived in Charlton all his life (next to Eltham) and has been of the view that SL was a low level drug dealer and this was a turf war. He knows people on the edge of these circles.

Rubbish - according to the Bbc he was an Architect, grade A student etc, etc

I love the picture (cropped to within an inch of it's life) that all the media use

Blick power, init

https://www.google.com.au/search?q=stephen+lawrence&espv=2&biw=1920&bih=955&site=webhp&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&sqi=2&ved=0ahUKEwjcv5Chh7TOAhVEoJQKHSo9ASgQ_AUIBigB&dpr=1#imgrc=5NjVeGvB7Ne3tM%3A

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My cousin has lived in Charlton all his life (next to Eltham) and has been of the view that SL was a low level drug dealer and this was a turf war. He knows people on the edge of these circles.

Yesterday, the BBC website described SL as an aspiring architect, and cropped the photo of him in his striped top so that you can't see the clenched fist hand gestures :blink:

(They is good at pushing a narrative...)

Ah: see mattyd beat me to it! #Cynicsunited

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Sorry, can see how my post was ambiguous. I meant I went to school with them.

They were generally just normal people, certainly wouldn't have said they were any more or less racist than anybody else in the world. The notion they were all knife wielding racist maniacs is well wide of the mark. Of the five or six implicated in the murder I would have said one was a clear ring leader, the rest pretty much completely normal (relatively given the area we are talking about, London council estate).

I know no more than anybody else, other than the character of the people involved, however with that knowledge I think I have a reasonable idea of what possibly went on.

I'd say talk of a drug turf war is well off, but equally so is the canonization of the victim.

I've got a sort of chip on my shoulder about the whole affair to be completely honest for personal reasons.

Edit : to be clear it was a terrible event and any lose of life is tragic.

That's interesting. It sounds like you doubt it was them. I used to work with several people who grew up in the Lee/Grove Park area who knew them all. They were also convinced it wasn't racially motivated, or directly related to drug dealing, and that SL was a pretty nasty character and it was personal. However, they were entirely convinced the people who were convicted were the people involved.

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The E-Fit artists impression from 1993 looks like a white man with long ginger hair

2lcweb9.jpg

Comparing it to the CCTV released yesterday from 1993 of a dark skinned man with short black hair.

On the subject of this CCTV video:

Back then the CCTV systems ran on a 24hr re-writing loop using VHS cassettes or similar, so

somebody would have had to have removed that cassette from the system within 24hrs of the incident (to prevent it being written over) and then kept it in storage for 21yrs before handing it to the Police? in 2014?

21 years later?

Doesn't add up.

The only people i could think of who would secure & obtain CCTV evidence within 24hrs of a crime and then keep it it storage for 21yrs is the Police!

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That's interesting. It sounds like you doubt it was them. I used to work with several people who grew up in the Lee/Grove Park area who knew them all. They were also convinced it wasn't racially motivated, or directly related to drug dealing, and that SL was a pretty nasty character and it was personal. However, they were entirely convinced the people who were convicted were the people involved.

Actually no I wasn't particularly suggesting that.

My issue with it is more to do with the fall out, which from my perspective was massively over stated and caused wider divisions between police and the black community. Fundamentally I'm talking about the case being labeled as a racist incident, which as you mention is well wide of the mark IMO and that the police reaction to it was based on "institutional racism", neither of which do I believe to be true and have been exceptionally damaging. Don't get me wrong there have been massive failings by the police.

In the end two people have been convicted of the crime.

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The E-Fit artists impression from 1993 looks like a white man with long ginger hair

2lcweb9.jpg

Comparing it to the CCTV released yesterday from 1993 of a dark skinned man with short black hair.

On the subject of this CCTV video:

Back then the CCTV systems ran on a 24hr re-writing loop using VHS cassettes or similar, so

somebody would have had to have removed that cassette from the system within 24hrs of the incident (to prevent it being written over) and then kept it in storage for 21yrs before handing it to the Police? in 2014?

21 years later?

Doesn't add up.

The only people i could think of who would secure & obtain CCTV evidence within 24hrs of a crime and then keep it it storage for 21yrs is the Police!

Is that Mr Tumble?

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That's interesting. It sounds like you doubt it was them. I used to work with several people who grew up in the Lee/Grove Park area who knew them all. They were also convinced it wasn't racially motivated, or directly related to drug dealing, and that SL was a pretty nasty character and it was personal. However, they were entirely convinced the people who were convicted were the people involved.

Why do they think it wasn't racially motivated? Wikipedia claims all five suspects had previous form for attempting to stab or being suspects in the stabbing of black people in the area:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Stephen_Lawrence#Witnesses

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Gangs were/are a part of life in much of London. Low level criminality and stabbings/shootings are relatively common.
i agree that turning the whole thing into a race incident is probably missing the point, whether deliberately or not.

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Why do they think it wasn't racially motivated? Wikipedia claims all five suspects had previous form for attempting to stab or being suspects in the stabbing of black people in the area:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Stephen_Lawrence#Witnesses

Well, it was quite a while ago and only a passing conversation one night, but as I understood it there was some longstanding personal animosity that had been festering for years. Something to do with someone's sister being slighted, either a sexual assault or being slagged off after a hook up that caused some friction between two groups/gangs/cliques (as I recall there was some disagreement over what happened exactly among the people who were talking about it). They did seem pretty clear that events were triggered by antagonism with a group of people all of whom were black, not antagonism towards black people generally. The people saying this were all white (but plenty friendly with the black people working with us) as that may make a difference. To be honest I have never made an effort to follow the case and my comments are simply relaying some snippets of local hearsay.

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