Brexit What Happens Next Thread ---multiple merged threads.

[Staffsknot]

4 minutes ago, Dave Beans said:

It wouldn't look good for the EU though.. Would that be seen as a measurable response?

If applied solely to items checks should be being applied to in NI yes. It would standardise the regime that those products should not be in EU unchecked and as it is possible they could be, provide clarity to business that none should be purchased.

Ensures integrity of ECM.

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[OnionTerror]

4 minutes ago, Staffsknot said:

If applied solely to items checks should be being applied to in NI yes. It would standardise the regime that those products should not be in EU unchecked and as it is possible they could be, provide clarity to business that none should be purchased.

Ensures integrity of ECM.

It would cause port chaos.. perhaps not a good look..

[pig]

25 minutes ago, Dave Beans said:

If the UK doesn't play ball, it could lead to the EU having to suspend parts of the agreement, which it wouldn't want to do permanently as it would put a hole in their frontier.  A trade war wouldn't help either... 

I cant help but think all those claims of  generosity and flexibility are simply the EU paving their way to a more serious confrontation.

[yelims]

14 minutes ago, Dave Beans said:

It wouldn't look good for the EU though.. Would that be seen as a measurable response?

As I pointed out in quite detail a page back. EU can respond whichever way it wants if UK breaks the agreement.

Thi I suspect it be last resort, Boris government might be toppled long before this stage is reached as realisation dawns that Tories want to restart a civil war in their own province by ripping up GFA

[zugzwang]

2 minutes ago, yelims said:

As I pointed out in quite detail a page back. EU can respond whichever way it wants if UK breaks the agreement.

Thi I suspect it be last resort, Boris government might be toppled long before this stage is reached as realisation dawns that Tories want to restart a civil war in their own province by ripping up GFA

 

Johnson is a menace to himself, this country and the entire world. The comparisons that were made with Trump were prophetic. Anything that can force his departure should be welcomed.

[yelims]

Anyways legal proceedings will begin shortly, expect yet another uturn from uk government 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-07-22/eu-to-escalate-legal-action-against-u-k-over-northern-ireland

Edited July 23, 2021 by yelims

[Staffsknot]

28 minutes ago, Dave Beans said:

It would cause port chaos.. perhaps not a good look..

Nor is asking Norway to pay to send items in while Britain does as it feels.

Look is irrelevant - it wasn't a good look to withdraw equivolence from Switzerland but they did it

[yelims]

1 hour ago, Dave Beans said:

It would cause port chaos.. perhaps not a good look..

Chaos in UK who are not an EU state but a belligerent non cooperative state which wants to undo a deal which was given democratic mandate by UK population, approved by the queen and signed half a year ago.

Now that UK has left no one outside UK gives two tosses about what UK tabloids might think, what matters is what UK population wants and very clearly it was to get Brexit Done via this deal which was signed.

Is there a democratic mandate to undo this deal? Perhaps a referendum is in order or another election eh? But wait Brexiteers told us for years that it’s undemocratic to keep asking people their opinions 😂

Edited July 23, 2021 by yelims

[dugsbody]

1 hour ago, Dave Beans said:

It would cause port chaos.. perhaps not a good look..

To who? The UK is a lost cause to the EU and has demonstrated it is hostile.

Brits have this remarkably insular world view where they overestimate their importance to the people outside of our island. Most people and media in the EU have moved on, they don't care about UK's internal politics, which is what this is all about.

The Tory party will continue to antagonise the EU because it is good for their popularity with a particular voting demographic.

The rest of the world doesn't care either.

My guess is the EU will just treat this with as light a touch as possible because there is no point wasting resources on a nation that isn't going to stop anyway.

[thecrashingisles]

5 hours ago, dugsbody said:

More hostage taking.

"You better give us what we want or it might result in terrorism in NI again".

You are entitled to an opinion and you're entitled to think mine is blinded and wrong. But in the end we can observe reality and judge. My opinion, years back, was that the Tories would never be satisfied with just "brexit" because they know that it was based on lies and they needed to keep people from looking too closely. Becuse of that, I predicted they would keep blaming the EU and remainers. My prediction has come true. It might be coincidence, but I think not.

We can keep observing reality to see whose current view is correct, yours or mine.

 

Hostage taking, you say?

 

 

[Dweller]

Had a quick look I don't think anyone else has posted this. 

Loved Fintan O'Toole's articles all the way through Brexit. 

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/jul/23/northern-ireland-protocol-boris-johnson-oven-ready-deal-sausage

[Dweller]

2 hours ago, zugzwang said:

 

Johnson is a menace to himself, this country and the entire world. The comparisons that were made with Trump were prophetic. Anything that can force his departure should be welcomed.

We must not forget though that Boris is only the front man of the Brady bunch/the Baker boys / ERG/CRG/NRG 

 

 

[yelims]

17 minutes ago, thecrashingisles said:

Hostage taking, you say?

 

 

Hey I am still waiting your explanation of how it is ok to undo the double mandated Will of the people (first Brexit referendum and second last election with mandate of get Brexit done)

 

Are you ok with this breach of the democratic mandate so recently given? Do you think UK should hold another referendum on this question and/or another election? If answer is yes why was it not ok then to hold another referendum on Brexit and/or clarifying type of brexit people want?

 

I’ll keep asking until you square this circle or admit to being a fascist chancer who doesn’t give a shite about democratic process.

[Staffsknot]

23 minutes ago, thecrashingisles said:

Hostage taking, you say?

 

 

Well taking something massively out of context there - at the time it was saying this is a sensitive issue, don't think you can fudge it...

Or are you implying the Ireland was holding the EU hostage?

[thecrashingisles]

3 hours ago, Staffsknot said:

Without the integrity of the ECM the EU is stuffed as an idea. It creates a precedent if Britain can do what it wants.

If its FTA cancelled with Britain or integrity of ECM compronised its not going to be the latter.

Cancelling the FTA with the UK doesn't actually solve the problem of maintaining the integrity of the customs union while upholding the GFA. Assume that they fail to coerce the UK into implementing an Irish sea border. What then?

Edited July 23, 2021 by thecrashingisles

[yelims]

8 minutes ago, thecrashingisles said:

Cancelling the FTA with the UK doesn't actually solve the problem of maintaining the integrity of the customs union while upholding the GFA. Assume that they fail to coerce the UK into implementing an Irish sea border. What then?

The Will of the people states that UK will operate a border in Irish Sea, why do you hate democracy 

[thecrashingisles]

32 minutes ago, Staffsknot said:

Well taking something massively out of context there - at the time it was saying this is a sensitive issue, don't think you can fudge it...

Or are you implying the Ireland was holding the EU hostage?

I'm suggesting that the symmetrical nature of the problem was ignored because of the focus on nationalist terrorism.

[yelims]

1 minute ago, thecrashingisles said:

I'm suggesting that the symmetrical nature of the problem was ignored because of the focus on nationalist terrorism.

I am suggesting that problem was created by partitioning Ireland 100 years back

 

still waiting on your response as to why you think it’s ok to 💩 on Will of the People 

[thecrashingisles]

Just now, yelims said:

I am suggesting that problem was created by partitioning Ireland 100 years back

You can blame the fascist uprising that you still worship for that.

[yelims]

4 minutes ago, thecrashingisles said:

You can blame the fascist uprising that you still worship for that.

It was the Will of the People of Ireland but your government wanted to keep a part of the island against their wish

 

anyways why do you ignore the Will of the people of UK and your Queen who wanted and voted and signed off on this Brexit deal?

Edited July 23, 2021 by yelims

[thecrashingisles]

5 minutes ago, yelims said:

It was the Will of the People of Ireland but your government wanted to keep a part of the island against their wish

 

anyways why do you ignore the Will of the people of UK and your Queen who wanted and voted and signed off on this Brexit deal?

You mean the deal that says NI is part of the customs territory of the UK and must benefit from the UK's independent trade policy, and that the EU is obliged to facilitate trade between NI and GB? When will the EU uphold its end of the deal?

[yelims]

8 minutes ago, thecrashingisles said:

You mean the deal that says NI is part of the customs territory of the UK and must benefit from the UK's independent trade policy, and that the EU is obliged to facilitate trade between NI and GB? When will the EU uphold its end of the deal?

EU is doing just that, the NI protocol also states NI authorities have to inspect goods in NI ports 

when will UK uphold its end of deal?

 

So no answer to the Will of the people conundrum? I have your balls in a grip and will keep squeezing until you admit Brexiteers are hypocrites who don’t give a toss about Will of the People 

[thecrashingisles]

4 minutes ago, yelims said:

EU is doing just that, the NI protocol also states NI authorities have to inspect goods in NI ports 

when will UK uphold its end of deal?

 

So no answer to the Will of the people conundrum? I have your balls in a grip and will keep squeezing until you admit Brexiteers are hypocrites who don’t give a toss about Will of the People 

The will of the people isn't a valid concept in a representative democracy. People have individual wills.

[Staffsknot]

31 minutes ago, thecrashingisles said:

Cancelling the FTA with the UK doesn't actually solve the problem of maintaining the integrity of the customs union while upholding the GFA. Assume that they fail to coerce the UK into implementing an Irish sea border. What then?

You are on WTO rules and its the UK's obligation to impose checks.

Its not coercion its what the No Dealers wanted and seem hell bent on still getting.

You keep thinking the EU nations are going to do what is in Britain's best interest to the detriment of themselves.

You can't see past the narrow angle of they'll give us what we want.

Think what you've said through logically - if anything stamped Made In Britain cannot be bought in the EU they have ECM integrity sans border. There will be attempts at illegality sure, like buying a set of Christmas tree lights off Ebay and they come direct from China claiming cost of £10. But most trade is between legitimate sources and bingo you lanced the boil.

Think through what you are saying objectively not we can have the unicorn - you are saying every EU nation needs to pay in to the EU along with others that pay for access, but they all need to give in so Britain can do as pleases. No it won't happen.

So now here's a question for you - if the EU doesn't budge and just keeps referring to courts and getting clear cut cases racking up fines against UK. What does the UK do?