rollover Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 I did! 🙂 But you are right, it is an awful Remainer echo chamber and I wouldn't count myself as being 'on this thread' so to speak. I pop in occasionally to say hello, and to put them in their place, but no real reason to after 31st Jan this year. There is some good value here though and I quite enjoy some of the insanity of the posters. Very excitable they are 😂 Unusually high number of dispirited and argumentative Brexiters on this thread today. Just wondering, what could possibly go wrong with Brexit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brendan110_0 Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 But try again: is there any single person on this thread that actually voted for brexit? Anyone at all? It's an echo chamber test... I voted leave as part of my vote bottom campaign (X in bottom box for 20 years now). 50:50 toss stay/leave depending on the print, I did draw the line when Tommy Robinson was bottom of the slip in the last general election though! Join the campaign and vote bottom at the next general election. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rollover Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 They make good ish arguments about what we've lost , but tend to ignore what brexiters were unhappy about and Europe's problems. And that of course is why people voted brexit. But don't you think what we wanted inside Europe is pretty much what several other countries wanted? Less homogenization basically. We threw our toys out of the pram, but since Europe's reaction has been to try and kick us on our way out ( or subjugate us in perpetuity) we've just been forced further apart over time. Im romantic enough to believe that if we'd had a great government, we could have reformed Europe completely instead of leaving. Did really people know what they voted for? I still don't know what does Brexit mean? But hopefully on 1st January 2021 Boris will tell us all what Brexit is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonsieurCopperCrutch Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 I'm not sure he was wrong completely. I think England's whole psyche is a bit dog in the mangerish about Europe. And then there's maritime vs continental. England needed to feel different. Very island mentality. Not bad, just needed to be accommodated. Wasn't of course. When I asked slawek where he was from he accused me (more or less) of being a bigot. I'm Canadian originally. Dual citizen. Can't completely identify with any country any more. England is not an island. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huggy Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 Only because the many Leavers who used to be on here dropped away as it gradually dawned on them that all their predictions were wrong and Brexit had gone pretty much as the Remainers had predicted it would. Your continuing popping in just cements your position as the slowest learner. This comment! These are the reasons I enjoy this thread very much. Basically after winning their Brexit, Leavers don't bother arguing anymore because they've suddenly realised they're wrong and Remainers were right. Love it 😄 In a normal thread I would ask what predictions were proved wrong, and which were proved right, but I suspect that there may be a tiny little bit of (accidental oversight of course) cherry picking of these items. Remember one year and one day ago where no one predicted that excellent result? I remember, so I won't ask that question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IMHAL Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 (edited) In a normal thread I would ask what predictions were proved wrong, and which were proved right, but I suspect that there may be a tiny little bit of (accidental oversight of course) cherry picking of these items. Remember one year and one day ago where no one predicted that excellent result? I remember, so I won't ask that question. Who is proved right or wrong? Time will tell my furry friend. Too early to celebrate. Winning a referendum is the first stage, making sure that people are happy with the result is the hard part. All down to you guys now. One thing for sure....everyone is watching. Will Brexit deliver a meaningfully better life for the ordinary person on the street? They are the ones who will decide. The arrogance of thinking that a referendum result equates to positive outcome is a mistake. Edited December 13, 2020 by IMHAL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huggy Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 They make good ish arguments about what we've lost , but tend to ignore what brexiters were unhappy about and Europe's problems. And that of course is why people voted brexit. But don't you think what we wanted inside Europe is pretty much what several other countries wanted? Less homogenization basically. We threw our toys out of the pram, but since Europe's reaction has been to try and kick us on our way out ( or subjugate us in perpetuity) we've just been forced further apart over time. Im romantic enough to believe that if we'd had a great government, we could have reformed Europe completely instead of leaving. The EU is just a rule making body, and all Leavers did was to say they thought they had fewer benefits than costs. In most parts of life, if I have anything that is costing me more than it benefits me then I get shot of it as soon as possible. That's all that really happened, no big deal. I don't think it was even as bad as throwing toys out of the pram. I'm sure many weren't that emotional about it, like when I change jobs, get rid of a clapped out car, or dump a clingy bird, it's just a financial/mental benefit. The next job, car, burd might be even more stressful, expensive or neurotic, but I feel you cannot avoid making that brave and decisive decision out of (project) fear. Unusually high number of dispirited and argumentative Brexiters on this thread today. Just wondering, what could possibly go wrong with Brexit? Have a word with them, they should be positive at such an excellent time of year. I know we're all going to starve to death by the 2nd week of January apparently because of NO DEAL HORROR, but we still have pressies to unwrap before then and we get to miss the most unpopular day of the year (3rd Monday in January IIRC). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cocha Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 Only because the many Leavers who used to be on here dropped away as it gradually dawned on them that all their predictions were wrong and Brexit had gone pretty much as the Remainers had predicted it would. Your continuing popping in just cements your position as the slowest learner. It's adamance such as this which keeps drawing me in, along with the classic petulance of "Brexshit" 😊 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Hun Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 A ,lot of Mr & Mrs Northerners don't give a toss about their "right" to live and work and fall in love and whatever else remainers spouted about it. They did care very much about how FOM was putting downward pressure on wages and job security. Thing is, when they spoke up about this, those who did care very much about their "right" (despite only a small %age bothering to take advantage of it) to live and work and fall in love and whatever else remainers spouted about it, just told them they were liars and racists and little englanders and ignored them. I suppose moaning about slightly longer queues at airports for the annual skiing holidays didn't help either. I didn't vote to remain because of FoM, couldn't care about that. I voted to stay in the Single Market and the 50billion per year inward investment that the US etc puts into the UK because of its EU membership. I suppose decades of easy life has turned Brexiteers into softies who think their and the UK's economic success was self earned, just like house price rises were deserved. Too much to expect Brexiteers to understand the economics of EU membership and the demographic bomb, but no politician spent the energy explaining it so what do you expect? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huggy Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 Who is proved right or wrong? Time will tell my furry friend. Too early to celebrate. Winning a referendum is the first stage, making sure that people are happy with the result is the hard part. All down to you guys now. One thing for sure....everyone is watching. Will Brexit deliver a meaningfully better life for the ordinary person on the street? They are the ones who will decide. I try to avoid the ordinary person on the street. They're all very shifty, frequently smell bad, and some of the demented cows even talk to you if you're unlucky. Time will tell though I agree, and I look forward to the result in however many years/decades that will take. I know my position at the time of the referendum and also now, and will be able to compare to my future life once enough data is in. Fingers crossed I'll be pleased! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cocha Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 I didn't vote to remain because of FoM, couldn't care about that. I voted to stay in the Single Market and the 50billion per year inward investment that the US etc puts into the UK because of its EU membership. I suppose decades of easy life has turned Brexiteers into softies who think their and the UK's economic success was self earned, just like house price rises were deserved. Too much to expect Brexiteers to understand the economics of EU membership and the demographic bomb, but no politician spent the energy explaining it so what do you expect? Awww bless, if only you could ruffle my hair too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IMHAL Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 The EU is just a rule making body, and all Leavers did was to say they thought they had fewer benefits than costs. In most parts of life, if I have anything that is costing me more than it benefits me then I get shot of it as soon as possible. That's all that really happened, no big deal. I don't think it was even as bad as throwing toys out of the pram. I'm sure many weren't that emotional about it, like when I change jobs, get rid of a clapped out car, or dump a clingy bird, it's just a financial/mental benefit. The next job, car, burd might be even more stressful, expensive or neurotic, but I feel you cannot avoid making that brave and decisive decision out of (project) fear. Have a word with them, they should be positive at such an excellent time of year. I know we're all going to starve to death by the 2nd week of January apparently because of NO DEAL HORROR, but we still have pressies to unwrap before then and we get to miss the most unpopular day of the year (3rd Monday in January IIRC). These conversations died off years ago. Slow learner I see. We are at the point where leavers get to prove that leaving improves the lives of the people. Down to you guys.....get on with it... no more gas and bluster. Too early for jubilation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IMHAL Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 I try to avoid the ordinary person on the street. They're all very shifty, frequently smell bad, and some of the demented cows even talk to you if you're unlucky. Spoken like a true Brexit man of the people. Time will tell though I agree, and I look forward to the result in however many years/decades that will take. I know my position at the time of the referendum and also now, and will be able to compare to my future life once enough data is in. Fingers crossed I'll be pleased! No, not decades. We have a democracy that changes with the will of the people, it will determine the direction of travel in a few short years. Further or closer to our main market? Down to you guys in the next few years me thinks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24gray24 Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 What homogenisation? If anything is a homgenising force it is American culture, not the EU. I don't know exactly. But there was a distinct feeling that ever closer union meant incremental loss of ... what exactly? I can only sum it up as the Belgians etc becoming less belgian etc and their differences eroded into all becoming a homogenous euro man. American culture: Yes, too much homogenous. And very boring. But... That's more corporate power than anything else. And a strong culture of individual right to be different tends the other way somewhat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pig Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 What happens to the fish when Scotland leaves ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IMHAL Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 The common trait of Brexiteers is the assumption or should I say presumption that winning the referendum is the end of it. No more needs to be done. The arrogance, nonchalance and lack of responsibilty displayed in deliver a better outcome seems to be instilled. It's a pretty short term view, one that I can understand for a group who feels, against all odds, they somehow managed to overcome a Golieth. Celebrations will be shortlived.... I can understand them mmaking the most of it. Now it's time to deliver. That is the real job. Get on with it. Deal, no deal...it's your show. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huggy Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 Spoken like a true Brexit man of the people. No, not decades. We have a democracy that changes with the will of the people, it will determine the direction of travel in a few short years. Further or closer to our main market? Down to you guys in the next few years me thinks. Yes decades (It should be several decades). It took 18 years for those people voting in the 1975 EEC referendum to finally understand that they didn't know what they were voting for (see what I did there, I do impress myself with my clever wit sometimes!) It then took another 22 years for all of that freedom and joy and EU loveliness to cause over half of the voters to say "no thanks" when asked again. Decades old bean, decades. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24gray24 Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 That vague feeling of unease didn't cause brexit by the way, in my view. I don't think any of our differences with Europe were that major (or about money). People thought Brussels was wasteful, and we were being screwed, sure. But they didn't think the Tories were better. (I don't know how Brussels responded to the wasteful charge, but from (vague) memory, whatever they said just boomeranged with ever more examples. ) I think brexit was quite simply people being fed up with decades of austerity plus wanting to stop unlimited immigration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Social Justice League Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 Apparently the deal talks are going to continue until 31st December..........................and then they will be extended until 2021. Best just to keep on having deal discussions forever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Hun Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 Awww bless, if only you could ruffle my hair too. If I could get hold of your hair I'd toss you in the bin.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pig Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 (edited) Apparently the deal talks are going to continue until 31st December..........................and then they will be extended until 2021. Best just to keep on having deal discussions forever. They''ll carry on till we get a deal - its just down to how much pain Johnson wants to inflict on the country and for how long until we get there. Edited December 14, 2020 by pig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Social Justice League Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 It is always best to blame the EU for failures in your life. It saves blaming yourself. And let's face it, there are many failures up north. Down south too. This is why they want to take back control................of whatever Boris and Farage tell them they need to. All a load of toot for simple mids to chew on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Social Justice League Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 "minds" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IMHAL Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 Yes decades (It should be several decades). It took 18 years for those people voting in the 1975 EEC referendum to finally understand that they didn't know what they were voting for (see what I did there, I do impress myself with my clever wit sometimes!) Slow learners are seldom clever enough to make that judgement in the first place... see what I did there. Probably not. It then took another 22 years for all of that freedom and joy and EU loveliness to cause over half of the voters to say "no thanks" when asked again. Decades old bean, decades. Decades of what? No deal, a flimsy deal, brino? The beauty of our system is that we change governments more frequently and that will affect where we end up. Since to don't care which version of brexit you want then you won't mind....and you'll be none to wiser. Ignorance is bliss. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24gray24 Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 If I could get hold of your hair I'd toss you in the bin.. Is it really so unfair that you should pay for your own health insurance in France? Sometimes you come across as a bit irascible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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