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Brexit What Happens Next Thread ---multiple merged threads.

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3 minutes ago, Dorkins said:

That's your defence for Brexit putting obvious HPI and banker-loving swamp creatures in charge? "Let's have a Treasury forecast for a Corbyn government"? What happened to needing to do something radical to break trends?

The same people who are against Brexit want a Corbyn government.  A reason for their being against Brexit is computer models of the economy.  How many more times round this circle shall we go?

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2 minutes ago, kzb said:

The same people who are against Brexit want a Corbyn government.  A reason for their being against Brexit is computer models of the economy.  How many more times round this circle shall we go?

I have no idea where you are going with this computer models of the economy thing. In my opinion macroeconomic forecasts are about as factual as a tip in the 14.40 at Chesterfield from some guy in a pub.

What is factual is that people like Johnson, Rees-Mogg, Raab, Javid, Farage etc come out to bat for the UK financial sector at every opportunity. In my opinion the UK's financial sector has made a lot of dumb loans on residential property that need to be defaulted on in order for house prices to return to the level at which below median income households can buy. Based on their actions and statements to date I do not believe that Johnson etc will allow this to happen. I don't know if Corbyn's Labour will either, but they might.

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10 minutes ago, Dorkins said:

I have no idea where you are going with this computer models of the economy thing. In my opinion macroeconomic forecasts are about as factual as a tip in the 14.40 at Chesterfield from some guy in a pub.

What is factual is that people like Johnson, Rees-Mogg, Raab, Javid, Farage etc come out to bat for the UK financial sector at every opportunity. In my opinion the UK's financial sector has made a lot of dumb loans on residential property that need to be defaulted on in order for house prices to return to the level at which below median income households can buy. Based on their actions and statements to date I do not believe that Johnson etc will allow this to happen. I don't know if Corbyn's Labour will either, but they might.

OK with sentence 2 we are on the same wavelength.  But not with your fellow remainers on here.

2nd para,  they'll all do as they're told.  Otherwise we are Bulgaria and even JC knows this.

 

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13 minutes ago, kzb said:

OK with sentence 2 we are on the same wavelength.  But not with your fellow remainers on here.

2nd para,  they'll all do as they're told.  Otherwise we are Bulgaria and even JC knows this.

I'm pretty sick of being labelled on this thread. How about we drop the tribal crap and just talk to each other as individuals with individual points of view, which is what we all actually are?

I can see you have given up hope that democratically elected governments will ever stand up to the institutions which happen to comprise the financial sector at present in order to protect the best interests of their citizens. I have not. I also don't believe that we will be Bulgaria/Venezuela/the USSR if financial institutions are forced to live with the consequences of their own actions. Indeed I think governments not forcing that to happen is what already has and will continue to harm the average person. Take back control, right?

Edited by Dorkins

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39 minutes ago, kzb said:

The same people who are against Brexit want a Corbyn government.  A reason for their being against Brexit is computer models of the economy.  How many more times round this circle shall we go?

Untrue and untrue.

There are plenty of folk I know that are remainers and hate Corbyn. I was a natural lib dem but used to support Labor locally, I wont until he is gone and is replaced with someone electable.

There are plenty of folk I know that are remainers and are against brexit because they like being members of the EU. Myself included.

I am sure you can find a few that do satisfy your sweeping generalisation, but it isn't everyone. It's also interesting that the usual "80% of people voted for a party that supports Brexit" argument doesn't fit with this either.

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20 minutes ago, Chunketh said:

There are plenty of folk I know that are remainers and are against brexit because they like being members of the EU. Myself included.

The whole discussion would be so much more civilised if most people recognised that that's what it really came down to - some people happen to like the EU, some don't. Unfortunately there are too many who insist that people who don't like what they like must be wrong.

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12 minutes ago, Riedquat said:

The whole discussion would be so much more civilised if most people recognised that that's what it really came down to - some people happen to like the EU, some don't. Unfortunately there are too many who insist that people who don't like what they like must be wrong.

Agreed. It's not for everyone.

I place a lot less emphasis on sovereignty because I simply don't care about it. Most politicians are either useless or criminally corrupt, so why would I care where the power really resides?!  I know others feel differently about it and that's fine.

Other than that, yes it's economics. You don't need to be a genius to see that having no trade deals will be pretty dire in the short term and that with our utter desperation to remedy the situation we will get bent over. It's partially linked to the first point in that our inept / corrupt politicians don't really serve us, so will sell us down the river. Yes we can vote them out but the damage will already be done.

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BJ is running out of breath, excuses and lies for all occasions. And the Brexit blame game must go on

 

Quote

 

Johnson accuses MPs and EU of 'terrible collaboration' over Brexit

Despite the prime minister previously saying the chances of crashing out of the EU were “a million to one” given goodwill on both sides.

Speaking live on Facebook, where he answered pre-selected questions from members of the public, Johnson appeared to be rehearsing an election campaign argument that the EU and pro-remain MPs will be to blame if there is no deal.

“The awful thing is the longer that goes on, the more likely it is of course that we will be forced to leave with a no-deal Brexit.

“That’s not what I want, it’s not what we’re aiming ......

In reality, it is Johnson who is refusing to sit down for talks on a deal with the EU ......

Guardian

 

 

Edited by rollover

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1 hour ago, Riedquat said:

The whole discussion would be so much more civilised if most people recognised that that's what it really came down to - some people happen to like the EU, some don't. Unfortunately there are too many who insist that people who don't like what they like must be wrong.

I have to jump in again and say I have consistently seen Brexit as a scam by some very unsavoury people. To enrich themselves at our expense. I've argued against doing any kind of deal with the USA as it's clear it's detrimental for the vast majority of people here. I've argued against leaving our biggest export block. I've argued against the unnecessary cost of Brexit. I've argued against the damage to the UK's reputation abroad. I've argued there is no vision for the UK post Brexit.

I've argued the problem is here - not anywhere else. That Brexit will do feck-all except make an existing decline much, much faster as there has been no changing of the chocolate soldiers up top. Just shinier wrapping around a shittier product.

Until leavers drop their slave-like admiration of the Brexit cheerleaders and admit these people are just full of shit, either useless or devious connivers - then it will be business as usual after Brexit, but worse.

Notice I have not mentioned the EU once (until now).

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1 hour ago, rollover said:

BJ is running out of breath, excuses and lies for all occasions. And the Brexit blame game must go on

Playing out exactly as I hoped it would. Brexiters of course don't care, they just keep moving the goalposts.

We went from

"Europe needs us, easiest trade deal in history, nothing will change"

to

"Europe needs us, nothing will change, just have the wrong people in charge"

to

"We always wanted to crash out with no deal, it's what we voted for, Boris is king".

In the moment I didn't expect anything else from brexit supporters but history will record it and in the cold light of day these charlatans will be known for what they are.

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59 minutes ago, jonb2 said:

I've argued the problem is here - not anywhere else. That Brexit will do feck-all except make an existing decline much, much faster as there has been no changing of the chocolate soldiers up top. Just shinier wrapping around a shittier product.

Until leavers drop their slave-like admiration of the Brexit cheerleaders and admit these people are just full of shit, either useless or devious connivers - then it will be business as usual after Brexit, but worse.

Clearly I disagree that Brexit will make the decline much faster, when it's disturbing the system under which the current sh1t has grown and thrived.

You frequently equate Brexit with domestic issues and in doing so imply that Leavers think Brexit is a silver bullet to solve all our problems. I've pointed out very often that our own internal problems, many of which are under our control still, are bigger and need sorting but I've also pointed out how that in no way changes my view about Brexit, because that's another issue. Brexit is talked about the most in this particular thread because that's what this thread's for but I think it may be giving you a bit of observation bias when it comes to making conclusions about peoples' overall opinions of the world.

There is no slave-like admiration of Brexit cheerleaders amongst Leavers. This is another mistake you keep repeating, whilst ignoring the elephant in the room of the types of people high among the Remainers - the likes of Tony Blair and Gordon Brown, those who like the current system very much and have used it to bring the UK to where it is now.

Edited by Riedquat

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3 minutes ago, Riedquat said:

There is no slave-like admiration of Brexit cheerleaders amongst Leavers. This is another mistake you keep repeating, whilst ignoring the elephant in the room of the types of people high among the Remainers - the likes of Tony Blair and Gordon Brown, those who like the current system very much and have used it to bring the UK to where it is now.

Yes, there very much is a cult of Boris/Farrage etc. It's there for all to see.

No, I for one do not ignore the crimes of Blair or the stupidity of Brown. I also remember that the roots of their fiscal policy was borrowed from the Neoliberal scumbags Thatcher and Regan, or rather their puppet masters at Goldman Sachs et al.

Never trust a Tory and yes Brown and Blair included.

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10 minutes ago, Chunketh said:

Yes, there very much is a cult of Boris/Farrage etc. It's there for all to see.

There are all sorts of cults, the error is including everyone on the same side of the fence in that cult. I view Farage as an infantile annoyance. Johnson isn't much better although he's not had enough time as PM yet to have said more than a handful of things to really p1ss me off.

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Quote

I have no idea where you are going with this computer models of the economy thing. In my opinion macroeconomic forecasts are about as factual as a tip in the 14.40 at Chesterfield from some guy in a pub.

In fact, The Fundamental Theorem of Asset Pricing is closely related to the concept of Dutch Booking, as observed by every turf accountant. ;)

Edited by zugzwang

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Brexit is going to lead to the UK being run by Washington DC.

Not only will the Orange Baboon tell us what to do, but he also has a whole host of friends based on children's TV characters who will tell us what to do.

Meet Zippy:  https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-49353220

 

No not this one:

2858.jpg?width=620&quality=85&auto=forma

 

Edited by Mikhail Liebenstein

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It looks like BJs honeymoon is over..... thank God, it was doing my head in.

After two weeks of constant BJ propaganda, on all the news channels, the emphasis has changed to resistance to his no deal Brexit rhetoric.

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19 hours ago, Chunketh said:

Untrue and untrue.

There are plenty of folk I know that are remainers and hate Corbyn. I was a natural lib dem but used to support Labor locally, I wont until he is gone and is replaced with someone electable.

There are plenty of folk I know that are remainers and are against brexit because they like being members of the EU. Myself included.

I am sure you can find a few that do satisfy your sweeping generalisation, but it isn't everyone. It's also interesting that the usual "80% of people voted for a party that supports Brexit" argument doesn't fit with this either.

There are also many who have always voted conservative, support the remain side of Tory party and now no longer trust what their true and real EU policy is......Labour is just as split, fish swimming in opposite directions, a boat without a rudder....with regard to the EU those with a view will now vote for a party with a clear defined direction one way or the other.....none of this wishy washy stuff.😉

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4 minutes ago, Bruce Banner said:

It looks like BJs honeymoon is over..... thank God, it was doing my head in.

After two weeks of constant BJ propaganda, on all the news channels, the emphasis has changed to resistance to his no deal Brexit rhetoric.

Agreed.

He is starting to look like May.

The whole Cummings business and creation of the Cabinet of Imbeciles is all posturing that was designed to scare MPs. He knew the EU wouldn't budge. I don't think the bulk of MPs are so stupid as to fall for that.

Time for Parliament to take back control and reassert true British Democracy.

Time to consign the fakeocracy of Boris Johnson and Trump to the landfill.

 

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Corbyn is rapidly becoming my political hero.

If Labour had had a remotely credible and competent leader then Brexit would have been killed off a year ago.

But thanks to this useful idiot the opposition (any opposition) are split and arguing among themselves whilst Rome burns.

You couldnt make this up.

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1 hour ago, winkie said:

There are also many who have always voted conservative, support the remain side of Tory party and now no longer trust what their true and real EU policy is......Labour is just as split, fish swimming in opposite directions, a boat without a rudder....with regard to the EU those with a view will now vote for a party with a clear defined direction one way or the other.....none of this wishy washy stuff.😉

Labour have probably driven me away forever with their fence sitting, wishy washy ways. Oh and Corbyn. I am much more likely to vote LibDem or Green these days. Happily I live in a Lab/Libdem marginal so I suspect we will get a Libdem MP in November.

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1 hour ago, MonsieurCopperCrutch said:

Great to wake up this morning to the news that the U.K. must accept chlorinated chicken and lower food standards for any US trade deal. But yeah taking back control. Idiots. 

You don't have to buy it.  Anyhow, your chlorinated salad (which we already have) will go with it for a healthy touch.

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1 hour ago, MonsieurCopperCrutch said:

Great to wake up this morning to the news that the U.K. must accept chlorinated chicken and lower food standards for any US trade deal. But yeah taking back control. Idiots. 

32jv9d.jpg

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  • 261 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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