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Brexit What Happens Next Thread ---multiple merged threads.


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1 hour ago, yelims said:

He wants every country in world to have same rate. Him and every president before him bang this drum including Trump.
 

Large MNCs actually want this as the alternative is a minefield of digital taxes, small to medium companies on other hand be lucky to make a profit and worry about tax, there’s a million ways to reduce corporate tax liability to next to zero (as companies in uk and France do) anyways so he’s wasting time.

 

Anyways you are still I see trying to deflect from hard punching points I made, where on the advisory referendum did it say that GFA will be ripped up unilaterally by UK?

So why are Amazon and eBay so keen to book their profits in low CT countries?

In the referendum, both sides, when being reasonable, agreed that electronic customs would make light work of the Irish border.  The UK stated many times we would not be putting in a hard border.

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I do.   https://twitter.com/housepricemania

1409 pages....you guys should have your own forum !!!

Oh OK. Shame that really, but hey it looks like @IMHAL helped us both out. Nice repost though, thanks ! Any thoughts ?  

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16 hours ago, kzb said:

So why are Amazon and eBay so keen to book their profits in low CT countries?

In the referendum, both sides, when being reasonable, agreed that electronic customs would make light work of the Irish border.  The UK stated many times we would not be putting in a hard border.

You still going on about non existent software?

 

how many billions uk spent on Covid tracking app remind us again and how that continues to be screwed up 

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LoL. Yes, this magical IT border solution whilst companies in the EU have a free shot at exporting to the UK. Meanwhile business in the UK are faced with no end of problems exporting.

Why's that?

Complete and utter Brexit bollcks. 

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That’s one thing Brexiteers don’t get their promises of unicorns means nothing 

people in uk might think it’s ok for their politicians to lie time and time again or do u turns on “best deal ever” etc

but here in Europe we don’t have to put up with ******wittery from Brexiteers as uk is a 3rd country, any trust in cooperation and promises has been demolished, UK is now in same basket as Turkey and Russia a crazy authoritarian state that can’t be trusted.

 

Here in real world we deal in facts not tabloid lies

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2 hours ago, miguel said:

LoL. Yes, this magical IT border solution whilst companies in the EU have a free shot at exporting to the UK. Meanwhile business in the UK are faced with no end of problems exporting.

Why's that?

Complete and utter Brexit bollcks. 

Exports to France were at 107% in March.

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2 hours ago, yelims said:

You still going on about non existent software?

 

how many billions uk spent on Covid tracking app remind us again and how that continues to be screwed up 

The track n trace spending reported at £37bn is no such thing.  That was the money made available but "only" about 3 or 4 billion has actually been spent.  I agree this is bad enough, but it's not £37bn.

That software should've been up and running.  They had years to develop a system with all kinds of options incorporated, so they were ready for anything.

My friend who does some small-business import/export still insists borders don't exist for large companies and they haven't for many years.

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1 hour ago, kzb said:

The track n trace spending reported at £37bn is no such thing.  That was the money made available but "only" about 3 or 4 billion has actually been spent.  I agree this is bad enough, but it's not £37bn.

That software should've been up and running.  They had years to develop a system with all kinds of options incorporated, so they were ready for anything.

My friend who does some small-business import/export still insists borders don't exist for large companies and they haven't for many years.

Track and trace in Ireland cost under a million...

you just don’t get it rest of world doesn’t trust anything Brexiteer Tories say, UK has completely and totally squandered any trust as all that comes out is hot air out of our “colleagues in London “ rears

promises mean nothing, we are still waiting for uk to implement anything of what Boris agreed to 4-5 months ago

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2 hours ago, kzb said:

Exports to France were at 107% in March.

Those figures are out very prompt! Have you a link? Are they counting actual goods or empty lorries?Let's assume they are true. Pretty meaningless unless we know the numbers coming the other way. Then again the magical IT solution obviously doesn't exist, hence why customs (non) control are waving their hands at countless lorries. 

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1 hour ago, yelims said:

Track and trace in Ireland cost under a million...

you just don’t get it rest of world doesn’t trust anything Brexiteer Tories say, UK has completely and totally squandered any trust as all that comes out is hot air out of our “colleagues in London “ rears

promises mean nothing, we are still waiting for uk to implement anything of what Boris agreed to 4-5 months ago

You need to understand that there is a world beyond Ireland, and your perceptions are not the world's perceptions.

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5 minutes ago, thecrashingisles said:

You need to understand that there is a world beyond Ireland, and your perceptions are not the world's perceptions.

Just pointing out an example of how incompetent and corrupt Tories are, they spent billions and months instead of thousands and weeks and still not working https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/science-and-disease/coronavirus-news-lockdown-rules-12-april-easing-covid-vaccine/

 

and these are people promising magical IT systems that are nowhere to be seen 4 months after full Brexit 

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1 minute ago, thecrashingisles said:

You need to understand that there is a world beyond Ireland, and your perceptions are not the world's perceptions.

If they think about it at all, the perceptions are generally a bit of bafflement at what the UK was thinking. They don't really get it.

People who don't live here don't see the day to day life of living under a right wing dominated tabloid press. They don't understand the level of distrust the average English person has for Europe or how much they dislike Eastern European immigration.

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5 minutes ago, dugsbody said:

If they think about it at all, the perceptions are generally a bit of bafflement at what the UK was thinking. They don't really get it.

People who don't live here don't see the day to day life of living under a right wing dominated tabloid press. They don't understand the level of distrust the average English person has for Europe or how much they dislike Eastern European immigration.

It’s a case of being outside looking in and not subject to the tabloid reality distortion field the issues UK has which led to brexit are obvious.

 

In my line of work we do root cause analysis of any issues in production. Applying same principle to a state on path to authoritarianism its obvious that there is a mix of root causes:

* rabid media who propagandise for elites and government 

* deeply flawed democracy (Fptp, no constitution, hereditary elites, no regular direct democracy referendums)

* government that takes advantage of flaws in above and wields propaganda to stir sheeple into frenzy over the issues of week, usually to distract from incredible corruption, stupidity and inefficiency. Every problem is the fault of mythical “others” be it EU, immigrants or weak opposition 

 

Brexit solves none of above and makes things worse

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1 hour ago, miguel said:

Those figures are out very prompt! Have you a link? Are they counting actual goods or empty lorries?Let's assume they are true. Pretty meaningless unless we know the numbers coming the other way. Then again the magical IT solution obviously doesn't exist, hence why customs (non) control are waving their hands at countless lorries. 

I showed you all this yesterday.  It's actually French, so it must be the truth, none of the lying British involved.

https://lekiosque.finances.gouv.fr/fichiers/etudes/tableaux/ee_90.pdf

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21 hours ago, kzb said:

So why are Amazon and eBay so keen to book their profits in low CT countries?

In the referendum, both sides, when being reasonable, agreed that electronic customs would make light work of the Irish border.  The UK stated many times we would not be putting in a hard border.

Back in the real world a simple old fashioned customs system is still far from ready, still failing in basic beta testing.

When do you think the advanced near magical system required to do away with the border would have been implemented (are you happy with the high level of surveillance that would have come with it). 

Perhaps we should have gone with it and put Brexit on hold until it was ready.

 

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18 minutes ago, yelims said:

It’s a case of being outside looking in and not subject to the tabloid reality distortion field the issues UK has which led to brexit are obvious.

 

In my line of work we do root cause analysis of any issues in production. Applying same principle to a state on path to authoritarianism its obvious that there is a mix of root causes:

* rabid media who propagandise for elites and government 

* deeply flawed democracy (Fptp, no constitution, hereditary elites, no regular direct democracy referendums)

* government that takes advantage of flaws in above and wields propaganda to stir sheeple into frenzy over the issues of week, usually to distract from incredible corruption, stupidity and inefficiency. Every problem is the fault of mythical “others” be it EU, immigrants or weak opposition 

 

Brexit solves none of above and makes things worse

I could have written the post above myself. Agree completely.

One of the things that makes me laugh the most (and then cry) is this claim that people voted for brexit to get rid of the status quo. The status quo is our Tory puppet masters, has been for much longer than the EU. They voted to hand more power to our corrupt system.

 

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7 minutes ago, Confusion of VIs said:

Perhaps we should have gone with it and put Brexit on hold until it was ready.

If you asked brexiters if they would have put brexit on hold until the IT system could cope with all customs and other checks in a 90% good enough manner, I think you'd have found out their real belief in such a system 🤣

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1 hour ago, skinnylattej said:

Up 107% against when? March 2020 we were locked down, so do you mean March 2019?

It looks like they used the 2nd half of 2020 to estimate a "reference level", using various corrections.  It says the 2nd half of 2020 was better to use for this purpose precisely because of lockdowns in the first half of the year.

Whether we believe in the precise number or not, it show things are bouncing back.  If you look at the actual report it has a plot going back to 2018.

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34 minutes ago, kzb said:

It looks like they used the 2nd half of 2020 to estimate a "reference level", using various corrections.  It says the 2nd half of 2020 was better to use for this purpose precisely because of lockdowns in the first half of the year.

Whether we believe in the precise number or not, it show things are bouncing back.  If you look at the actual report it has a plot going back to 2018.

Excellent. So now we just need to reinstate freedom of movement and things will be back to how they were and we can all feel happy that we've left the EU.

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2 hours ago, Confusion of VIs said:

Back in the real world a simple old fashioned customs system is still far from ready, still failing in basic beta testing.

When do you think the advanced near magical system required to do away with the border would have been implemented (are you happy with the high level of surveillance that would have come with it). 

Perhaps we should have gone with it and put Brexit on hold until it was ready.

 

 

Presumably we need the same apparatus to trade with the US/ROW as we now do with the EU.

Therefore it all should have been in existence anyway.

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4 minutes ago, Gigantic Purple Slug said:

 

Presumably we need the same apparatus to trade with the US/ROW as we now do with the EU.

Therefore it all should have been in existence anyway.

Yes but this was all about making it look like there is no border in the special case of Ireland.

It's completely ridiculous because of course there was a border anyway.

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15 minutes ago, Gigantic Purple Slug said:

 

Presumably we need the same apparatus to trade with the US/ROW as we now do with the EU.

Therefore it all should have been in existence anyway.

We don't have a comprehensive trade deal with the US or ROW. These checks are needed to take advantage of the deeper trade agreed with the EU.

Hard to explain the lack of systems and having to wave trucks through unchecked at a visible hard border like Dover. That should have been a straightforward piece of work.

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