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geranium

Amateur Btl Landlords

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I arrived back at work after Christmas to hear of one colleague (formerly a committed BTL amateur) who plans to exit his BTL portfolio over the next 12 months. He currently has 5 properties: 2 in Spain, 1 in Scotland, 2 in the North West.

With a new baby and in need of a larger house himself, he can no longer fund the UK properties :ph34r: (1 void in Scotland) and feels the Spanish properties are too risky, so intends to sell when these are completed.

I thought a poll would be interesting to help collate some of the anecdotal evidence.

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Guest Winners and Losers

In terms of the 'spring bounce', I think supply will outstrip demand and lower prices. Not that I'm much of an expert, just a possibility.

I know that my landlord plans to sell in the spring.

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Guest boxmoor boy

"He currently has 5 properties: 2 in Spain, 1 in Scotland, 2 in the North West."

If the Spanish properties are Costa del sol or nrth costa blanca,I'm hearing big problems from sellers in what seems to be an over supplied market.Costa la luz still getting a few pecks of interest from the Brits.The last time sentiment turned in spain I heard tales of properties taking literally 5+ years to shift.

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"He currently has 5 properties: 2 in Spain, 1 in Scotland, 2 in the North West."

If the Spanish properties are Costa del sol or nrth costa blanca,I'm hearing big problems from sellers in what seems to be an over supplied market.Costa la luz still getting a few pecks of interest from the Brits.The last time sentiment turned in spain I heard tales of properties taking literally 5+ years to shift.

Costa del Sol apparently.

He knows about the glut of properties there, but thinks he can still do better than break-even.

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Guest boxmoor boy

On the way up people buy'price',thats all.When they start to think in terms of fundamental values,things stagnate.Once things stagnate people start to look for value and when there isn't any,they not only don't buy they go looking somewhere/something else.The problem with 'hot' markets is that they turn cold in the end,unsexy or boring if you like.The herd simply facks orrff in one big uninterested mass.This is the problem he may face,lack of buyers at any price,its happened before in Spain.Good luck to him though,I hope he manages to find someone who is bursting to buy in the costa del sol at the price he wants to sell at.

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Following this thread -

http://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/forum/ind...showtopic=21435

The letting agents tell me the landlord has settled his arrears but will give me 2 months notice at the end of the month ( just before the next rent is due) so that he can put the house on the market.

Tough sh1t because I am leaving on the Friday before the bailiffs are due to turf me out.

Building Society's solicitor informs me that he didn't have permission to rent the place out.

If he'd approached me before the hearing date I would have offered to stay in the place paying rent right up until completion in exchange for rebate of 1 or 2 months rent.

As a result the feckwit is immediately at least £1,000 worse off and will be £410 worse off for every month thereafter the place remains unsold.

Amaterur landlord. Pah! They give the rest of us a bad name :rolleyes:

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Well I'm glad I started this thread yesterday, just before the ban on starting topics for non-VIP members came in :(

I'm bumping this up to the top of the forum because it would be more meaningful if there could be a few more votes on it.

Edited by geranium

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[building Society's solicitor informs me that he didn't have permission to rent the place out.]

I've often wondered how many people are letting property out with a standard mortgage rather than a BTL without telling their lender that they've done this? It may well be that the value of mortgages used on rental properties is significantly higher than the BTL mortgage amount would suggest.

The new regs on rental deposits could flush more of these out and BTL mortgages tend to be more expensive than standard ones - more pressure on the amateur BTL landlords !!!

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I have a friend who is selling their house....to a BTLer although the process is being dragged by them trying to get a few K off the price

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Building Society's solicitor informs me that he didn't have permission to rent the place out.

I'd let the local office of the H.M. Customs and Revenue know about this if I were you. :)

It might make you feel a bit better about the whole situation because it is very likely that your erstwhile landlord hasn't been a good boy and declared the rental income...

Think of it as a nice leaving present :lol:

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Hello

Sorry to tag this on the end here, but can some one please point me in the direction of where it explains about posting stuff, I don't have permission anymore... what definates who does and doesnt then? :( Why did it it change and how do u go about beginning a new topic ?!?! :(

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Hello

Sorry to tag this on the end here, but can some one please point me in the direction of where it explains about posting stuff, I don't have permission anymore... what definates who does and doesnt then? :( Why did it it change and how do u go about beginning a new topic ?!?! :(

See pinned at the top of the main forum Important Board Policy Announcement

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There seems to be some interesting anecdotal BTL sellers over at http://www.sheffieldforum.co.uk/

It's in the Moving to Sheffield / Flat on West Street thread, but I'm having trouble posting the full URL (perhaps because I haven't crossed some arbitrary invisible threshold and become a "VIP")

Edited by aussieboy

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There seems to be some interesting anecdotal BTL sellers over at http://www.sheffieldforum.co.uk/

It's in the Moving to Sheffield / Flat on West Street thread, but I'm having trouble posting the full URL (perhaps because I haven't crossed some arbitrary invisible threshold and become a "VIP")

Thanks. I couldn't see the bit about BTL sellers but

this tread on the site you mentioned is very interesting - shows some real scepticism about city centre new builds.

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Thought you might like an update on my colleague (amateur BTL landlord). He has been trying to sell his properties since the start of the year (although one has been on the market much longer) but it is proving harder than he thought it would be.

Anyone hearing similar things from BTLs trying to sell up?

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Thought you might like an update on my colleague (amateur BTL landlord). He has been trying to sell his properties since the start of the year (although one has been on the market much longer) but it is proving harder than he thought it would be.

Anyone hearing similar things from BTLs trying to sell up?

As in other threads, there are more houses with "no chain", etc than I have ever seen.

There are also lots of to let signs around at the moment.

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A friend of mine plans to sell his 1 bed BTL flat in the Spring as he had trouble finding tenants and it is now occupied by 3 Polish labourers who are not paying the rent - he has to evict them first

The rent was £400 per month and the mortgage £450 per month !!! ;)

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A friend has 25 BTL's. He's been doing it for around 3 or 4 years (seems proud of the debt he has!?). I don't consider him an amateur anymore as he does have a lot of experience. However, despite admiting his recent properties are either just breaking even or making a slight monthly loss he still plans to buy more this year. His earlier properties are obviously making amonthly profit.

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Might be different here in Australia, but a friend of mine is looking to buy more BTL's. He is quite happy to accept a gross rental of 5% (and mortgages are 7%+ here), because he's absolutely convinced that prices (and rentals) are going to appreciate at 5% or more from now on. He's even told me he expects bigger gains over the next couple of years "to make up for 2004 and 2005".

I have tried to convince him that housing is an overpriced asset here, but it's like talking to a brick wall. I don't bother any more, just wish him well.

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Might be different here in Australia, but a friend of mine is looking to buy more BTL's. He is quite happy to accept a gross rental of 5% (and mortgages are 7%+ here), because he's absolutely convinced that prices (and rentals) are going to appreciate at 5% or more from now on. He's even told me he expects bigger gains over the next couple of years "to make up for 2004 and 2005".

I have tried to convince him that housing is an overpriced asset here, but it's like talking to a brick wall. I don't bother any more, just wish him well.

exactly why the crash is going to be hard, thats dotcom bubble mentality, you cant loose even if your loosing money at the moment, because everything will go up in value for ever :P

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Does anybody have any recent figures on the number of houses bought for BTL and the number of BTL houses sold to homeowners? This could produce a clear picture on the real direction BTL is going. Factor out BTL houses that are sold to another BTL landlord because this is a change of hands rather than a change of use.

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One thing that the BTL brigade seem to overlook is that for tax purposes, your excess mortgage interest can only be set against future rental income: when (if!) you make a capital gain, it's your net gain that's taxed - ie net proceeds less capital cost of the property, with no deduction for the interest. Some BTLers try to use the main residence exemption, so some or all of their gain is exempted*. However anyone with a lot of properties could find this difficult - so the net gain, when you take into account all these costs, isn't going to be that great, even if you bought when the market was a lot less frothy.

Any loss is exempted too - so if you misjudge, you could find that a gain on one property isn't sheltered by a loss on another as you can't actually use that loss... I remember this problem from the last property dip.

Edited by Bedsprings

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  • 301 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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