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Victim Of Amazon Scam

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Well guys, I've been scammed on Amazon.

A couple of months ago I ordered a Hard Drive to replace an old one and it got here on time, worked fine etc so I was happy.

Fast forward a month and I decide to check my email account (I have several for various different things, one for shopping, one for signing up to websites, another for work etc) only to discover a few emails from Amazon regarding returns. I open them up and I am puzzled as I have not requested any returns on any items, so I go to my Amazon account and check what is going on. I see there have been two return requests on the Hard Drive I ordered, just 4 days apart from each other, and I am not the one who placed them. The name on the returns is a "Zak" (nothing like my name) who had the replacements sent to an address in Bolton (I am in Gateshead). I immediately contact Amazon about this and after some back and forth they tell me the Fraud team are already looking into my account and I will be notified by them soon. I get an email a day later from them confirming that my account has been accessed by an unauthorized third party and that my password has been reset and any recent changes to the account have been changed back to what they had originally.

So, I assume all will be resolved until today when I get an email from Amazon stating that I have been charged for the replacement hard drives they sent out?!?!

I've been on the phone all morning but I am getting nowhere, all these Indians I have been speaking to have proved absolutely useless, clearly just reading from a card or such in appallingly broken English. My trouble was that they just didn't seem to understand what I was trying to explain to them. I kept asking for someone with better English but just kept getting transferred to other Indians with similarly poor English and being asked the exact same questions in the same order and getting nowhere.

I'm taking an hour break to cool off and get some food down me. If this cannot be resolved and I get stiffed with this £180 bill then Amazon have lost a customer for life.

Here is a description of what the scam is as it has been happening for 4 years now and Amazon still haven't fixed the loopholes.

https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2012/12/amazon_replacem.html

The only difference between that experience and mine is that Amazon are not taking the loss - I am. I have effectively been charged 3 times for 1 product and the fraud is obvious in the order history yet Amazon do nothing about it.

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Well guys, I've been scammed on Amazon.

A couple of months ago I ordered a Hard Drive to replace an old one and it got here on time, worked fine etc so I was happy.

Fast forward a month and I decide to check my email account (I have several for various different things, one for shopping, one for signing up to websites, another for work etc) only to discover a few emails from Amazon regarding returns. I open them up and I am puzzled as I have not requested any returns on any items, so I go to my Amazon account and check what is going on. I see there have been two return requests on the Hard Drive I ordered, just 4 days apart from each other, and I am not the one who placed them. The name on the returns is a "Zak" (nothing like my name) who had the replacements sent to an address in Bolton (I am in Gateshead). I immediately contact Amazon about this and after some back and forth they tell me the Fraud team are already looking into my account and I will be notified by them soon. I get an email a day later from them confirming that my account has been accessed by an unauthorized third party and that my password has been reset and any recent changes to the account have been changed back to what they had originally.

So, I assume all will be resolved until today when I get an email from Amazon stating that I have been charged for the replacement hard drives they sent out?!?!

I've been on the phone all morning but I am getting nowhere, all these Indians I have been speaking to have proved absolutely useless, clearly just reading from a card or such in appallingly broken English. My trouble was that they just didn't seem to understand what I was trying to explain to them. I kept asking for someone with better English but just kept getting transferred to other Indians with similarly poor English and being asked the exact same questions in the same order and getting nowhere.

I'm taking an hour break to cool off and get some food down me. If this cannot be resolved and I get stiffed with this £180 bill then Amazon have lost a customer for life.

Here is a description of what the scam is as it has been happening for 4 years now and Amazon still haven't fixed the loopholes.

https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2012/12/amazon_replacem.html

The only difference between that experience and mine is that Amazon are not taking the loss - I am. I have effectively been charged 3 times for 1 product and the fraud is obvious in the order history yet Amazon do nothing about it.

Mail Jeff Bezos direct - jeff@amazon.com. Apparently he has people to read all of his emails and tends to respond to customer service complaints.

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The only difference between that experience and mine is that Amazon are not taking the loss

Um, doesn't look like the only difference to me. You wrote:

I get an email a day later from them confirming that my account has been accessed by an unauthorized third party and that my password has been reset

An account that has been accessed (which didn't happen in the story you reference) is much more likely to be your error.

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The only difference between that experience and mine is that Amazon are not taking the loss - I am. I have effectively been charged 3 times for 1 product and the fraud is obvious in the order history yet Amazon do nothing about it.

How did you pay? Credit Card?

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Somehow the hacker had access to your email and was able to reset the password... (Click the link in the reset password email)

You need to explore how that occurred as it may not be the only account you are going to have trouble with......

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Debit Card

Raise a charge-back with the debit card company. Simply say you did not authorize the transactions and as such are not in receipt of the goods you have been charged for.

The obligation will be on Amazon to prove you purchased the goods, and provide evidence that you have done. As it was a customer not present transaction there is little they can provide.

Verified by visa passwords went a little way down this track but are still not as good as customer being present and entering the pin number.

TBH I doubt Amazon will even contest it as they don't have a leg to stand on......

I have a merchant services account and was scammed once to the tune of £120.00. I was telephoned for a product which was paid for by visa debit card and told the item would be collected. All the data matched and the payment went through.

About three Months later I get a letter from dispute resolution (all the card companies use the same people) saying the transaction was fraudulent and that it had been reversed. They grabbed back £120.00 from card payments in the system owed with not so much as a by your leave. Happened in fact when I checked it out two days before I received the letter.

There was an appeal procedure in the letter but you had to provide signed receipts of proof of purchase which had to marry up with the card holders information. The transaction was clearly fraud so the merchant does not have a leg to stand on.

In fact pretty much the only protection they have these days is he customer being present and entering the secret pin number.

We obviously learnt from the mistake and no longer take orders for collection on a card number, cash only these days.

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I've been browsing how this scam is done and it is supposedly very easy if you have a knack for what they call "Social Engineering". Basically through a series of phone calls the hacker tricks customer service reps into dishing out details of the account. All they need is the order number to get started, from there they can get your email address and the rest is easy. It's worrying to say the least.

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A charge-back sounds like the right answer here.

If it appears that the card might be charged again then tell the bank when you call and ask if they can prevent that/issue you with a new card.

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Raise a charge-back with the debit card company. Simply say you did not authorize the transactions and as such are not in receipt of the goods you have been charged for.

The obligation will be on Amazon to prove you purchased the goods, and provide evidence that you have done. As it was a customer not present transaction there is little they can provide.

Verified by visa passwords went a little way down this track but are still not as good as customer being present and entering the pin number.

TBH I doubt Amazon will even contest it as they don't have a leg to stand on......

I have a merchant services account and was scammed once to the tune of £120.00. I was telephoned for a product which was paid for by visa debit card and told the item would be collected. All the data matched and the payment went through.

About three Months later I get a letter from dispute resolution (all the card companies use the same people) saying the transaction was fraudulent and that it had been reversed. They grabbed back £120.00 from card payments in the system owed with not so much as a by your leave. Happened in fact when I checked it out two days before I received the letter.

There was an appeal procedure in the letter but you had to provide signed receipts of proof of purchase which had to marry up with the card holders information. The transaction was clearly fraud so the merchant does not have a leg to stand on.

In fact pretty much the only protection they have these days is he customer being present and entering the secret pin number.

We obviously learnt from the mistake and no longer take orders for collection on a card number, cash only these days.

I recall that Screwfix gets you to enter your pin if you pick something up from the store.

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Mail Jeff Bezos direct - jeff@amazon.com. Apparently he has people to read all of his emails and tends to respond to customer service complaints.

The email for the UK boss is floating around the internet also.

There is a risk with the chargeback you may find yourself blocked from Amazon.

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UPDATE

Amazon are completely incompetent.

12 service reps have assured me everything is fine, that the charges will be reversed and no further charges will be made. Well they have not refunded anything and today I just got a new charge.

I have emails confirming that I am not liable for any charges from Amazon regarding these dodgy returns and yet I am getting emails from them saying the opposite. There just seems to be little to no communication at all amongst departments and staff. Everytime I have contacted them I have had to provide all the details again and again as they can never find any records of a dispute. I don't know what the feck is going on, Amazon don't keep records?!?! I get that they are a huge company but that is no excuse for sloppy archiving.

Seems I am down to the final straw, the Police are getting involved, I am gonna go the chargeback route as Mark suggested. Whatever happens, happens. I am not gonna sit back and let them raid my bank account over this, I will not go down without fighting tooth and nail.

Given the level of incompetence I have suffered, I will never be using Amazon ever again. They have lost a customer for life and also a potential Seller (was about to expand my business to selling items on Amazon marketplace).

Is this what happens to companies when they outsource everything? I really cannot believe how poor the customer service is. If TrustPilot allowed it I would give them a minus 10 out of 10. Shocking. Really, really shocking.

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Was it a new hard drive or could it have contained some dodgy data mining software?

It was for a Playstation 4, not a PC.

Basically what has happened is that someone called up pretending to be me and asked the service rep to send him a list of recent transaction reference numbers. Next, the fraudster hung up and called again, this time getting through to someone else. They complained that order number "xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx" arrived broken and that it was supposed to be a gift for a friend. The fraudster tells the Rep to send a replacement to supposed "friends home" which in reality is a forwarding address (Offshore LTD company owns the home, forwards all mail to another address to hide the papertrail). A few days later the fraudster calls again, gives the order number again and requests another replacement be sent out to the forwarding address. Now Amazon is different to most companies in that they do not demand return of faulty goods before issuing replacements or refunds, they send out replacements immediately and ask you to return faulty goods within a month.

So at the end of the day the situation is this:

I still have original order as it worked fine.

Fraudster has 2 Hard Drives.

I am stiffed with the bill for the harddrive I own since I never returned it, the 1st replacement harddrive since that was supposed to be returned as faulty, and the replacement that was sent out.

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You aren't stiffed with anything, it's Amazon that has behaved carelessly so they have to bear the loss. If Amazon doesn't voluntarily refund you the second charge then your CC company or your Bank definitely will have to. Amazon has to prove that you placed the 'replacement' orders, not you that you didn't.

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Was the original order direct with Amazon or with a 3rd party seller?

Most of the scams/problems seem to be with 3rd party merchants and I don't think Amazon give anything like the same level of after sales support.

Of course some of those third party sellers are quite big companies, bookshops etc but a lot are dicey little outfits based in 3rd world countries. Unlike ebay Amazon don't make any serious effort to collect feedback about how good or bad their 3rd party sellers are.

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You've already made Amazon aware of what is going on and they haven't acted.

Give your bank a call. They should be helpful and do the work for you.

You simply need to say that the transactions are fraudulent and were not authorised by you; please charge them back and block the merchant. This means you won't be able to order from Amazon again with that card but it doesn't sound like that's a big deal given what has happened.

They'll ask which transactions and take the details and put the process in motion.

You may receive a form in the post to sign. In a short space of time the money should be back in your account and that should be the end of it.

The final ignominy may come in the form of a stroppy letter from Amazon's legal department about your charge-backs. That shouldn't happen if they connect the communications together; they should simply suck up the loss.

In the event that they do get in touch with you in this manner then I'd suggest that there are avenues to pursue which will put this incident in a more public light that they would not like.

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Another Amazon scam. The unwanted parcel.

After a week-end away, a neighbour popped an Amazon parcel round.

So I was left thinking, I must have had something delayed and forgotten about it perhaps?

But no, it was addressed to our house, but to someone else.

So I did the correct thing and arranged for them to pick it up.

I'd had them muddle a parcel up some years ago, so just thought it was an another IT issue.

Then when I checked my credit card statement, there was a large Amazon transaction and a small refund.

The first two calls got me nowhere, but through the 'broken English' it seems the 'other' account was credited with vouchers. I don't think I was supposed to be told that.

At the third call I finally spoke to a native speaker, who said he'd escalate things.

And a few hours later I get an email, saying that during a routine review Amazon noticed my card had been added to another account which they have now suspended. Really, nothing to do with the three phone calls then. They went on to say I should report my card stolen and report it to the Police.

I'd cancelled the card straight away anyway, and there were no other dodgy transactions.

So was my card skimmed? Anything is possible I suppose? Or maybe it is an inside job.

Due to the difference in the order and the refund, I suspect that the 'other' account was set up with my address. They then placed an order to be sent here, to make it look legit, with the bulk going elsewhere (or perhaps the rest was just vouchers?). But you'd think and other deliveries or vouchers would be traceable.

The fraud forms from the c-card company turned up today, so tomorrow I'll initiate the reclaim process.

Amazon clearly have no idea how to treat their customers and don't take security seriously at all.

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Another Amazon scam. The unwanted parcel.

Amazon clearly have no idea how to treat their customers and don't take security seriously at all.

Why should they when the cc companies carry the can?

Awesome business model

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