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Brexit What Happens Next Thread ---multiple merged threads.


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22 minutes ago, DarkHorseWaits-NoMore said:

When Thatcher claimed that Tony Bliar was her greatest achievement, you know Blue Labour had truely captured true Labour and would no longer represent the countries workers and their interests.

To be fair, leaving the EU frees the UK gov't on state aid regulation that will enable the creation of a joined up nationalised public transport system and likewise a utilities sector free from cartels and paracitic taxpayer subsidies funneled to share holders whilst ramping up huge debts (eg. as with Water and Rail) etc. Too right, I'd vote for that. The corperate interests have captured EU regulation in some areas that is definately not desirable.

Edit: This is a tangable plus on my leaving 'upside' list but sadly the total cost (not just financially) of any Brexit near term is just too high. Much easier to just bend EU rules ?.

 

State Aid is certainly a factor.

 

https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/industry/tvr-factory-construction-delayed-eu-rules

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I do.   https://twitter.com/housepricemania

1409 pages....you guys should have your own forum !!!

Oh OK. Shame that really, but hey it looks like @IMHAL helped us both out. Nice repost though, thanks ! Any thoughts ?  

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22 minutes ago, DarkHorseWaits-NoMore said:

When Thatcher claimed that Tony Bliar was her greatest achievement, you know Blue Labour had truely captured true Labour and would no longer represent the countries workers and their interests.

To be fair, leaving the EU frees the UK gov't on state aid regulation that will enable the creation of a joined up nationalised public transport system and likewise a utilities sector free from cartels and paracitic taxpayer subsidies funneled to share holders whilst ramping up huge debts (eg. as with Water and Rail) etc. Too right, I'd vote for that. The corperate interests have captured EU regulation in some areas that is definately not desirable.

Edit: This is a tangable plus on my leaving 'upside' list but sadly the total cost (not just financially) of any Brexit near term is just too high. Much easier to just bend EU rules ?.

 

State Aid is certainly a factor.

 

https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/industry/tvr-factory-construction-delayed-eu-rules

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58 minutes ago, yelims said:

I will make it extra easy for you since it seems you are a bit slow, fill in the blanks:

As slow as someone who doesn't yet appear to have realised that they can be unrelated issues? It's like the constant "You must support the Tories if you want to leave the EU!" rhetoric from people who don't grasp that it's possible to not want either, that it isn't a question of "here are two sides, pick one."

Personally I think Corbyn would be a disaster.

Edited by Riedquat
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9 minutes ago, Riedquat said:

As slow as someone who doesn't yet appear to have realised that they can be unrelated issues? It's like the constant "You must support the Tories if you want to leave the EU!" rhetoric from people who don't grasp that it's possible to not want either, that it isn't a question of "here are two sides, pick one."

I am trying to understand what exactly is it that UK governments (tories and labour and whoever) are not able to accomplish while remaining a EU member (because brexiteers claim they need independence to reform), still waiting on answers.

Edited by yelims
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It was a $ trillion between 2016 vote and start of this year
https://www.cnbc.com/2019/01/07/brexit-uk-financial-services-sector-moves-1-trillion-in-assets-to-eu.html

who knows how much more is left to move, one of my pensions ( https://www.irishtimes.com/business/financial-services/aviva-moves-9bn-in-assets-to-dublin-amid-intensifying-brexit-uncertainty-1.3793709) is moving to Ireland end of March according letter I received, didnt even know it was held in UK

Edited by yelims
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1 minute ago, what said:

Latest from Germany.

Looks like all Brits will have to sit German exams.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/jan/29/british-pensioners-in-eu-will-lose-nhs-covered-health-care-under-no-deal-brexit

Quote

 

British nationals who have retired to EU countries including Spain and France will no longer have their healthcare covered by the NHS in the event of no Brexit deal, the government has said.

The confirmation will come as a blow to around 190,000 British citizens retired in the EU in places such as the Spanish Costas, Provence in France and Tuscany in Italy.

 

I am sure NHS can cope with extra 190,000 old people with its new found funds, right? right?

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8 minutes ago, yelims said:

It was a $ trillion between 2016 vote and start of this year
https://www.cnbc.com/2019/01/07/brexit-uk-financial-services-sector-moves-1-trillion-in-assets-to-eu.html

who knows how much more is left to move, one of my pensions ( https://www.irishtimes.com/business/financial-services/aviva-moves-9bn-in-assets-to-dublin-amid-intensifying-brexit-uncertainty-1.3793709) is moving to Ireland end of March according letter I received, didnt even know it was held in UK

Recently Barclays move £166b to Ireland, Swiss bank move $33b to Ireland and Bank of America moved $50b to Ireland, every billion helps

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Just now, prozac said:

I am sure we used to pay these countries for health care 

See the end of that article

 

In total, the government paid out about £500m – or £2,300 per pensioner – which he said was significantly lower than the cost of treating pensioners in the UK.

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41 minutes ago, yelims said:

I am trying to understand what exactly is it that UK governments (tories and labour and whoever) are not able to accomplish while remaining a EU member (because brexiteers claim they need independence to reform), still waiting on answers.

You won’t get any answers. Their concerns for reform are simply a front for their xenophobia. They just want less furreners and immigrunts (sic). 

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26 minutes ago, yelims said:

It was a $ trillion between 2016 vote and start of this year
https://www.cnbc.com/2019/01/07/brexit-uk-financial-services-sector-moves-1-trillion-in-assets-to-eu.html

who knows how much more is left to move, one of my pensions ( https://www.irishtimes.com/business/financial-services/aviva-moves-9bn-in-assets-to-dublin-amid-intensifying-brexit-uncertainty-1.3793709) is moving to Ireland end of March according letter I received, didnt even know it was held in UK

Banks in the UK are too big and represent a systemic threat to the whole economy. Banks these days don't support the economy; they speculate in a largely zero sum game that is of no benefit to the economy  and expect to be bailed out when things go wrong. There have been attempts at regulation but these don't go nearly far enough.It seems that Brexit might achieve what regulation could not. 

This is excellent news; let's hope they move a great deal more away to other jurisdictions and become much smaller a result.

One of the many blessings of Brexit.

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https://www.irishtimes.com/business/financial-services/land-grab-could-force-uk-investment-jobs-to-move-to-eu-1.3357157

another $10 trillion is under risk

Quote

The investment-management arms of JPMorgan Chase and Co, Axa and Standard Life Aberdeen are among firms criticising a possible clampdown on mutual funds known as UCITS that are officially EU-based but often managed from elsewhere under a system known as delegation. Such funds oversee about €9.1 trillion. Europe is seeking to ensure that it will continue to have oversight of asset managers, and regulators have warned that “letterbox entities,” nominally based in Europe but managed from abroad, will not be tolerated.

 

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40 minutes ago, yelims said:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/jan/29/british-pensioners-in-eu-will-lose-nhs-covered-health-care-under-no-deal-brexit

I am sure NHS can cope with extra 190,000 old people with its new found funds, right? right?

The Spanish claim the pensioners healthcare costs back from the UK.  They will be milking it.

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8 minutes ago, kzb said:

The Spanish claim the pensioners healthcare costs back from the UK.  They will be milking it.

See the end of that article

 

In total, the government paid out about £500m – or £2,300 per pensioner – which he said was significantly lower than the cost of treating pensioners in the UK.

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3 hours ago, Bruce Banner said:

Philip Lee was just interviewed on Sky News, highly articulate. he makes a compelling case for a 2nd referendum.

PM material?

Awesome. Thank you for sharing such restricted knowledge so comprehensively, and for doing so... so objectively.

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On 16/02/2019 at 11:39, jonb2 said:

Here another hero of Brexit at his best.

He's clearly incredibly selfish, money and self-obsessed. He SHOULD join Farage's new party, but it might not be right wing enough for him. For those that did not know the Brits invented concentration camps, have a look a the second link.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-politics-47247835/jacob-rees-mogg-comments-on-concentration-camps

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_concentration_camps#/media/File:LizzieVanZyl.jpg

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emily_Hobhouse#Conditions_in_the_camps

 

Watched QT this afternoon. I have to say it sounded quite odd, having read around it this now seems a bit disturbing.

It looks like Mogg went to some lengths manufacture this lie and then reeled it off quite casually. Presumably you'd have to research the historical facts and then kind of brainstorm it to see how to warp the truth. To what purpose exactly ?

No challenge of note from from the chair. 

Very Brexit.

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No more of this after brexit...

https://www.ft.com/content/2b79e878-2bc5-11e9-88a4-c32129756dd8

The Ministry of Defence has come under renewed pressure over its decision to put a £1bn contract to build support vessels for the Royal Navy out to international tender amid rising fears of job losses at British shipyards. 

Julian Lewis, the Conservative MP who chairs the House of Commons defence select committee, has written to Stuart Andrew, the minister for defence procurement, asking why the government did not classify the three auxiliary ships as warships. 

Unions and shipbuilders have repeatedly pushed for the vessels, known as fleet solid support (FSS) ships, to be considered as complex warships, which would exempt them from EU laws preventing protectionism.

The MoD said: “We are required by law to procure the Fleet Solid Support ships through open international competition . . . The final decision regarding the winning bid will be made in 2020.”

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Quote

 

Merkel says it's frightening that US considers EU cars national security threat

Merkel expressed her concern that U.S. President Donald Trump might introduce new special trade tariffs on German vehicles as the US Department of Commerce considers imports of European vehicles a national security threat.

A US Commerce Department report has concluded that auto imports threaten national security, setting the stage for possible tariffs by the White House, two people familiar with the matter said Thursday.

Trump has threatened to slap 25 percent duties on European autos, especially targeting Germany, which he says has harmed the American car industry.

dailysabah

 

That's how you prepare your winning negotiation position.

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2 hours ago, yelims said:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/jan/29/british-pensioners-in-eu-will-lose-nhs-covered-health-care-under-no-deal-brexit

I am sure NHS can cope with extra 190,000 old people with its new found funds, right? right?

Cost of foreign visitors to the NHS. A few years old, but nonetheless.  Let's hope this gets reduced. UK has been a soft touch.

 

https://fullfact.org/health/health-tourists-how-much-do-they-cost-and-who-pays/

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3 hours ago, yelims said:

I am trying to understand what exactly is it that UK governments (tories and labour and whoever) are not able to accomplish while remaining a EU member (because brexiters claim they need independence to reform), still waiting on answers.

Off the top of my head I am sure there are others.

Now some of these may not happen but it does not mean they cannot happen.  

This is a list and not an endorsement ?

Conservatives

Reduced payments to EU

Ending freedom of movement and the concept of EU citizenship  (EEA FOM is slightly different in this respect i am told)

Ending the top court being the ECJ

Enter into independent trade deals with other countries and not being part of the customs Union

Avoid bailouts under article 122 if that ever to be the case.

Regain control of fishing waters etc.  Out of CFP CAP etc

not be part of an EU wide refugee settlement programme or at the mercy of another member state unilaterally inviting third country immigrants.

Leave before power are reduced via EU voting reform or financial vetos are removed (has not happened does not mean never will) ie ending the veto.

Avoiding EU army issues.

The UK being a sovereign nation(or more so) once the above taken into account.

Labour

as above +

Ability to start a programme of nationalisation in contravention of single market rules etc

Not being part of the growth and stability pact and being able to run up debts to spend on public sector salaries/nationalisations and infrastructure.



 

Edited by Fromage Frais
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1 hour ago, GrizzlyDave said:

No more of this after brexit...

https://www.ft.com/content/2b79e878-2bc5-11e9-88a4-c32129756dd8

The Ministry of Defence has come under renewed pressure over its decision to put a £1bn contract to build support vessels for the Royal Navy out to international tender amid rising fears of job losses at British shipyards. 

Julian Lewis, the Conservative MP who chairs the House of Commons defence select committee, has written to Stuart Andrew, the minister for defence procurement, asking why the government did not classify the three auxiliary ships as warships. 

Unions and shipbuilders have repeatedly pushed for the vessels, known as fleet solid support (FSS) ships, to be considered as complex warships, which would exempt them from EU laws preventing protectionism.

The MoD said: “We are required by law to procure the Fleet Solid Support ships through open international competition . . . The final decision regarding the winning bid will be made in 2020.”

Very naive to think we'll have a free hand in defence procurement.  It will still be driven by strategic considerations about our alliances.

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