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Brexit What Happens Next Thread ---multiple merged threads.


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1 minute ago, Peter Hun said:

They are selling it for as low as $1.78. India has got a free license to make billions of doses.

So yes, no profit. 

EU/UK paying £18-20 for Pfizer vaccine in comparison

It is not so clear. They can charge up 20% over goods cost and they can make a call the pandemic is over and start making profit. 

https://www.ft.com/content/e359159b-105c-407e-b1be-0c7a1ddb654b

This still doesn't explain why the price varies so much. South Africa for an example pays twice the EU price. 

For me it looks like they build the production capacity with money they receive now, which they will use later for 'more commercial" production.   

 

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I do.   https://twitter.com/housepricemania

1409 pages....you guys should have your own forum !!!

Oh OK. Shame that really, but hey it looks like @IMHAL helped us both out. Nice repost though, thanks ! Any thoughts ?  

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53 minutes ago, rollover said:

EU invested billions to help develop the world's first COVID-19 vaccin

Who did they pay all this money too, it wasn't AZN.  It doesn't take billions to develop one vaccine and UK paid AZN.

 

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1 hour ago, Confusion of VIs said:

I presume that if it's an area of National competency they speak to the National representative and if its an area of EU competency they speak to the EU representative.

Not that hard is it?  

It is one of those things that is straightforward in principle but there are all kinds of problems in reality.  What about if both competencies are involved?

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58 minutes ago, rollover said:

EU invested billions to help develop the world's first COVID-19 vaccines.

On top of this

The EU had initially ordered up to 400 million doses of the AstraZeneca vaccine for $2.16 (€1.78).

AstraZeneca is not a charity South Africa will be paying $5.25 per dose.

They are doing this for charity, maybe SA is demanding liability coverage.

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12 hours ago, kzb said:

I was responding to the Richard Madeley accusation.   However I admit AB may not be giving a good case in that report.

Try this.

http://www.thecityforbritain.org.uk/

Notice I am not saying anything about whether I agree with it, just answering the claim that there are not many saying financial services could be better off not going for equivalence.  Clearly there are some.

As the article was written before our exit deal was agreed it is not really relevant, also nowhere does it claim we will be a bigger global player after Brexit.

The truth is no one is saying Brexit will be good for London, not catastrophic is about as far as most will go 

e.g. City of London chief: Brexit impact 'not at all catastrophic' as Square Mile will thrive without EU access 

London will continue to be an important finance hub but its days of rivalling New York and aiming to be the worlds number 1 finance centre are over. 

The big question for the UK is what happens when London is no longer able to subsidise the rest of the UK by £50bn a year. Between Brexit and Covid I doubt that going forward there will be any spare money to distribute.    

In a tragic twist of irony, the scale of the EU payments were central to the Leave campaign’s case for Brexit and “taking back control of our money” and it now looks like the cost of Brexit itself is going to be significantly higher than all of those budget contributions over the past half-century – even before the UK actually leaves the free trading arrangement of the single market at the end of 2020.   

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1 hour ago, dugsbody said:

Well, my guess is they manage it by not being a state run by rabid europhobes and not having to pander to a braindead europhobe voting base.

OK now you mention it, what exactly are those EU diplomats actually doing?  It seems to me the national embassies will deal with legitimate issues, so what are the EU diplomats actually doing?

Why do they need diplomatic immunity?  Could there be bribery and corruption involved?

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1 minute ago, kzb said:

Why do they need diplomatic immunity?  Could there be bribery and corruption involved?

Do British Embassy staff commit bribery, corruption, extortion and murder around the world ?

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1 minute ago, Peter Hun said:

Do British Embassy staff commit bribery, corruption, extortion and murder around the world ?

They have legit business as well.  I am simply asking what these EU diplomats actually do, especially in the poorer countries.

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6 minutes ago, Confusion of VIs said:

As the article was written before our exit deal was agreed it is not really relevant, also nowhere does it claim we will be a bigger global player after Brexit.

The truth is no one is saying Brexit will be good for London, not catastrophic is about as far as most will go 

e.g. City of London chief: Brexit impact 'not at all catastrophic' as Square Mile will thrive without EU access 

London will continue to be an important finance hub but its days of rivalling New York and aiming to be the worlds number 1 finance centre are over. 

The big question for the UK is what happens when London is no longer able to subsidise the rest of the UK by £50bn a year. Between Brexit and Covid I doubt that going forward there will be any spare money to distribute.    

In a tragic twist of irony, the scale of the EU payments were central to the Leave campaign’s case for Brexit and “taking back control of our money” and it now looks like the cost of Brexit itself is going to be significantly higher than all of those budget contributions over the past half-century – even before the UK actually leaves the free trading arrangement of the single market at the end of 2020.   

We'll just have to see won't we.

I will just comment that some mention GDP and state spending in the same breath.  The estimated cost to GDP is being compared to state contributions raised by borrowing and taxes.  Not the same.

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It looks like the EU will get vaccines

 

"Stella Kyriakides told a news conference that the company had legal obligations to comply with the contract."

The European Union health commissioner has said that AstraZeneca has committed to providing the bloc with doses from four plants, including two in Britain, Reuters reports.

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5 hours ago, MancTom said:

This is exactly how the AZ CEO has explained it. We signed the contract first and they guaranteed supply to us from the UK factory. EU signed up 3 months later and was told "best effort" to get it running by March, not a guarantee. So legally AZ cannot just take vaccine manufactured in the UK and give it to the EU.

As I understand it the vaccine needs to be refrigerated.

We also have an issue with fish and meat products exported to the EU being refused.

Perhaps sending vaccine over a little at a time with the fish/meat exports would be a good idea. If they will not let the goods in we return it.

Think like a jobs worth EU bureaucrat?

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2 hours ago, rollover said:

It looks like the EU will get vaccines

 

"Stella Kyriakides told a news conference that the company had legal obligations to comply with the contract."

The European Union health commissioner has said that AstraZeneca has committed to providing the bloc with doses from four plants, including two in Britain, Reuters reports.

Our government says they have the legal claim to those vaccines. How exactly do they plan to export these vaccines?

Not quite what they said anyway:

"Kyriakides said that under its contract with AstraZeneca, four European plants were named as suppliers and two of those were based in the UK, and she expected them to work for EU citizens."

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/27/eu-covid-vaccine-row-astrazeneca-european-commission

Both AZ and Boris have said a flat out no to that already today.

Edited by MancTom
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UK and all others countries Pandemic laws allows the vaccines to be blocked from export, exactly as  the EU has threatened.

The contract becomes meaningless in that case.

Pretty sure AZN will not have provided a guaranteed delivery when their production resources were already committed.

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Kyriakides said the EU is demanding that AstraZeneca make use of all five of its production facilities — including two in the U.K. and three on the Continent — to fulfill the Commission's purchase contracts.

"We reject the logic of first come, first served," she said. "That may work at the neighborhood butcher’s but not in contracts and not in our advanced purchase agreements."

She said that the Commission and AstraZeneca signed an advanced purchase agreement — which an EU official said was worth €336 million — to build manufacturing capacity "so they can deliver a certain volume of doses the day [the vaccine] is authorized," a decision expected on Friday.

"The logic of these agreements is as valid then as it is now," she continued. "We provide a de-risking investment upfront, in order to get a binding commitment from the company to pre-produce even before it gets authorization. Not being able to ensure manufacturing capacity is against the letter and the spirit of our agreement."

Kyriakides also raised again the suspicion that AstraZeneca can't meet its first quarter orders because it sold doses to other countries.

politico

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21 minutes ago, Peter Hun said:

UK and all others countries Pandemic laws allows the vaccines to be blocked from export, exactly as  the EU has threatened.

That sounds about right, which means that if the Uk refuses to cooperate it runs the risk of having to rely much more heavilly on only Uk supplies. It's is another begger thy neighbour policy that will, IMO, backfire down the road. 

21 minutes ago, Peter Hun said:

The contract becomes meaningless in that case.

Also correct.

 

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"We reject the logic of first come, first served," she said. "That may work at the neighborhood butcher’s but not in contracts and not in our advanced purchase agreements."

Fine, the UK can push in front of you, as you don't acknowledge the concept of a queue.

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24 minutes ago, Peter Hun said:

Its idle waffle, the UK won't allows export. The commission will have to publish the contract if it expects to win any moral argument.

Yes, it is unlikely the EU will get any doses from the UK soon. 

The EU can block\control exports from the EU and sue AZ for the breach of the contract. 

In the longer term this adds more negative points to the UK score in EU's books. It is going to be interesting.      

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In Spain, old Franco law hampers post-Brexit house sales to Britons

A 1975 measure that still endures will now affect UK property buyers as non-EU residents in Spain, according to estate agents in the south of Alicante province

 

The legislation states that future residents must apply for the Defense Ministry’s permit alongside documentation that includes a sworn translation of a criminal record certificate from their country, two photographs and a certified photocopy of their passport. The law was proposed within the context of the Cold War when Spain had not yet joined either the European Union or the defense alliance NATO, “and they didn’t have technologies like the internet,” noted Ros. The application goes through the Captaincy General of Barcelona and processing has, until now, taken between four to six months. However, it could now take longer as the usual 150 annual requests for the province of Alicante from non-EU citizens are about to multiply and, in Ros’ opinion, could extend the process to anything up to a year.

https://english.elpais.com/brexit/2021-01-25/in-spain-old-franco-law-hampers-post-brexit-house-sales-to-britons.html

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2 hours ago, Lord D'arcy Pew said:

As I understand it the vaccine needs to be refrigerated.

We also have an issue with fish and meat products exported to the EU being refused.

Perhaps sending vaccine over a little at a time with the fish/meat exports would be a good idea. If they will not let the goods in we return it.

Think like a jobs worth EU bureaucrat?

Or we could just act like grown ups, fill in the paperwork we asked for correctly and abide by our commitments. 

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5 minutes ago, slawek said:

Yes, it is unlikely the EU will get any doses from the UK soon. 

The EU can block\control exports from the EU and sue AZ for the breach of the contract. 

In the longer term this adds more negative points to the UK score in EU's books. It is going to be interesting.      

AZN chairman says the contract does not guarantee delivery, why would it, so I cannot see any legal action succeeding. 

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11 minutes ago, Peter Hun said:

Fine, the UK can push in front of you, as you don't acknowledge the concept of a queue.

I thinking something else may go wrong the UK trying to avoid right now.

EU could tell/order Astrazeneca to fulfil contract and deliver all 80 million vaccines on time from all of its EU production facilities.

And Astrazeneca, as Boris once said, can go whistle and fulfill other customers contracts from it's remaining two UK facilities.

Guess who will come short and going to wait for vaccine seemingly endless?

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4 minutes ago, Peter Hun said:

AZN chairman says the contract does not guarantee delivery, why would it, so I cannot see any legal action succeeding. 

The EU acknowledged that such "best effort" clauses are included in the contract. According to the authority, this does not release AstraZeneca from the delivery obligations, said Kyriakides. On the contrary, such clauses are common in all contracts for products that are not yet on the market.

https://www.bild.de/politik/ausland/politik-inland/zoff-zwischen-eu-und-astrazeneca-spitzt-sich-zu-erster-politiker-spricht-von-imp-75098328.bild.html

 

So  the clause is in the contract, but the EU thinks they can ignore it. LoL.

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7 minutes ago, rollover said:

I thinking something else may go wrong the UK trying to avoid right now.

EU could tell/order Astrazeneca to fulfil contract and deliver all 80 million vaccines on time from all of its EU production facilities.

And Astrazeneca, as Boris once said, can go whistle and fulfill other customers contracts from it's remaining two UK facilities.

Guess who will come short and going to wait for vaccine seemingly endless?

Not the UK. As AZN made clear, manufacturing is local for each market. The problem if for the EU supply.

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On 24/01/2021 at 15:17, dances with sheeple said:

 

THE EU just gave banking equivalence to US banks. This will f London badly. 

 

No idea e why it's quoting you, sorry.

 

Edited by Snafu
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